Nelson Mandela speaks out
- Thread starter Czar
- Start date
I don't agree with Mandela on stating that the U.S.'s aggression towards to the U.N. lately is racial, but he does make some good points, especially when it comes to Cheney and Ashcroft running the show and Bush being a puppet. I also though he was surprisingly candid, which is always a good thing 
Everything that is critical of the US is a must read to you czar but you are right. It was very interesting to read that Mandela has decided that this is a racial issue. I'd type more but I'm laughing too hard.
I didn't know that Iraq was a black country. Other than that it was interesting. Oh, and the part about Cheany opposing his release from prison... talk about a decision coming back to bite you in the butt.
So you see this as a racial question?
Well, that element is there. In fact, many people say quietly, but they don?t have the courage to stand up and say publicly, that when there were white secretary generals you didn?t find this question of the United States and Britain going out of the United Nations. But now that you?ve had black secretary generals like Boutros Boutros Ghali, like Kofi Annan, they do not respect the United Nations. They have contempt for it. This is not my view, but that is what is being said by many people.
Yes, keep laughing...
Oh, and I haven't heard this before, Dick Cheney was one of the few people in Congress who opposed releasing Mandela from prison.
Well, that element is there. In fact, many people say quietly, but they don?t have the courage to stand up and say publicly, that when there were white secretary generals you didn?t find this question of the United States and Britain going out of the United Nations. But now that you?ve had black secretary generals like Boutros Boutros Ghali, like Kofi Annan, they do not respect the United Nations. They have contempt for it. This is not my view, but that is what is being said by many people.
Yes, keep laughing...
Oh, and I haven't heard this before, Dick Cheney was one of the few people in Congress who opposed releasing Mandela from prison.
I have to agree, he was slanted in to many ways. He made a few decent points, but negated them with redoric such as Ridder whose objectivness after all this time has flipflopped no less than two times since he was last in the country. His assessments are meaningless at this point. He (Mandella) must also be misinformed or disinformed on several issues, but that's not uncommon. IMHO we're making/taking steps in the right direction the last several days with the UN and other countries agreeing that Saddam has been in direct conflict with resolutions mandated by the UN itself for way to long now and gone unfettered to develope what it wants. I say tell Saddam point blank......you have X amount of time to allow inspectors complete access, or, you are admitting you have and are developing WMD.
XMan
Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 12,513
- 49
- 91
Yeah, and you post everything remotely negative about America that you can find. What do you expect, Czar? We love our country warts and all, and you go out of your way to piss on it. Do you expect us to be your best friends, to invite you over for fondue or go out drinking with you? I don't f*ckin' think so.
Originally posted by: Czar
how am I not surprised, you shoot down everyone who doesnt agree with you no matter who they are
What the picture at the top of the article doesn't show is Aziz's hand in Mandela's back. To somehow portray this as some sort of racial thing is ludicrous at best.
Clearly Azziz's hand is in ol' Nelson's back in attempt to divide this up any way possible racial, religous, ethnic, whatever. It's too bad really. Mandela fought the good fight and perservered. It's a shame to see him getting played this way. Maybe it's his age. Anyone who thinks that this is about race is fuckin' retard (which explains why czar posted it).
first, mandela is wrong on all claims of american culpability in afghanistan's disintegration and the iranian revolution - and that was
the strongest part of his spiel. he then takes a walk on the far side of sanity when he introduces race.
on one level - a very base one at that - you can understand his polarized view. having endured decades of oppresive rule, witness to
countless acts of injustice, and many personal cruelties, he naturally and reflexively suspects the reigning powers as the cause of all ill
regardless of mitigating circumstances.
the strongest part of his spiel. he then takes a walk on the far side of sanity when he introduces race.
on one level - a very base one at that - you can understand his polarized view. having endured decades of oppresive rule, witness to
countless acts of injustice, and many personal cruelties, he naturally and reflexively suspects the reigning powers as the cause of all ill
regardless of mitigating circumstances.
oh do I? if I would post every news article that some people here would call "anti-american" then I would be competing with nfs4 as being the top poster on the forum.
I post a few of those news articles to put a little bit of balance in the war chant that comes from so many members, now please to try broaden your perspective.
Hmm, but lets think about this for a second Czar.............I mean realisticlly.....you're posting this the day before the anniversery of a disaster which killed near 3000 US citizens right. You are also posting this to a forum located and based in the US and probably has somewhere around 85% US members. Then, the interview makes a few valid points perhaps but is mostly totally irrelevant redoric. I mean come on....do you REALLY consider this a race issue?????
Read the latest news.........we ARE going through the UN and asking input from many, many countries whom seem to be agreeing that Saddam IS breaking the agreements set forth after the Gulf War and has gone on unrestricted for far to long. What's wrong with setting a date for full access to inspect whether he is developing WMD??? If he isn't, GWB and the US look like fools right.........so let them in Saddam and we'll see! 
Jeff7
Lifer
- Jan 4, 2001
- 41,596
- 19
- 81
Well said. Kind of sad too isn't it.
I just don't get why we go against the UN so much. We're one country. The point of the UN is that the nations are UNITED - working together. If we don't agree, then we should make that known at the UN meetings, but we should not go behind their backs, or against their majority rule. We always talk about our wonderful democracy here, yet when there's a democracy at work elsewhere and we don't like it, watch out. What would happen in this country if one of the states would just decide that it doesn't like, uh, Germany's policies, and it uses its militia or whatever to attack Germany. Would that be ok with all the other member states in the country?
Funny, yet true? quote from Futurama:
Leela: "One of these two men will become president of Earth."
Fry: "What do we care. We live in the United States."
Leela: "The United States is part of the world."
Fry: "Wow, I have been gone a long time."
I saw nothing but profound humility and deep love and respect for truth. Ass to the matter of race that is a difficult question to analyze. As a non distinct type for my cultural milieu, I have not been sensitized to race in any meaningful way like those who have lived the full brunt of it. My ability to detect racism, my understanding of what sensitized individuals call racism is, I think, beyond my ken. Clearly Iraqis are not black, but Mandela may see in the way we treat them, as Arab, as foreign, as enemy, all the hallmarks of racism. At any rate, it was an excellent article about somebody who is a giant.
well, race, no, thats kinda weird from our perspective but from someone who has seen racism like Nelson Mandela then its not surprising that he brings this up. I actually posted this yesterday because thats the day when I read it and I found it very interesting because it was Nelson Mandela, like Moonbeam said a giant.Originally posted by: ToBeMe
Hmm, but lets think about this for a second Czar.............I mean realisticlly.....you're posting this the day before the anniversery of a disaster which killed near 3000 US citizens right. You are also posting this to a forum located and based in the US and probably has somewhere around 85% US members. Then, the interview makes a few valid points perhaps but is mostly totally irrelevant redoric. I mean come on....do you REALLY consider this a race issue?????
What can I say, I like this forum but I'm spending less and less time on off topic because of the war chanting people, not exactly because of them but because of the very few numbers who say anything against them.
Anyway, I dont belive its a race issue at all but there is still a pattern there but I think its more of a coincidence than anything else.
The US isnt exactly going through the UN, they are doing it forcefully and in the end it seems that the outcome of a UN decision doesnt matter at all. I personaly am all for a UN inspection team going back to Iraq and that along with somesortof an end to the embargo and a chance for Iraq to build themselves up socialy is a must. link
He does make several good points, but the one thing he's 100% wrong is the race-issue. This thing has nothing to do with race IMO.
Originally posted by: Czar
well, race, no, thats kinda weird from our perspective but from someone who has seen racism like Nelson Mandela then its not surprising that he brings this up. I actually posted this yesterday because thats the day when I read it and I found it very interesting because it was Nelson Mandela, like Moonbeam said a giant. What can I say, I like this forum but I'm spending less and less time on off topic because of the war chanting people, not exactly because of them but because of the very few numbers who say anything against them. Anyway, I dont belive its a race issue at all but there is still a pattern there but I think its more of a coincidence than anything else. The US isnt exactly going through the UN, they are doing it forcefully and in the end it seems that the outcome of a UN decision doesnt matter at all. I personaly am all for a UN inspection team going back to Iraq and that along with somesortof an end to the embargo and a chance for Iraq to build themselves up socialy is a must. linkOriginally posted by: ToBeMe Hmm, but lets think about this for a second Czar.............I mean realisticlly.....you're posting this the day before the anniversery of a disaster which killed near 3000 US citizens right. You are also posting this to a forum located and based in the US and probably has somewhere around 85% US members. Then, the interview makes a few valid points perhaps but is mostly totally irrelevant redoric. I mean come on....do you REALLY consider this a race issue?????
Czar you need to come out of your liberal dream world. "...a chance for Iraq to build itself up..." Are you on crack? Hussain would never let that happen. It would threaten his power base. This guy is a nothing short of a modern day Hitler. Who do you think an embargo would hurt? Sure the hell not Saddam.
Sure why not, the food for oil program was a very good efford to help but too bad it went all bad because of lack of support from the UN.
About the embargo, I agree, it hurts everyone there but Saddam and his friends, thats why the embargo must end if there is going to be an improvement there.
The ONLY way Iraq will ever get into the 20th century(yes I know it is the 21st century) is if Saddam is killed and a new goverment is installed.. There is no way around it.
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