Negative campaigning and this forum

[retrospooty]

I have noticed that much like McCains ads, this forum is plastered with threads bashing Obama, much of which is untrue, and innuendo... all from a small cast of right slanted regulars... Is there really nothing positive that the McCain campaign has to offer that it has to be all negative (and mostly trumped up)? Are there no issues he wins debates on? The man has been in washington 25+ years, he must have something to offer?

 

[Juddog]

Originally posted by: retrospooty
I have noticed that much like McCains ads, this forum is plastered with threads bashing Obama, much of which is untrue, and innuendo... all from a small cast of right slanted regulars... Is there really nothing positive that the McCain campaign has to offer that it has to be all negative (and mostly trumped up)? Are there no issues he wins debates on? The man has been in washington 25+ years, he must have something to offer?

There is a reason people call him McSame - if you want to see what he has to offer, one has to merely examine the Bush administration over the past 8 years and think 4 years more of the same.

 

[Genx87]

A wrench in the system. That is about the best argument I can come up with to convince you to vote for McCain. His latest antics are making it hard to find any other reason.

We didnt like what a rubberstamp did under Bush. Why do it the other way?

 

[yowolabi]

Originally posted by: Juddog

Originally posted by: retrospooty
I have noticed that much like McCains ads, this forum is plastered with threads bashing Obama, much of which is untrue, and innuendo... all from a small cast of right slanted regulars... Is there really nothing positive that the McCain campaign has to offer that it has to be all negative (and mostly trumped up)? Are there no issues he wins debates on? The man has been in washington 25+ years, he must have something to offer?

There is a reason people call him McSame - if you want to see what he has to offer, one has to merely examine the Bush administration over the past 8 years and think 4 years more of the same.

In all fairness, I don't think McCain would be as bad as Bush. I don't think his warmongering advisors could convince him to start a war for no reason as easily.

Not exactly a ringing endorsement, but there you have it.

"McCain, many of the same policies as Bush, but not as stupid and gullible"

 

[SP33Demon]

The only things I like about McCain are his "no drilling in ANWR" stance and that he WAS against more government spending (but that changed after he introduced the 300billion mortgage spending plan at the last debate).

Also like that he's opposed to the windfall tax on oil companies which is one of the main things I'm adamently against by Obama.

Everything else about McCain I disagree with (increasing troops in Iraq, his healthcare plan, punishing (embargo) countries before speaking with them diplomatically, aforementioned 300 billion $ mortgage plan, his vice presidential pick, etc).

 

[Corbett]

Here is your answer.

Vote for McCain if you want :

- lower taxes
- smaller government
- true reform of government
- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so
- foreign policy experience
- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly
- conservative supreme court justices
- EXPERIENCE

 

[Lemon law]

Maybe I am too partisan a dem to even see one area where McCain is clearly superior to Obama, but certainly Washington experience might be one area.

But, speaking as a democrats, McCain is clearly superior to GWB, and I do not think McCain will buy into Neocon mythology. McCain is pragmatic enough to demand results and will pull the plug on strategies that don't work. And with McCain, I think the GOP has run a basically honest man for a change, and McCain will put the country ahead of his own short terms gains. I can say quite honestly that I have a visceral hate of much of GWB&co., but I cannot find any good reasons to hate John McCain.

And I can also feel a lot of sympathy for McCain, he has been used and abused by the GOP, and has had to make a lot of unfortunate deals with the devil to get his parties nomination. Left to his own devices, McCain would be a far better man. I have my own doubts about Obama also, but its the only honest answer I can give to the OP. Think for yourself and ignore the too partisan on either side, after all, you are not going to get perfection, the human race is incapable of that, you are voting for the lesser of two evils.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Have you visited his website? His stance on many issues is there for your edification.

 

[Juddog]

Originally posted by: Corbett
Here is your answer.

Vote for McCain if you want :

- lower taxes

If you're rich

- smaller government

ROFL! Nothing needs to be said of this idiotic remark other than look at the past 8 years - has government gotten smaller?

- true reform of government

Yeah - reform of government so that the executive branch has even more power than they already do.

- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so

ROFL again, you mean like when he reached across party lines to work on the bailout package?

- foreign policy experience

First actual reason so far

- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly

If you don't mind US occupation for another 10 - 100 years

- conservative supreme court justices

Wow, yet another actual point.

EXPERIENCE

Yes McSame is old enough to be your great grandfather. 3 actual points out of 8, keep it up and you may reach a post with 50 % truth yet.

 

[bamacre]

No one can make a case for either of these schmucks without bashing the other.

 

[ProfJohn]

Jud is the reason that people don't waste their time trying to be positive.

Much easier to rip the other guy apart.

 

[CPA]

Let's see:

He wants to finally put an end to illegal immigration.....oops, nope he wants amnesty
He wants to allow the markets and housing to correct themselves.....oops, nope he wants government bailout and executive compensation limits
He does not want universal healthcare.....oops, but he wants to give everyone tax credits to purchase healthcare
He wants to become energy independent.....oops, doesn't want to open up drilling other than a few offshore areas

These kind of things are making it hard for me to offset with the things that I do agree with him on:

Increase nuclear power plants
Expand death penalty and stricter sentencing, no more hate laws
Pro-life
School vouchers
Don't hold gun manufacturers and citizens liable to criminals


Well, I wish I could provide enough to convince you, but McCain is making it hard for me to vote for him.

 

[eleison]

Originally posted by: Corbett
Here is your answer.

Vote for McCain if you want :

- lower taxes
- smaller government
- true reform of government
- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so
- foreign policy experience
- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly
- conservative supreme court justices
- EXPERIENCE

Wow, thats pretty good. I'm impressed.

Voting for Obama is almost the opposite:

- higher taxes
- bigger government (more social programs)
- no real reform expect the democrats are now in charge (Obama voted w/democrat virtual all the time)
- someone who did not reach across party lines
- no foreign policy experience
- will end the Iraq war with an explicit timetable
- liberal, activist (legislating from the bench) supreme court justices
- NO EXPERIENCE

Looks like its going to be another Jimmy Carter 4 years...

 

[ProfJohn]

1. He has a history of working with Democrats on big issues.
2. He does have a history as a reforming and is far more 'anti-Washington' than Obama.
3. He has a history of fighting against wasteful spending.

 

[Juddog]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Jud is the reason that people don't waste their time trying to be positive.

Much easier to rip the other guy apart.

Yeah - a well known Republican strategy that has worked well for the past two elections.

 

[Atreus21]

Originally posted by: retrospooty
I have noticed that much like McCains ads, this forum is plastered with threads bashing Obama, much of which is untrue, and innuendo... all from a small cast of right slanted regulars... Is there really nothing positive that the McCain campaign has to offer that it has to be all negative (and mostly trumped up)? Are there no issues he wins debates on? The man has been in washington 25+ years, he must have something to offer?

Well, first of all, understand that Obama lacks similar qualification which you seek from McCain. Like 2004, this is an election of, "not the other guy."

I don't think I can qualify McCain to you sufficiently by argument. I can tell you why I'm voting for him.

I'm voting for McCain because of my worldview. I believe America, despite its faults, is the good guy. I believe we have enemies that wish us ill, and will act on these wishes.

I believe that Americans are too complacent. We take freedom for granted. We are not humble in the face of the fact that freedom comes at a price, paid for in blood.

I think McCain, a war veteran, understands this, and Obama does not. I think Obama believes America is a dubious benefactor, fundamentally faulted; faulted at its foundation, with some happy circumstantial beneficence purely by accident. McCain, on the other hand, believes we have a sound foundation, with accidental missteps.

Men's minds are not ruled by logic, or reason, but by general impressions. This is my general impression of these two men.

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
1. He has a history of working with Democrats on big issues.

I don't see that as a good thing.

2. He does have a history as a reforming and is far more 'anti-Washington' than Obama.

That doesn't say much.

3. He has a history of fighting against wasteful spending.

Yeah, except for that whole Iraq war thing, which he STILL can't admit was a mistake.

 

[winnar111]

Nukular power!

 

[KB]

Hes not as dumb as Bush! (not saying much) He has asked for significantly less earmarks than any other candidate. (24 years of service and this was all the earmarks the left could find for him: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/01/06/mccain-earmark/)

My favorite SNL quote: He will get "Mavericky" on congress.

 

[Tab]

If you want eight more years of the same policy, sure.

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: Corbett
Here is your answer.

Vote for McCain if you want :

- lower taxes
- smaller government
- true reform of government
- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so
- foreign policy experience
- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly
- conservative supreme court justices
- EXPERIENCE

Thanks, those are at least real reasons. I dont agree with all of them, but its real.

- lower taxes (only for the Rich)
- smaller government (perhaps)
- true reform of government (I dont see that happening with all of the lobbyists on his staff)
- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so (true)
- foreign policy experience (I am not impressed with this. He appears to have been wrong on almost all decisions)
- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly (Obama plans to do that, staying and paying is irresponsible. Allowing Iraq to police themselves is responsible to me)
- conservative supreme court justices (my opinion, but - ICK!)
- EXPERIENCE (True, but not primary concern, as no-one has presidential experience until they are in it)

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: eleison

Originally posted by: Corbett
Here is your answer.

Vote for McCain if you want :

- lower taxes
- smaller government
- true reform of government
- someone who reached across party lines and has a track record of doing so
- foreign policy experience
- someone who will end the Iraq war responsibly
- conservative supreme court justices
- EXPERIENCE

Wow, thats pretty good. I'm impressed.

Voting for Obama is almost the opposite:

- higher taxes
- bigger government (more social programs)
- no real reform expect the democrats are now in charge (Obama voted w/democrat virtual all the time)
- someone who did not reach across party lines
- no foreign policy experience
- will end the Iraq war with an explicit timetable
- liberal, activist (legislating from the bench) supreme court justices
- NO EXPERIENCE

Looks like its going to be another Jimmy Carter 4 years...

You 2 can't possibly be this stupid. No, wait, I already know you are.

 

[jpeyton]

McCain's campaign lies about the size of the crowd at his latest rally; reports a figure over double the estimated size by city officials.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: Genx87
A wrench in the system. That is about the best argument I can come up with to convince you to vote for McCain. His latest antics are making it hard to find any other reason.

We didnt like what a rubberstamp did under Bush. Why do it the other way?

Yep

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: Lemon law
Maybe I am too partisan a dem to even see one area where McCain is clearly superior to Obama, but certainly Washington experience might be one area.

But, speaking as a democrats, McCain is clearly superior to GWB, and I do not think McCain will buy into Neocon mythology. McCain is pragmatic enough to demand results and will pull the plug on strategies that don't work. And with McCain, I think the GOP has run a basically honest man for a change, and McCain will put the country ahead of his own short terms gains. I can say quite honestly that I have a visceral hate of much of GWB&co., but I cannot find any good reasons to hate John McCain.

And I can also feel a lot of sympathy for McCain, he has been used and abused by the GOP, and has had to make a lot of unfortunate deals with the devil to get his parties nomination. Left to his own devices, McCain would be a far better man. I have my own doubts about Obama also, but its the only honest answer I can give to the OP. Think for yourself and ignore the too partisan on either side, after all, you are not going to get perfection, the human race is incapable of that, you are voting for the lesser of two evils.

It's refreshing to see an Obama supporter on this board look at things objectively.

Good post :thumbsup: