Need some help... CPU/Motherboard on a budget

[SNiPeRX]

I am currently using a 939 system dual core. Not bad but to be honest everyone is always talking about the intel solutions so I am interested what I can do for the lowest money.

What I am looking for is this

Cheap system with great overclocking potential.
All I will need is CPU/motherboard/RAM.
AMD and Intel systems of course, but please be honest with me and tell me whats best for the money and overclocking. I am looking for the biggest bang for the buck.

My video card is still decent 1900xt and sound is X Fi xtreme music.

Give me some good options please and be honest what is best for overclocking and the money. Also a future upgrade solution on the processor would be nice. Thanks

 

[o1die]

Your video card is the achiles heel of your system. Best to get an 8800gt first before a new cpu/board if you're on a budget. The e8400 is popular now, but the price is too high; it's not a good deal in my opinion. I still use a single core 939; am waiting for the Intel nehalem socket change next year.

 

[SNiPeRX]

you really think getting a 8800gt like this one with the 70 mail in rebate, would be my best bet?

My current setup is

AMD x2 3800
2gig ram
1900gt

I have been looking at the Intel E2180 thinking it might be a great upgrade as well.... i really don't know what is best, CPU/mobo/ram, or video card upgrade.

 

[ccgenerals]

e2160 + ABIT IP35-E?

 

[TheJian]

Originally posted by: SNiPeRX
I am currently using a 939 system dual core. Not bad but to be honest everyone is always talking about the intel solutions so I am interested what I can do for the lowest money.

What I am looking for is this

Cheap system with great overclocking potential.
All I will need is CPU/motherboard/RAM.
AMD and Intel systems of course, but please be honest with me and tell me whats best for the money and overclocking. I am looking for the biggest bang for the buck.

My video card is still decent 1900xt and sound is X Fi xtreme music.

Give me some good options please and be honest what is best for overclocking and the money. Also a future upgrade solution on the processor would be nice. Thanks

Depends on the vid card. Is this an AGP or did you get lucky on the tail end of 939 with PCIE?

Also give us a budget. Other than that I'd say this (with newegg as an example since all can be had there):
1. Gigabyte P35-DS3L $90
2. Adata/Mushkin/Gskill 4GB (2x2GB) $83 (free ship) cas5 5-5-5-18 1.8 (no world records but 900mhz or so).
3. Intel 2160. $70 Easy 3ghz on 1333fsb, nothing overclocked but the cpu. Best way to OC.
4. AGP card?? Get the other posters card. Hard to argue with $162 after rebate (inc ship). Though the warranty probably sucks, I'd spend another $27 for near silence with the MSI 8800GT OC edition (660gpu/1900 mem vs 600/1800 defaults). 8% or so faster and quiet for sure. I know, I own one.

On a total poor mans budget Abit IP35-E motherboard. $59 after rebate. But the Gigabyte is all solid caps. etc. Better board and no fear of going out of business.

With the memory just make sure it doesn't say more than 1.9v required to reach 800 cas 5. I prefer 5-5-5-18 or 5-5-5-15 at 1.8. 1.9 is TOPS. Otherwise your memory is old crappy kind or poorly binned chips that are already overclocked/overvolted to get to the advertised speed. Obviously if the memory says 4-4-4-12 2.0-2.2 or something you can probably run at jedec speeds (5-5-5-18 if memory serves) at 800mhz at 1.8. Avoid Cas6. No point in slowing down when others can do cas5. No memory without a heatsink either. If you need 2gb to save money use the same advice above.

I can't see a better combo out there. I just built 2 with the same stuff (one with Adata, the other with Gskill both worked in the DS3L). That's about it.

 

[Winterpool]

As always, it would help if one could define the parameters of 'cheap' and 'on a budget'. They mean quite different things to a semi-employed layabout (eg myself) and a Type A investment banker earning six figures -- not just in terms of $, but in terms of the value of time (banker has lots of $, relatively little time to tinker and test).

I presume if you're a system builder you know how painful it can be when confronted with a bunch of components that simply will not work together... isolating the wonky part can be a long and frustrating process (which is why I presume New York and Silicon Valley professionals often just buy outright something like Alienware, the HP Blackbird, etc -- time+blood pressure > money for them). Can one buy peace of mind through superior brands, 'pro' or 'de luxe' versions, etc?

I've very little money right now (see 'semi-employed layabout' above). In fact, at this point I'm going into debt to complete my system. I'm just sick and tired of waiting to save up enough for a decent system: I'm running a Barton (Athlon XP 2500+) right now with an ATi Radeon 9600 XT. (I'm doing my part to get us out of recession, Uncle Sam!) Presuming your budget is similar to mine (ie minimal), you may find my experiences helpful.

First, I'm trying to buy qualite when possible, but on sale, after rebate, etc. For example I bought the $100 retail Antec Neo HE 500W power supply for $35 after coupon and rebate. If I can't afford that, then I try for recognised good values. Many of you won't be surprised to learn I bought the Abit IP35-E last night ($90 - $30 rebate, free postage code). But if you want to overclock significantly, you might want to spend a little more on the board and memory. Though it seems safe to buy a 'budget' P35 board like the Abit or the Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L, if you don't require too many extras. And right now it's even possible to buy a pretty well-equipped ASUS P5K-E for only $115 (I gave this last serious consideration, as I do want FireWire eventually).

Good motherboards and memory are cheap right now, but buying a good cpu is a more problematic enterprise. We're at an awkward juncture, poised between Conroes and Wolfdales. Many Wolfdales have been 'released', but real-world volumes are very low, and current prices are frightfully high (25 per cent or more above realistic retail). The E8400 is the poster boy for this phenomenon: its tray price is only $183, I believe; initial retail prices were about $190; and now you'll be lucky to find it for $250 total.

One can presume that Penryn chips should become more readily available and drop in price soon. At which point remaining Conroe (and Allendale) chips should drop precipitously. The problem is, well, when is 'soon'? I've bought everything except the cpu now, and I really want to get my system built at last. But I'll feel like an utter fool if I buy a $250 Wolfdale (or even a $76 E2180), if sub-$200 E8400s appear next month. I'm trying to wait for affordable Wolfdales, but if nothing shows up by April, then I suspect I'll get a Pentium E2180 or similar chip to tide me over.

 

[Winterpool]

To be a little more specific, many would agree with me in recommending the Abit IP35-E (see links in my previous post) as the ultimate best-value P35 board right now ($60). If you need additional features (ICH9R southbridge, FireWire, eSATA, better audio chip), take a look at the ASUS P5K-E. Ach, it looks like they raised the price $5, but $119 is still a good deal for this board.

For a cpu, if you want to spend the minimal amount, you could get a 'Pentium' E2180 for about $60 (OEM) to $80+. The ClubIT deal linked previously is, I think, the best retail deal. Since you already have an X2 3800+, I'm not sure this is such a great upgrade, unless you seriously overclock the Pentium (many do obtain 3+ GHz; default is 2 GHz).

The best 'value' overall would probably be an E8400 close to the original $190 retail price. It's a wonderful chip at the default 3 GHz speed, and the Penryns also overclock well. Plus, Penryns' higher efficiency could save you some $ on your electric bill. I wouldn't spend more than $220 max on the chip because it only outperforms the E6750 by 15 to 20 per cent on the applications that matter to me, and you can buy the E6750 for $180 right now (with coupon from Newegg). In fact, if the Oracle told me that affordable Penryns wouldn't show up until 2009, I'd probably buy the E6750. But the Oracle remains dumb, so I'm unable to make a cpu decision right now.

Also, if you're close to a physical Micro Centre, you might want to give serious consideration to the Q6600 -- might still be on sale for $200. Again, at default speed (2.4 GHz), it's a great chip and would prove a big improvement over your X2 3800+, but it also overclocks well if you can get the G0 stepping chips. Quadcores tend to be power-hungry, however.

Oh, and as to upgrading your video card, if your primary application is gaming, then you will be graphics-limited with almost any of these cpus (certainly if you're going to re-use the Radeon 1900 XT). So I agree you should probably get a new video card as well. And now is a good time to buy video cards: the 8800 GT, Radeon 3780, and the new 9600 GT are all dropping in price. If you can find a sub-$200 8800 GT, that would probably be your best bet. I'm not sure about the Galaxy deal (I'm unfamiliar with the brand, and $70 seems an awfully hefty rebate), but there have been other deals, including a $180ish overclocked MSI card.

 

[lopri]

Very sound and thoughtful posts, Winterpool. I'm impressed.

One a side note, it is very strange that E8400 is suffering such a shortage. I thought that thing would be plentiful.

 

[TheJian]

Originally posted by: lopri
Very sound and thoughtful posts, Winterpool. I'm impressed.

One a side note, it is very strange that E8400 is suffering such a shortage. I thought that thing would be plentiful.

Don't be fooled. It is plentiful. Intel is just holding them back. For two reasons.
1. AMD sucks now. (god love them, I know I do but I converted myself, my sister and my dad when he gets my hand-me-down 2160@3ghz next week as my E3110 comes in) all to Intel. All in the last 5 months. You just can't help it. I say this being an AMD DIEHARD, just shy of fanboy Barcy/phenom being late made me jump. No 3.2 phenom etc waiting for the fix makes me think it will never get there before they jump sockets. So I had no choice. I couldn't wait for the next 6 months to see what AMD does for my dad/sis. They wanted upgrades. Phenom was s dud.

2. Places like newegg etc with a LOT of stock are having problems moving them. One, economy. Two, look at the penryn clocks/power consumption etc. Three, even without penryn coming so close on the heels of the last conroes I think they flooded the market a bit. They moved so fast killing amd, that they sort of killed themselves. Not profits, I just mean tons of product to move (and not many takers). With pricing between the two not far apart who wants these old chips and there are tons of them out there. The only way to move them is keep the others off the market until they exhaust old stocks. Or raise pricing on new models (ala the server 20% hike a month or two ago on a lot of models).

Here we are. Shortage.

I'm wondering if we'll start seeing lower overclocks on the low-end models shortly since they have plenty of time to bin out the great ones and mark them for future speed grades. We know they could release a 3.6ghz tomorrow. Given time on their hands, they could cherry pick em and start charging us more for anything that hits 4ghz+ by upping model #'s. I know I would do this! Who cares if AMD is so far behind, release a 3.33, 3.66 for $500/650 etc. There are spots they could release and squeak some more money out of us...Did I just say that? Maybe they'd be in worse monopoly trouble if they did that. Who knows. But I like the favor they're doing us now for whatever reason. Buyers rejoice.