Need some CPU recommendations over P4 3.4EE

[apoppin]

looking for CPU upgrade advice ... and *this* is the place
[i went as far as i could in Video ... i am *keeping* my AGP x1950p ... so ... ]

my sig is in rig and my Abit ic7 is half-dead ... well the PCI slots are dead and i hate to have to *workaround* with USB and onboard audio

and i *just* did a mini $300 net upgrade ... so i won't go "all the way" with C2D [nor can i afford to do so]

here's what i am thinking .. i can still get what i paid for my P4 3.4EE ... $125 .... that IS my budget ... maybe $150 ... i'd get a Conroe if i had bucks

so .. would a PentiumD Pressler or even a slower Smithfield be faster than what i have - now - for games?

i am looking at this combo:
Open Box: ASRock 775Dual-VSTA LGA 775 VIA PT880 PRO ATX Intel Motherboard - OEM $25.00
ASRock - 775Dual-VSTA
CPU Socket Type LGA 775
CPU Type Core 2 Duo / Pentium D / Pentium 4 / Celeron D
FSB 1066/800MHz
North Bridge VIA PT880 PRO
South Bridge VIA VT8237A
Number of Memory Slots 2×184pin + 2×240pin
Memory Standard DDR 400/DDR2 667
Maximum Memory Supported 2GB
Dual Channel Supported Yes

AGP Slots 1 x AGP 4X / 8X
PCI Express x16 None
PCI Slots 4
1 x PCI Express Graphics slot

and

Intel Pentium D 915 Presler 2.8GHz 2 x 2MB L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail $85

both for about $115 plus shipping

how OC'able is the Pentium D ?
[i don't want the D 805 Smithfield 2.66GHz OEM for $59.99, do i?]

--and will my P4 HSF fan fit or do i need to order it now?
i guess 1GB PC3500 is fine .... i can upgrade to 2GB DDR2 later


my *other* choice would be to get a ASrock Socket 939 MB + AMD CPU ... that might fit under $150

 

[Regs]

Ok lets try this again:

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDe...sp?ProductCode=80865&prodlist=shopping

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=2903

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Regs
whoops...just noticed the mobo specs..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16819115013
-$116

and it is 'Allendale"

are you sure it doesn't work with the ASrock?

ASRock - 775Dual-VSTA
CPU Socket Type LGA 775
CPU Type Core 2 Duo / Pentium D / Pentium 4 / Celeron D
FSB 1066/800MHz

and if it does, it this C2D a decent OCer .. better than the PentiumD?

i believe it *does* look at a user review at the NewEgg link:

Pros: Excellent performance, great price. This is ideal for overclocking because of the lower FSB. Coupled it with an ASRock PT880Dual-VSTA motherboard and got 2.7ghz by raising FSB to 300mhz (limit of that board) - stock voltage. Don't compare with clock speed of AMD chips, this is a lot faster at the same clock speed - check benchmarks. Also faster than a P4 at the same speed (each core is faster, let alone both together).

 

[apoppin]

thanks, Regs ... we kept editing and posting at the same time

--i get all my HW at NewEgg ... preferred acct with the 1.1% discount and rush shipping


it *looks* like the intel C2D E4300 Allendale 1.8GHz will work fine in that ASrock board .. tops out at 300Mhz OC ... not shabby

what do you think?

Am i taking a big chance with a "open box" MB ... NewEgg has a few of them ... they claim they work ... but i would get no "accessories" - which i guess is the manual and CD drivers

OK deal? ... costs me about $150 ... and i should get $125 for my CPU

*submit order?*


best bang for buck?

 

[Regs]

It will work. Just had to double check specs.

Over clocking attributes to the motherboards ability. Unfortuntly that one only supports up to DDR2 667 or PC-5400. I noticed in another thread a board member named "allies" has a E4300 that over clocked to 3.0GHz using DDR2 750. So you'd imagine an extra 1.2 GHz could greatly increase the performance by a good 25% or more.

I'm hoping someone with a DDR2 667 limitation can come chime in and offer some advice on the ability of the ram to overclock from 1.8GHz. I'd imagine you won't come close to the 3.0 GHz mark, but even at clock speeds the E4300 can put your power hog to shame.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Regs
It will work. Just had to double check specs.

Over clocking attributes to the motherboards ability. Unfortuntly that one only supports up to DDR2 667 or PC-5400. I noticed in another thread a board member named "allies" has a E4300 that over clocked to 3.0GHz using DDR2 750. So you'd imagine an extra 1.2 GHz could greatly increase the performance by a good 25% or more.

I'm hoping someone with a DDR2 667 limitation can come chime in and offer some advice on the ability of the ram to overclock from 1.8GHz. I'd imagine you won't come close to the 3.0 GHz mark, but even at clock speeds the E4300 can put your power hog to shame.

hold on ... i have PC 3500 ... DDR [one]

the ASrock supports both and i can't afford DDR2 ... for at least another couple of months
[2 x 1GB]

still do - able?

and

do i need a new HS/F?

 

[Regs]

Ugh. No.

So no pci-express and no ddr2...

It sounds like your first choice for the Pentium D is your only choice without DDR2. I can skim through newegg and try to find a Socket 939 with an AGP slot...(edit) I did and I couldn't find any.


Retail 939 CPU's (with heatsink/fan) from AMD are hard to find, let alone 939 boards that still support AGP.

Any Core Duo processor 775 needs DDR2.

Though it pains me to see you side-grade to a Pentium D. I really think you should sell blood to get DDR2 memory apop and move away from Netburst ASAP.

 

[apoppin]

so ... even though the ASrock MB supports it ... the C2D won't function on DDR ?


are you sure?

i thought Stumps was running an ASrock, C2D, AGP x1950p and DDR-1
:Q

EDIT: nope .. i just looked ... he is running DDR2 ...
--although i 'thought' he originally had DDR ... musta sold it

i can get $100 for my 1.5GB PC 3500

:roll:

sigh

what is the *cheapest* decent DDR2 for this MB ?


maybe i will just keep my *crippled* rig :|

 

[apoppin]

how about this?

it's cheap enough ... i can sell 1.5GB PC 3500 for more than i will pay for 2GB of this:

WINTEC AMPO 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

$79.99 plus $4.99 shipping

 

[Regs]

I would have to say G.Skill or Patriot. They make good cheap value RAM. Corsair makes value ram but in some cases a little more expensive.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231052
DDR2 667.

28 dollars for 512MB. You obviously would need two of them to support the FSB. So you're looking at 60 dollars.

So you will be looking at around 200 dollars in total for a good performance gain. Though remember, and I likely share the idea of many, if you don't spend the money on at least DDR2, anything you move to will be near pointless.

Though I stress to you that because of your mobo and ram, you'll be looking at yet another heafty upgrade a year down the road. The sweet spot is to get a mobo and ram combo that can support the entire core duo line.

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: apoppin
how about this?

it's cheap enough ... i can sell 1.5GB PC 3500 for more than i will pay for 2GB of this:

WINTEC AMPO 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

$79.99 plus $4.99 shipping

I never heard of Wintec, and any Ram I never heard of I usually frown upon. Though like any other memory vendor, they order their ram modules from different suppliers and manufactures like Samsung and Hynx. I would have to do research on where wintec got their modules from and what type the use. And well...im tired and want to go excersise before I collaspe.

All I can say now is don't rush the purchase.

 

[apoppin]

too late

i have heard of Wintec ...they are 'variable' ... some modules have been quite nice - the NewEgg customer reviews support it's variability

not too much different than Patriot ... and it *must be* 2 x 1GB
--look at it this way ... i *need* to upgrade

[would you put up with a dysfunctional MB?]

and i need a *cheap upgrade*

i can sell my P4 - $125
my 1.5 GB PC3500 - $100

i pay for a C2D and MB -$150
-for 2GB DDR2 667 RAM - $85

net cost to upgrade from P4/old MB and DDR1 to C2D/new MB and DDR2

Ten dollars ... and *next year* it will have more value than my current system will - then

of course i am taking a big *chance* everywhere ... i would NOT do this if i planned everything ... i NEVER buy open box either ... but have - in the past - got good deals this way - IF it works
--if not it all goes back to NewEgg and i am 'out' shipping

BIG "thank-you" for your help
:thumbsup:

 

[apoppin]

According to Stumps the ASrock *will* function with a C2D and my PC3500 ... so i can wait a bit on the RAM

ALSO PC6400 will work in the ASrock ... but at 5400 speeds [with tighter timings]

so .... howz this for 'future' also
CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory
$109 after $50 MIR

i am *pushing* my budget ... it has become a net $35 upgrade with the faster DDR2
:Q

 

[apoppin]

OK
... thanks for the PMs and the encouragement

:thumbsup:

it is finalized ... all from NewEgg

1) Open Box: ASRock 775Dual-VSTA LGA 775 VIA PT880 PRO ATX Intel Motherboard - OEM $25.00

2) Intel Core 2 Duo E4300 Allendale 1.8GHz 2M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail $116

3) CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - $109 after $50 MIR

see anything *wrong* ?....
--i can still cancel it

it looks like my rig is being dragged - kicking and screaming into the more modern age
--at least i was lucky to have old parts that are still really desirable ... more expensive than the newer and faster HW
:Q

 

[jimmypage13]

well if you really want to save some cash, you could get a pentium d915 is a very ocable CPU, I got it at 3.8 on air with the stock cooler

edit : lol, too little too late, but that setup it pretty good

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: jimmypage13
well if you really want to save some cash, you could get a pentium d915 is a very ocable CPU, I got it at 3.8 on air with the stock cooler

edit : lol, too little too late, but that setup it pretty good

i've seen one other vocal Pentium Der on the Video forum - they are very decent last gen CPUs ... way better than my NetBurst

'D' was my first pick as i didn't realize how cheap C2D entry-level has become - i knew how awesome they OC ... the Presler 'D' was $85 and the C2D is $116 ... pretty close - $31

--although i don't expect to get that much OC as my ASrock will hold it back because of limited memory speed - but i should get awesome timings with the 'overkill' Corsair 6400 RAM running at PC5400 speeds

 

[apoppin]

i got her going ...

C2D e4300 1.8Ghz at 2.763Ghz / (bastage) ASrock MB / 2x1GB Corsair XMS PC6400
--running it at 1:1, CAS 4
[does anyone know how do force it to Cas 3?]
--it's PC6400 at PC5400 speeds [667mhz]

... and i think i am near the upper limit of my MB in allowing my e4300 to OC ...
-- 'rock solid' at 307 FSB ... 2.763Ghz ... much above that it doesn't post

CPU temps are in the low 50s with TAT [they *were* hi-30s before i flashed BIOS 1.4 to 2.7 ]
-but still reading upper30s in the BIOS at max OC

BUT 3DMark05 is *only* 10132 and '06 is 5172
---i am D/L'ing the latest Sandra ... but the earlier version was also *disappointing* in the bandwith [i think CPU to RAM was 5:4]

frankly i am disappointed ... my same rig with same x1950p/512m AGP with DDR-1/P4 EE got 9300/4300

and one *damn irritating* thing with my particular MB ... there is a 75 second "delay" in going from Power up to Win startup
... looking to replace her with a Gigabyte ....
--when i can afford it [and HD 2900xt]
:Q

 

[Regs]

Any noticable differences in STALKER or Oblivion?

Did you also try to disable all the unnecessary's in the bios? Like RAID?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Regs
Any noticable differences in STALKER or Oblivion?

Did you also try to disable all the unnecessary's in the bios? Like RAID?

of course ... i read All - and contributed to - that 50 page ASrock DualVSTA thread in MBs
:Q

just installed my first game ... FEAR and Extraction Point
[which i was halfway thru on my old rig]

it has been a 'challenge' to get everything running OK
-now for some fun


... after sleep
:moon:

 

[Conky]

Congrats on the ASRock 775Dual-VSTA board and C2D!!! And you have an amazing overclock so far. :beer:

I really liked that mobo back before I transitioned to all new junk and the DS3. :thumbsup:

The RAM settings stuff with that mobo is whack so don't expect much there. I didn't notice any difference between DDR and DDR2 using that board and forget about messing with the timings too much... it plain doesn't matter with that board, lol.

But it is a good stable board and when you get a chance at a PCI-E videocard it will slide right in with no issues.

If you have any questions at all dealing with that mobo don't hesitate to PM me.

Glad to see you C2D-ing it. You need to load up some Quake4 or some other game I know you like and be blown away by the increased framerates.

 

[apoppin]

thank-you ... although the upgrade was not "necessary" and even though it was dictated by BAD circumstances ...
--it seems to be an inexpensive step on the "right path"

the *next time* i upgrade my GPU it will be a pciE GPU+MB upgrade ... with a likely e4300 OC to over 3.0G and also letting my PC6400 run at it's rated speed instead of 667Mhz ...
- next time an inexpensive upgrade will also seem like a whole new system


i am gonna try STALKER first ... see if i can play with more "grass"
:Q

... and lighting distance



actually there is *one* issue with the MB ... it has a weird-ass "countdown" ... a 'delay' from power up to Win starting
... no one else mentioned it ... now that everything is installed, no biggie ... not bad for a $25 MB

... but weird


also i find it really odd that i can have a "poor man's sli" ...

well ... in this bastage of a MB [As+rock] - an AGP GPU can run with 2 monitors simultaneously with your PCIe GPU and TWO more monitors - great for a stock broker's Quad-monitor setup !!
... wonder if you can mix nvidia and ATi GPUs?
:shocked:

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: apoppin
well ... in this bastage of a MB [As+rock] - an AGP GPU can run with 2 monitors simultaneously with your PCIe... wonder if you can mix nvidia and ATi GPUs?

Heh! I wouldn't doubt it...

Doesn't ASRock use some sort of propietary video setup -- AGI or something?

I've read that certain video cards won't work on ASRock mobos because of this...

 

[apoppin]

very true


weird

this little CPU/MB just keeps on OC'ing

:Q

got it at 311Mhz FSBx4 = 1244
1.8G > 2.8G

i had the RAM set to CAS3 and it's rated for CAS4
--no wonder it 'stuck' at 307 ...

only thing, CPUz shows the Command as 2T instead of 1T which i set in BIOS

and 3DMark05 stopped increasing at 310 FSB ... it was 10258

at at 311 - currently it is 10259
47.5
27.8
52.3
cpu 7097
4.0
5.6

*one thing* .. temps finally started to climb in BIOS and in TAT

TAT is not right, i believe ... it shows 58/59 but never goes over 60C - under load

and TAT *changed* ... when i flashed the BIOS from 1.4 to 2.7
--the temps reported in the BIOS were the same as TAT ... high 30s ... and now with the bigger OC, very low 40s

shall i keep going?

 

[apoppin]

312 .. still going up ... and still 100% stable

what is that smoke i am smelling ?
:Q

not really ... well not a PC 'smoking'


i guess i should *ignore* TAT readings ... they seem way out of line since the BIOS flash ...
approaching upper-50s at idle and ALSO under load


what else to use?