Need help with GM Leased Vehicle - Excess Wear Charges

[Izzo]

Yes, I know: Don't lease a car, don't go GM. I get it now.

But I need advice from anyone who has ever dealt with an excess wear charge for a leased vehicle. I am getting nowhere with the GM Asset Recovery center. Who else can I turn to for help? Here is a brief summary:

- Last week in January I turned in 07 Chevy Impala
- Received excess wear summary ($300 dent on hood) shortly thereafter with follow up letters every two weeks or so
- March/early April - Called GM Asset Recovery Center and filed claim to re-evaluate the claim within the allotted time frame. No visible damage in any picture that they claim as evidence of the dent.
- Kept getting payment follow up letters from them even though the the claim was being re-evaluated
- I called on 4/29 asking what the status was. I was told that these re-evaluations can take over a month and I would be notified when completed
- May and June - no correspondence from GM
- July 6th - I call to follow up. I am told that my re-evaluation was rejected on 6/1 and the claim still stands (what the?? I didn't receive anything)
- July 7th - Seemingly prompted by my phone call realizing they had forgotten about my account, they send an escalation notice indicating they are filing a Negative Credit Report (whatever that is) and sending the claim to a collections agency. Awesome customer service. You forgot about my account, I remind you, then you escalate and send threatening letters that are an escalation from the reminders I used to get.
- yesterday and today - I try calling to talk to anybody with any authority. I'm getting nowhere with them. Leaving voicemails to managers and getting first line of defense phone operators who won't listen to me.

My problem (besides the fact that of the horrible communication and customer relations) is that there is NO DAMAGE in the picture they are claiming. They are claiming a 5-6" dent in my hood of all places. How I got a dent in my hood, I have no idea. They are estimating 4 hrs of metal work and 4 hrs of paint work for over 300 dollars. For those that have leased before, they send you pictures with a big orange arrow pointing to the damage and the GM wear square (a cardboard cutout to show you chargeable wear size charts and whatnot).

The wear square is 4" by 4". So they are claiming that the 6" dent should be 50% larger in surface area than the wear square and requires 4 hours of paint work. You would think something like that would stick out. I know you won't believe me without posting a picture, but I haven't decided if I want to post it yet. Just take my word for now that there is no damage at all and you see a perfect reflection in the paint/clearcoat of the surroundings without any visible distortion in the glare.

But I have no idea how to escalate this to anybody that can help me. I just want someone to look at the pictures with me and explain how they are seeing any damage.

This is by far the worst customer service I've ever had with GM, and I probably won't buy or lease from them again. My family and extended family of over a dozen GM blue collars have never had this problem leasing before. I'm just lost now trying to figure out what to do.

Does anyone have any experience with this? Is there another GM number I can call?

 

[Safeway]

Post a picture. Chances are, there is a dent. Go look at the car yourself.

 

[Vette73]

GM cars/trucks are fine, leasing is not.


Why no pic?
Post pics if you are in the clear.

 

[ultimatebob]

Did you file a complaint with the Attorney General of your state, yet? They're usually pretty good at getting business's attention.

Yeah... you could file a complaint with the BBB as well, but we all know who's side they're really on. Go with the Attorney General instead... he's going to try harder to make you happy, so you'll reelect him next year.

 

[EagleKeeper]

You should have done a check out of the vehicle before surrendering it. Did you?

Is the vehicle available to a look see now?

Has GM "repaired" the dent?

 

[KentState]

To be fair, you aren't dealing with GM. This is probably through GMAC which is a separate financial company.

Personally, I've leased 3 GM vehicles. One was through Bank One and the other two through GMAC. I've never ran into this issue and actually received a $500 check back on the GTO after they sold it at auction. Do you have a picture to post of the damage?

 

[boomerang]

For those that aren't in the know, the lessee is between a rock and a hard place when turning in a vehicle leased from GM. It used to be that the inspection was done at the dealer by dealership personnel. This didn't work out real well for the lessor, because the dealership did not want their customer to incur extra charges. So, everything short of mileage overages was, well, overlooked.

Now, the inspection is done by a third party sometime after the vehicle is turned in. The lessee has no control over when or where this is done. The lessee has no control over any damage that might occur after turning the vehicle in. It's your word against GMAC. You are not going to win.

This car was turned in way back in January. It's gone on far too long for any resolution to occur in the lessee's favor. You should have addressed this way, way back. You are to blame for letting this go on for this long and don't try to fool yourself or us that this is not the case.

Pay up or take the hit.

You can post whatever picture you want, but we can't solve your problem. It's better to pay the $300 than take a credit hit IMO.

If you feel you are getting a screwing, teach them a lesson and cease doing business with them. That's about the extent of the recourse you have in this case.

 

[Slick5150]

You can use the dealer as leverage though. I had this happen with my GFs Toyota and she wasn't getting anywhere either so we went to the dealership and explained the situation to them and said that we'd be looking to replace the car soon and had been considering Toyota (a lie, we weren't) but because of this we were extremely reluctant to do so. The dealer made some calls and got the claim looked at again and eventually got notice that the charges had been dropped.

But yes, anytime you're looking to turn in a lease, go over the car VERY carefully and document anything that might be considered "excess wear". You can even take it into the dealership early and ask them to look at something and see if they think it would be excess damage. I had a small dent in the side of a lease once that the dealer told me would definitely get charged and probably in the $500-$750 range, so I took it to a local shop and had the dent repaired for like $90.

 

[jiggahertz]

Had something similar happen with Ford Credit. I returned a car a couple weeks past the end of my lease because I was waiting for my new car to be built which I bought through the same dealership. They told me I wouldn't be charged any late return fees and the GM of the dealership signed a summary indicating $0 in late return charges. Ford Credit turned around and charged me for returning it late. After arguing with them about it back and forth for a while I forgot about it and it ended up showing up as a charge-off on my credit report. Should have just paid the couple hundred bucks, but I was too stubborn.

 

[Jumpem]

It going to collections will cost you much more than that $300.

Whether you were right or not, you should have paid it to avoid that happening.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: Jumpem
It going to collections will cost you much more than that $300.

Whether you were right or not, you should have paid it to avoid that happening.

Going into collections gives a chance to dispute it.

They should have to provide proof of the claim. If repaired, demand photos of before/after of the work. If that can not be provide, declare the claim null and void. Inform the Credit Agencies that the creditor can not provide documentation to back up then claim

 

[compuwiz1]

When you return a leased car you should turn it in to the lease manager at a dealership and insist that he go thru the return checklist in your presence. Any items that can be charged to you are acknowleged at that time and you both sign off on it. That's the end. If you just dropped it off and did not have it gone over and signed off at that time, bad move.

 

[Jumpem]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
They should have to provide proof of the claim. If repaired, demand photos of before/after of the work. If that can not be provide, declare the claim null and void. Inform the Credit Agencies that the creditor can not provide documentation to back up then claim

Going to collections will hose his credit for the seven years it takes for it to drop off.

 

[compuwiz1]

Originally posted by: Jumpem

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
They should have to provide proof of the claim. If repaired, demand photos of before/after of the work. If that can not be provide, declare the claim null and void. Inform the Credit Agencies that the creditor can not provide documentation to back up then claim

Going to collections will hose his credit for the seven years it takes for it to drop off.

The only way it doesn't is if he can successfully dispute it. That's a bigger chance than I'd take over $300

 

[Izzo]

Thanks for everyone's input. Some responses to quotes above and the resolution:

Yes, I am aware I didn't lease it thru GM. It is GMAC. The first statement was sarcastic as GM often gets a negative knee jerk reaction on most forums I frequent. I've never had any problems with GM vehicles (4 in 8 years), however, the burden and negative reactions usually falls back to them (justly or unjustly whatever you feel) when companies that you buy and lease their cars from do not treat customers fairly. I never (nor have the dozen or so GM employees in my family who lease and buy cars) ever had an experience this bad with a GM lease before. Both of my previous leases were GM with GMAC financing and inspections. So maybe I was a little complacent.

I agree that it shouldn't have gone this long. But I was getting notifications from them every two weeks from February to April even though my claim to re-evaluate was filed. I called the last day in April to ask why I was getting notifications and why my re-evaluation wasn't completed. I was instructed to wait another month and I would be notified. I did not hear anything though. After receiving notifications every two weeks and then told to wait until I receive notification on the re-evaluation, what would you have done? To those that say they would've sent in the money, do you really think that? You would fork over 300 when they are claiming a dent that should take up 50% of the picture they took (based on proportions to the wear square) even though the picture is flawless? You would send in the money without ever talking to someone about the supposed damage, other than being instructed wait and you will receive notification about the re-evaluation?

I called again in July and they told me the re-evaluation was rejected June 1st. I did not receive any updates in June or any statement saying the fee stands and please send the money. So the last four attempts on communication were on my part. I think I did my due diligence trying to figure out what was going on without hearing from them. I was very disappointed that my July call served as a reminder that they forgot about my account and the same day they sent out a notice that it was going to collections with a bad credit report. I never had a chance to talk to anybody about the pictures or the claim summary, even in the last two days where I called several numbers 8 times and could never get transfered to anyone to look at the pictures with me.

I did inspect the car thouroughly prior to drop off and I had the dealer look at it. I went back to the dealer today, and he confirmed there was no visible damage to the car at the drop off and verified that the pictures did not show any damage. Unfortunately, as others have pointed out, that doesn't do much good. It is a third party inspection that was done a week after the drop off. Even if I video taped every inch of the car, there is still a week that it is out of my hands for damage to occur that they can write up. (But that's not the issue, the point is that there is no damage. If I video tape on drop off, there's no damage. If I have dealer look at it, there's no damage. If they send me a picture saying there's damage (even though the picture doesn't show damage), well then nothing I could've done would've prevented this)

Thankfully, after my 8th phone call to various GMAC phone numbers over the past two days, I was transferred to someone in the Asset Recovery Center that would actually listen to me. They looked at the pictures and agreed with everyone else who has seen the pictures: nothing is there. They showed it to their supervisor and waived the fee. My account is supposedly settled now.

It shouldn't surprise me, but it does....I can't believe how many times I had to call and get transferred to endless deadends before someone would sit down and review the pictures with me. I understand that they deal with a lot of customers. I understand that a lot of them probably say the car was perfect at drop off. But this was not like that. The car had no damage, as evidenced by the picture. And it took 12 calls (4 initially with 8 in the past week) before anybody would even look at the picture with me, no matter how many times I pleaded for a manager or supervisor. That's why I thought I had ran out of options and posted this thread.

Again, thanks for all the input. I'm just happy it's over now.

Cliffs: Finally was transferred to someone that would talk to me. Agreed with me that there was no damage and waived the fee.

 

[Safeway]

Excellent resolution. You found the one person that gives a shit, and they gave that shit, and everything came out as it should have.