Need Help Choosing an AMD Processor and MB

[sianof]

Hello all,
To start I will throw out my ideal specs for my new system I am building. I have never overclocked so I am debating on purchasing a higher mhz chip or trying to purchase a lower and overclock. I am a total Newbie so if someone can help me out in depth I'd appreciate it greatly.

**Motherboard**
For the Motherboard I am hoping to spend under $130 or so. I found these three to sound very good for overclocking.
ASUS A7N8X ( or the deluxe if necessary)
Epox 8RDA+
Abit NF7-S
The Epox seemed to be the cheapest and the ASUS the nicest so let me know what is the best for overclocking,performance etc. Or if anyone has one that wants to let me know the pros,etc.

**Processor**
I am looking to spend in the $180 range or anywhere around that. I see the AMD XP2600 for about that pricerange. Although I always hear how well the XP1700 and the XP2100 overclock. What do you all recommend? Purchasing a lower chip and overclocking? Or just spending the cash and getting the faster chip. Please keep in mind that I have never overclocked, although I am a fast learner and am willing to try with the right set of steps or directions. If anyone knows a great site with the details laid out on exactly how to go about this also please let me know.

**Video Card**
I am a graphic designer. I work mainly with graphics and web design. I am not a huge gamer although I would like to get something decent enough if I ever want to play. And I am hoping to begin designing in 3DSmax so a little bit of rendering will also be involved. But as I said I am mainly a designer in photoshop,quark,illustrator,etc. I am hoping to spend anywhere under $175 for a 128 mb video card. I see the GeForce 4 TI 4200 and 4400. Also have heard the 4200 can be overclocked??? Let me know Or am debating on a Radeon. Let me know a smart move to make

**RAM**
I was hoping to get 2 sticks of PC3200 512 MB DDR chips. Again, getting 2 to take advantage of the memory controller on the boards that needs 2 to function.

**Hard Drive**
80 gig 7200RPM 8MB drive ATA133.

Well there you have it. The basics of wht my machine is going to be. Please let me know what everyone thinks. Should I attempt overclocking as a beginner? Can the XP2100 chip run as fast as an XP2600 safely?? Any advice is going to be greatly appreciated.
THANK YOU to those who read and reply
Frank S

 

[qquizz]

(Recently Edited)
I was in the same boat as you were until yesterday when I finally made the dive. I spent many hours researching before spending the bucks.
I ordered the Asus A7N8X Deluxe model because of features like better sound built in IEEE, SATA RAID, excellent onboard sound, etc. Also because I already have a video card. Plus it was well worth the extra 30 bucks or whatever. It gets a five star rating from the feedback of over 250 buyers at the website I bought it at. (Abit would be my close second choice followed by Epox depending on price/features)

I chose the 1700+ (retail)basically because of its price and overclockable. I am going to wait for the Bartons to come down in price.
Specifications:
CPU: 1.47 GHz
Type: 1700 XP Thoroughbred
Cache: 256K
BUS: 266MHz
Micron: .13

I went with 2 sticks of CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 256MB 32MX8 PC-3200C2 With Heat Spreader OEM CMX256A-3200C2. http://www.corsairmicro.com/main/products/specs/cmx256a-3200c2.pdf (Link 1 below)

I could have spent an extra $30 for the CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, Low Latency (Twin Pack) 512MB(2 x 256MB) 2x(32MX64) PC-3200LLPT With Platinum - Silver Heat Spreader.
http://www.corsairmicro.com/main/products/specs/twinx512-3200ll.pdf (Link 2 below)
One thing about the Twin Pack is that it is Corsair's top of the line PC3200 that is hand picked and tested in pairs in an Asus A7N8X in Dual ddr settings before it is shipped for sale. Approx cost is $175 for 2 X 256 MB. Also available in 2 X 512MB to bring you up to 1GB RAM....sweet.

I decided to stick with the Corsair CMX256A-3200 because it still might clock at 2-2-2 instead of its rated 2-3-3, and because I probably will underclock it untill I uprade to Barton. This is because the best information I can find is that most of the time it is best to keep synchronous timings (everything running at the same frequency eg. 133/266. To sum up, the mem I chose WILL run 2-2-2 at 266+ and I can still later on use it for my Barton. Furthermore, I have heard rumor where new AMD's will run @ 200mhz, so PC3200 will run synchronous with that 200/400. I've also heard that the Deluxe mode (maybe others) will support this (we'll see).

If anyone can give me more info on synchronous vs asynchonous vs isosynchronous AND/OR the rumor about 200mhz FSB support on new AMD cpu's let me know (my email should be visible).

Sianof, I know this post is mostly about my future setup but maybe will provide some good links and insight. I've also heard that the Epox and Abit mobo's are excellent overclocker's but check it out. Quality memory would probably be one of the key to overclockability too. The only other think I can think of is consider the Western Digital WD2000JB hard drive (See Link 3 Below for benchmarks), or if you got the bucks, two Serial ATA hdd's to make use of the ASUS Deluxe built in RAID for SATA. From what I understand though, RAID doesnt really provide more FPS for gamers, just helps loads game levels faster, and runs Windows and apps faster.

Admittedly, this is my first AMD cpu. I have also seen some info on the T'bird A and B. Also reports on some of the cpu's being "unlocked" or even some locked cpu's being unlocked simply by the bios in nforce2 boards but I am still trying to get better documentation. Being new to AMD, I havent found all the info I want but this forum seems to be excellent.
Thanks to all in advance.

Corsair Link 1 pdf
Corsair Link 2 pdf

NOTE: Older bios versions of the Asus A7N8X have issues in recognizing some of the Corsair memory above. This is a known issue that has been resolved by new bios. Info can be found on this forum's Asus site. The only real problem is if you've got the older bios shipped you need to boot with some other stick of common ddr and then use the Asus Utility that will let you download updated bios from their website and will update to new bios automatically. (nice feature) MOST LIKELY though unless the Asus board has been laying around on a shelf, the one you order now already will come with the new bios. Latest motherboard revision on the A7N8X is 2.0 and is now shipping from major online retailers, like newegg.com per customer reviews on the board.

To my knowledge most of the information provided is accurate unless I noted otherwise. Since I'm new to AMD, any of you AMD gurus me/us know where I went wrong. Accurate information is power.

Sianof, enjoy your new system whichever you choose! It would cool to exchange some benchmarks. I expect to have mine ready in about a week or so.

My current system is a P3 1GHz Coppermine OC'd to 1.13 Ghz (will go much higher with better RAM) with Asus TUSL2-C board and it has been rock solid even with generic RAM. Upgradeable to P3 Tualatin(S) 1.4GHz w/ 512kB cache ("S" series server chip not officially supported by Asus but works, there is a slight voltage difference in the server chip.) This was probably due to Intel wanting consumers to upgrade thier motherboards too. The 1.4 GHz sever chip benchmarks similar to P4 1.8A and is overclockable to about 1.6GHz in a good board which pushes it to perform at P4 2.0 GHZ levels. This chip will make an excellent value priced web server when paired with SCSI/RAID hdd's, and 512MB TwinMOS PC166 SDRAM. However, newer faster cpu's with full speed 512 cache and memory prices continue to drop. For example: P4 2.4B 533FSB for $160 and 512MB Crucial ddr 333 for $75-$100. All set in an ASUS P4PE/L for $113. Enough of my Intel ramblings
All prices vary if not bought at U.S. online retailer.

 

[qquizz]

Recently Edited
Sianof,
I forgot to give the link for Western Digital hdd as I said I would in previous post. This is acutally a review on the IBM DeskStar 180GXP, but provides benchmarks on several hard drives. Since the hdd is the slowest part of your computer so to speak, for a speedier overall PC experience, I think there is no use on slacking off on the right hdd. Furthermore, the Special Edition Western Digital hdd comes with a 1 year OEM and 3 year manufacturer warantee in most or all cases.
Hard Drive Link THG
This link is not in disrespect to Anandtech, its just one that I am familiar with. I imagine that AT has similar info.
Here is another link from an ad banner I got right off of AnandTech's home page AT Banner
This is the 80 GB version of the afore mentioned WD hdd, slightly slower than the 200GB versioin but kicks ***

(If I would have thought about it I could have just edited last post, like I'm doing right now, doh!)

Here is a link to another site that is specific to nForce2, that has a good forum too. See forum index link on left sidebar when you go to this Link

 

[gplracer]

I have a 8RDA+ C1/A1 stepping and a 1700+. I am real happy with my setup. I am currently at 200fsb. If you are going to overclock then get a slk800 or slk900 heatsink and a fan with a variable control on it. I have kingston hyperx 3500 ram that I thought was a good value. Corsair is good but more money. You might want to look at some of the "L" version 1700+ chips. They work at 1.5 volts instead of 1.65 I hear they are great overclockers and use less voltage. Try this place for information about the nforce boards and the "L" version chips: amdforums Good Luck!!!

 

[Shimmishim]

Please do not waste like 100000 dollars on Corsair XMS ram...

places like memoryx.net sell twinmos/winbond memory for like half the price and they do just as well...

corsair uses winbond bh-5 chips... twinmos uses winbond bh-5 chips.. only difference is the pcb it's put onto...

i have a stick of ebay won palmtreepc winbond memory running at 209 mhz @ 2-3-3-6

you may be able to run more aggressive timings with the corsair but in the end, it's not worth it IMHO

as for a board... the problem with the 8rda(+) is that it is hit or miss on getting over 200 mhz on your FSB due to the vdd voltage. it is not adjustable on this board and you will have to physically mod your board in order to get it over 200 (assumming your board can't do it). i believe the asus a7n8x does not have an adjustable vdd as well. the abit nf7-s v.2.0 boards (and the 1.2v boards) have an adjustable vdd voltage from 1.4 to 1.7. You can also do a pencil trick mod to get vdd voltage of 1.9 to 2.1 (depending on how well you can cool your northbridge). the abit nf7-s also has serial ata, firewire support, lan, soundstorm, and usb 2.0 support.... and agp 8x... and it costs about 30 dollars less than the a7n8x

processor: i'm gonna have to go with the 1700+ as well. it's a great chip that overclocks very well and it's dirt cheap. might as well buy like 3 of these suckers if you're going to spend 180 for a processor. test them all out. find the one that o/c's the best. keep it then sell off the other two in the FS/FT forum.

video card: there is an albatron turbo ti4200 128 meg somewhere at newegg i believe that can do speeds of the ti4600 due to the quality ram they use. it's around 180 i believe.

cooler: you're best off with the slk-800(a) or (u) .... the 900 is gonna be over 50 bucks.

hard drive is up to you...

 

[sianof]

I want to start by thanking EVERYONE for the very long and detailed posts. You guys have helped me realize certain things.
Now here I go, I see you Shimmishim have Overclocked about a half a dozen chips for the hell of it so you definitely know what I want to do off hand.
I am not looking for an overkill on overclocking, just trying to get a little more for my money. Another thing is, is I don't want to have to have a million fans, I am "trying" to keep my comp on the quieter side. So what is the recommendation? I would either purchase an XP2600 straight out, or I would like to try to overclock an XP2100 a bit.
What do you guys think? Also, do you think the Epox 8RDA+ will but it for this overclock? or should I go with something else. I am such a newbie but just by reading all of this I feel like I've learned a ton. I see that newegg has some Tbred B's around, and if you guys know where to get other chips that are guaranteed better overclockers please let me know. I am hoping to make a few purchases this week.
Also, anyone have experience with the:
ALBATRON GeForce 4 TI4680P TURBO (NVIDIA GeForce4 TI4200 GPU TURBO Version), AGP8X 128MB DDR, DVI+VGA TV-Out. w/DVI adaptor Part# TI4680XP
I see it going for about $180 and everyone says this is the best chip for overclocking and can get up to 550mhz? Is this true? Also, how do you go about overclocking a chip like this?
Thanks again for any of you guys that reply
Frank S