Need help buying a printer

[ArenaNinja]

I'm looking to buy a decent printer (before Christmas), preferably below $100 (though I might go as high as $150, if the deal is that good). Since I don't know much about printers, I was reading TestFreaks reviews. Most of the high-scores seem to be Canon printers.

- POSSIBLE MATCHES-

- Canon Pixma MP470, from Geeks.com. Issue is I've never bought from them and frankly, never had a clue they existed. It's also off by at least $40 the next reputable e-tailer, so I'm kind of hesitant on jumping ship.

- Canon Pixma MX700, from NewEgg. The Egg is reliable, and it's about $40 off MSRP at $119.99 plus tax (next best price I could find was $169.99, newegg regular price is $159.99), free shipping as well. If it was $99, I would jump on it right away.

- ADDTIONAL INFO -

- I have a $50 GC from Dell that I could use, but it's not necessary. None of their printers seem to be a good deal. I liked a Dell 948 AIO, but I read that it eats too much ink.

- Speaking of ink, I'd like to get a printer that does not have uber-expensive ink. Does anyone know where Canon stands on this issue? The printer's main function would be printing text documents (with some images)

- I would rate my usage at medium. Monthly usage would be over 100 but unlikely to be over 1,000.

- Must work with Vista, though it hopefully goes without saying by now...

- Must copy/print/scan. Faxing NOT needed.

- I'm not picky about printing photos, just decent images would suffice.

- Also, I don't mind buying recertified, refurb or open box, as long as there's a reasonable return policy and at least a one-year MF warranty backing it

- Note that so far I'm looking at InkJets because I heard (somewhere on the 'Net) that LaserJets would be overkill for my needs. Can anybody tell me if this is an accurate assessment?

So, should I wait for BF to see if MX700 dips below $100? Jump on it now? Does it eat lots of ink? Go after a different printer? Please suggest, I'm desperate to finally own a printer (after 2+ years without one...)

 

[Rottie]

well it depends on what you need everyday and Canon printers are superior than others i have owned several canon printers and i am impressive with great color details and they never quit on me. right now i have pixma 4000 printer.

 

[Zepper]

I wouldn't get an all-in-one unless that's what you really need - even though they use basically the same print engine as the print-only models, they seldom score as highly on output quality as the separates in the reviews. I recommend separates. The new Canon iP4600 should be excellent at under $100. as the 4000 series have consistently been awarded best in general-purpose printers since the 4000 was introduced. You can check various reviews to find out the consumables cost for various models (check for the ones that actually do their own printing instead of calculating off the mfr's ink usage specs) - the 5-tank Canons have been right in there on the per page costs assuming the use of OEM ink tanks across the board.
. Perhaps the new Kodak AIOs may beat Canon on consumables costs, but I've also heard they have limited flexibility as far as setting adjustments are concerned (printers for "the rest of us" - meaning simpletons) and you can only get them in the AIO configuration.

Watch your cartridge types as well - almost always the models that have cartridges with integrated heads will cost a lot more over time as the consumables are much more expensive. Generally models that have a separate tank for each color will have a lower TCO (total cost of operation). Counter-intuitively, the lower cost printers almost always have a higher TCO than more expensive models. If they don't get you one place, they get you another...

I'm currently using an HP K5400 as I got tired of waiting for good clone tanks with clone chips to show up for the Canon iP series. It still has the same paper feeding problem as the very early HP models and the duplexing is unreliable and inflexible partly due to the paper feeding unreliability. I've heard that clone tanks with clone chips are finally available from Pelikan and perhaps others for the Canon iP series (and other models that use the same tanks), so I'll probably go back to Canon if/when the K5400 dies as Canon has been nearly flawless in paper feeding and duplexing (flip the stack, manual method as the built in auto duplexing is way too slow for any lengthy run like the 400+ page .PDF manual I've been wanting to print out). But the consumables costs are lower than just about any other and can be lowered drastically with a set of the refillable tanks that are available out there.

.bh.

 

[ArenaNinja]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Rottie, since you have owned Canon printers, do you have any comments on ink efficiency? (i.e.: how often do you replace them? do pages look faded when the ink is low? estimated cost per page?)

Zepper, I did notice that AIOs had very critical reviews all over the web. Something always seems fishy. Unfortunately, I'm currently in college, so I have neither the budget nor the space to have separate devices for the functions. Honestly, I'm now looking only to the PIXMA MX700 since it found a decent balance with Editor's reviews, User reviews and cost (can be had for $100 on a good day). Since it has 4 different ink tanks, I believe it should have a pretty low TCO. I've had two HP inkjet printers before (albeit very cheap ones), and they turned out to be crap. They would always jam and when the ink was running low my pages looked like I was printing rainbows. Lots of paper was wasted because I never figured out what their (or my) problem was. Suffice it to say that the only price HP could offer me to buy one of their printers is "free."

Thanks for the feedback guys. Now I can do some more research

 

[Zepper]

If at all possible, I'd go up to the 5-tank model that's equivalent to the iP4000 print engine. On the MX700, the black in photo printing is composite, so it can look sort of gray to greenish-gray and uses quite a lot of the CMY ink to make the black. The 5-tanks model has an extra dye-based black tank to use in photos and graphics so you get true black for that as well as for text printing. I used the iP3000 (basically the same print engine as the MX700) before I upgraded to the 4000 series mainly to get better black and to cut down on the use of the CMY ink tanks. It's worth it if at all feasible - I think that is the MX850. Other places beat the Egg on base price of the 850, but always want to go to the bottom line (shipped price) to be sure you're getting the best price.
. It's possible to find factory refurbed Canon product out there - usually at a good price with at least 90-day warranty (try SquareTrade.com to extend the warranty for low bucks).

Pricegrabber.com shows the best prices on the MX850.

.bh.

 

[Zepper]

I edited the post above, plus found an even better price on the MX850 at Amazon of $159. shipped. Dell has a good price on the MX850 (per PriceGrabber) - hard to beat with your gift card

.bh.

 

[Zepper]

Well, I went to Dell and they were OOS on the MX850, CSR said should be back in stock in 10 days. He really! tried to cross-sell me to a Dell V305 at $59. - yeah right... I also went to Amazon and read a buyer review that said the old MP830 model gives better results from both the printer and the scanner units. Hard to find a new one of those at a reasonable price as it has been DC'd (discontinued). Have to check fleaBay. Found some factory refurb MP830s there for under $150. shipped including a "free" USB cable. Located in NY so I'd have to pay tax while you wouldn't. There were lots of other refurbs at varying prices - I saw very few with bids, so you might could pick one off for around $90.+ sh (most of those were in Arizona so I can't tell much about shipping).

.bh.

 

[ArenaNinja]

Wow Zepper thanks for doing so much homework for me! I am now monitoring both the MX700 and the MX850. The fact that the MX700 doesn't use a black tank is kind of a biggie, since I plan on printing mostly B&W documents. While the MX850 does address this, it is a bit of a reach (even with the Amazon deal). The Dell price is decent, but taxes and shipping ruin it.

As we get closer to BF, I'm seeing more and more deals on these printers, so I think I will wait at least one more week to see how the water flows

 

[Zepper]

The MX700 does have the large black tank with pigmented ink for text, just no dye black tank for printing photos. The higher models (MX850/MP830) add the photo, dye black tank. price grabber had a better starting point at Dell yesterday, but was "after rebate" - maybe rebate period has ended.

.bh.

 

[nerp]

It's a shame you can't get a budget laser for $50 to $70. If you're printing mostly black and white documents, you'd get faster printouts, higher quality with a dramatically lower cost per page. I strongly recommend against buying inkjets these days unless you plan on printing photographs.

 

[bruceb]

Try here: http://www.ctistore.com/product/1/code,2436B002.html
MX850 for $176 + $15 ground ship to NJ area

Or even better here: http://www.buydig.com/shop/pro...gn=CNMX850&sku=CNMX850

$179 + Free Shipping

 

[ArenaNinja]

Originally posted by: nerp
It's a shame you can't get a budget laser for $50 to $70. If you're printing mostly black and white documents, you'd get faster printouts, higher quality with a dramatically lower cost per page. I strongly recommend against buying inkjets these days unless you plan on printing photographs.

I think I should consider it. What happens when the printer is out of ink? Can I buy replacements? Do I have to buy a new printer?

However, here's the reason why I've pretty much disqualified laser. Remember that I'm a college student, so my room doesn't have much ventilation.

 

[Zepper]

I guess bruceb didn't peruse the entire thread - note MX850 at $159. shipped from Amazon a ways up the thread.

.bh.

 

[bruceb]

Yup .. I missed it

 

[nerp]

Originally posted by: ArenaNinja

Originally posted by: nerp
It's a shame you can't get a budget laser for $50 to $70. If you're printing mostly black and white documents, you'd get faster printouts, higher quality with a dramatically lower cost per page. I strongly recommend against buying inkjets these days unless you plan on printing photographs.

I think I should consider it. What happens when the printer is out of ink? Can I buy replacements? Do I have to buy a new printer?

However, here's the reason why I've pretty much disqualified laser. Remember that I'm a college student, so my room doesn't have much ventilation.

I buy replacement toner carts for my printers at $20 a pop. They last for a good year or more with HEAVY printing.

And I wouldn't worry about cancer unless the printer is going nonstop for HOURS and you're sitting right next to it. For normal printing in an academic environment, I wouldn't worry at all. It's sorta like the saccharine in artificial sweenter. It's pretty much harmless if you use a few pouches of it a week to sweeten tea. But if you eat six pounds of it a day for 10 years, yes, you might get cancer.

 

[Zepper]

re. cancer risk. Ink jet printers that use pigmented ink (like the text black ink in Canons) can also emit aerosols with small particles (wipe the inside plastic surfaces of your printer after several months of fairly heavy usage with an alcohol wipe (pad) and you'll see what I mean - though the laser particles are plasticized thus longer lived in the body and the inkjet particles probably aren't plastic). Thing is that very few inkjet printers are used heavily in corporate office settings any more, so I doubt those were even tested. The tests were probably done for corporate risk avoidance re. health liabilities.

.bh.

 

[ArenaNinja]

That's interesting. Still, what about the ink for Laser printers? Am I looking to buy a new printer every time I run out of ink?

 

[bruceb]

Lasers do not use ink. They use Toner. And what usually wears in a Laser (besides running out of Toner) is the Drum and the Fuser wire. These are normal wear items and depending on how heavy your usage is may need to be changed out every couple of years or maybe every 3rd or 4th toner refill. When they are bad, you will see it on the paper as a line in the printout.

 

[13Gigatons]

http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Pi...&qid=1217816649&sr=1-2

Large black ink tank for text, 4 smaller carts for photos, grab the 610 while you still can, the 620 has smaller carts: http://pixma.ulmb.com/?p=363

 

[ArenaNinja]

Ok guys, I need serial advice . As I've mentioned, I do not care much for image (photos) printing. I'm looking to print lots of ebooks, worksheets of sorts, etc. Ideal price tag is at <$99. There's a deal going on right now here: http://dealnews.com/Canon-imag...e-shipping/261516.html. Seems like it's 50% off regular retail, with no tax and no shipping.

DO I JUMP OR DO I WAIT FOR SOMETHING BETTER COMING BLACK FRIDAY?

Sorry for the caps, but I have no idea what to make of price fluctuations with printers. Do they happen often like this? Is this a once-a-month sort of thing?

P.S.: 13Gigatons, thanks for the info, but isn't the 610 inferior to the mx700? Because the mx700 can be had for $20 less. :/ (again, pardon my ignorance if this isn't the case, but it's the reason why I started the thread. i have no clue)

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: ArenaNinja
Ok guys, I need serial advice . As I've mentioned, I do not care much for image (photos) printing. I'm looking to print lots of ebooks, worksheets of sorts, etc. Ideal price tag is at <$99. There's a deal going on right now here: http://dealnews.com/Canon-imag...e-shipping/261516.html. Seems like it's 50% off regular retail, with no tax and no shipping.

DO I JUMP OR DO I WAIT FOR SOMETHING BETTER COMING BLACK FRIDAY?

Sorry for the caps, but I have no idea what to make of price fluctuations with printers. Do they happen often like this? Is this a once-a-month sort of thing?

P.S.: 13Gigatons, thanks for the info, but isn't the 610 inferior to the mx700? Because the mx700 can be had for $20 less. :/ (again, pardon my ignorance if this isn't the case, but it's the reason why I started the thread. i have no clue)

The MX700 is inferior to the 610. The scanner and print head are much better on the 610.

The laser you link to is black and white only for printouts and while lasers are great up front the back end cost will really shock you.

The 610 for that price is a steal.

 

[Zepper]

The linked laser printer claims to have a 34# paper weight limit. I occasionally printed on 67# cover stock and even 110# card on my Canons and I've done 67# on my HP. I use 67# all the time for making our greeting cards, so that's something I have to have. I wouldn't want a printer that couldn't handle whatever I want to throw at it. It may be a Windows-only printer as well. Unless Win is the only OS you ever plan to use with it, then that may be another reason to look elsewhere. Doesn't have a particularly high buyer rating either. Look around for some authoritative reviews to help make up your mind. I search on- brand model no. review - to find reviews of things. Doesn't seem to be any thorough review or test of this one out there - comments I've seen: lacks a document feeder (handy for copying or faxing multi-page documents), lacks stand-alone faxing (IOW, it requires computer to be active for faxing).

.bh.

 

[ArenaNinja]

Gigatons, the mp610 reviews do seem to be better than those of the mx700. However, I can see on online forums some people have bought this printer for as low as $70. Are you sure it's a "steal"?

Zepper, thanks for the info. I guess I'll stick to looking out for inkjets.

 

[13Gigatons]

Originally posted by: ArenaNinja
Gigatons, the mp610 reviews do seem to be better than those of the mx700. However, I can see on online forums some people have bought this printer for as low as $70. Are you sure it's a "steal"?

Zepper, thanks for the info. I guess I'll stick to looking out for inkjets.

Probably a refurbished model from Fry's, I couldn't find the MP610 but I find a MP600 still selling there for $99. http://shop3.frys.com/product/5325918

 

[ArenaNinja]

Originally posted by: 13Gigatons

Originally posted by: ArenaNinja
Gigatons, the mp610 reviews do seem to be better than those of the mx700. However, I can see on online forums some people have bought this printer for as low as $70. Are you sure it's a "steal"?

Zepper, thanks for the info. I guess I'll stick to looking out for inkjets.

Probably a refurbished model from Fry's, I couldn't find the MP610 but I find a MP600 still selling there for $99. http://shop3.frys.com/product/5325918

Well it's not that I mind the price point. I'm just wondering if I should wait for the price to drop down some or jump on it right away. I can afford the $129

Also, I've noticed that this printer uses the same CLI-8 ink as the newer Canons. Does this mean that the ink tanks cannot be refilled?

Lastly, would you recommend the mp610 over the mx850?

Thanks