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Need HDMI Cable recommendations for a Home Theater setup ..

A

ahmadka

Senior member
Hi all ... Well my dad is setting up a Home Theater in the basement and he's asked me to find out which HDMI Cable to use .. The cable needs to be 10 meters (32 feet) or more in length .. Also, since the cable will be embedded behind the walls, once its in there's no replacing it ... Meaning I only have one shot at this and I need a *good quality* 10 meter HDMI cable that won't let me down ! I dont mind spending a little bit of money on this, but I don't want to buy a cable that's $150+ without any genuine reason as to why its so expensive ..


Also, this friend of my dad recommended that he use a 'QED' HDMI Cable .. I looked up QED and it seems to be some UK brand of HDMI Cables which seem to be *very* expensive (about $300 for a 10 meter) cable .. What are your thoughts on this ?


Do note that I would like to get a cable thats as future-proof as possible .. Meaning it supports 3D and all .. Should be at least 1.3b .. I'm not sure if I need 1.4 or not ..


Any advice here will be really appreciated guys and gals 🙂
 
I would strongly consider running conduit through the wall so that you have some ability to swap out the cable in the future.
 
Yup will do that conduit thing .. Thanks for giving me the links to retailers but that doesn't really answer my questions ..

However, what qualities should I look in HDMI cables .. ? Do you know of any specific HDMI cables which are meant for Home Theater systems which require long lengths .. ? Also, is there any specific reason why that QED HDMI cable is so expensive .. ?

Here's the QED Cable I'm talking about: http://www.amazon.co.uk/QED-Referenc.../dp/B000UJED18

And should I get HDMI cable v1.4 ? Or is 1.3b okay ?
 
ahmadka said:
However, what qualities should I look in HDMI cables .. ?
Click to expand...

Hi,

It depends on your environment, your equipment, and your needs. If you live, say, near the ocean or any other area with high humidity (e.g., Houston, Texas), gold plated contacts are a good idea because they're corrosion resistant. Otherwise, you don't need gold contacts. They won't improve the picture one iota.

AFAIK, the major selling points of exotic HDMI cables are things like molded strain relief (more resistant to damage from repeated plugging in & unplugging, which you're not likely to be doing), varying degrees of extra magnetic shielding (which you don't need if you're not going to have a significant device generating lots of magnetic interference near the cable), the geometry of the wires inside the cable (how they're laid out and/or twisted), types of metals used for the connectors (inside the cable) and different types of wire like long grain copper or oxygen-free copper. While I'm a big believer in the value of high-grade wiring when it comes to analog audio, it's much less important in digital video. That's because digital data is simply 1s and 0s, and the anomalies that affect analog audio don't affect digital as much. That said, I really like a company called AudioQuest. They're a step up from Monster Cable and typically cost about the same or less (and of course MC is known for being overpriced). I'm not enough of a wire-head to know how significant things like "critical twist geometry" or "conductive-coated conductors" or silver-plated connectors (inside the cable) are, but you can read about them on AudioQuest's site if you like:

http://www.audioquest.com/

(click on Video Cables, then HDMI, then Cable Theory)

Personally, I think the benefits of exotic HDMI cables might affect the audio portion of the signal more than the video portion.

All that said, in practical/typical household use I doubt if the average person could tell the difference, on their TV, between a $30 HDMI cable and a $300 one. Your sitch is a bit of a challenge because there aren't a whole lot of 10m cables to choose from. That's a pretty long run.

Re why the QED is so expensive, just read the description on that Amazon page (scroll down a bit). If having it come in a plush bag is important to you (I'm guessing not), and a "tactile feel" is likewise important (I assure you, AudioQuest & other nice cables are also "tactile"), and you want oxygen-free copper wire (which is actually good, although long-grain copper is better), go for it. Personally, I think it's obscenely overpriced. You're paying for an image and 'prestige' (such as it were) with that cable. IMHO that's the kind of cable that independently wealthy people buy to show off to their pseudo-knowledgeable A/V geek buddies.

Re v1.4 vs. 1.3, refer to queequeg99's postings below. He explains it better than I could. The v1.4 spec features some enhancements over 1.3, and you can read about them here:

http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/index.aspx

and here:

http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/hdmi_1_4_faq.aspx

I'm not going to recommend a specific cable to you because that's too subjective. Find a Website selling 10m HDMI cables and just get something based on the criteria mentioned above. I use sites like OneCall.com, Crutchfield.com, and Amazon mostly. I know Blue Jeans Cable is a popular site here, but I don't know a lot about their products. Reading about their HDMI cables on their site, it doesn't appear they have the level of esoteric research behind them that the AudioQuest cables do, but I don't know the significance of the latter vis-a-vis what you can see/hear from a BJC cable vs. an AudioQuest one. I guess you have to decide whether or not to believe AudioQuest's theories & applications.

Keep in mind that an HDMI cable of that length is gonna be pricey no matter what. By comparison, a basic 2m cable from AudioQuest runs about $35, so you should expect to pay a lot more for a 10m cable.

FWIW, this is probably a better cable than the QED and it's $130 cheaper (and a bit longer):

http://www.onecall.com/product/Audio...ble/_/R-104339

It doesn't say it's v1.4 compliant, but it has to be because it has ethernet capability. And it is high speed.

Good luck.
 
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Technically, manufacturers should not be marketing cables as "1.3" or "1.4" according to the HDMI gods. Instead, they should be using high speed or standard speed and hdmi with or without ethernet.

By jumping from 1.3 to 1.4, you get ethernet over HDMI capabilities. I don't know what devices use this functionality but presumably some do (and perhaps more will in the future). Basically, the manufacturers just take a 1.3 cable and twist one of the pairs so that the twisted pair can serve as an ethernet cable. There might be some other little tweaks but that is the generally idea.

You also need to be aware of the "standard" vs. "high" speed distinction, which exists with both the 1.3 and the 1.4 standards. This is perhaps more important than the 1.3 vs. 1.4 distinction. A high speed cable (either 1.3 or 1.4) should be able to deliver any video currently capable of being delivered over HDMI. "High speed" is often referred to as "category 2" while standard is category 1. There is a really helpful info sheet at bluejeanscable here:

http://bluejeanscable.com/articles/hdmi-spec-versions.htm?hdmidept

Both bluejeanscable and monoprice sell hdmi cables specifically for longer runs (over 25 feet is generally considered a longer run). You might want to check over at avsforums for specific recommendations for longer run HDMI cables. I know that both of these vendors receive high marks over there in general but you are looking at the specific product that calls for more exacting standards so you might want to communicate with someone who has used them. Here's a thread I dug up:

http://72.9.159.100/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1207596

It sounds like either vendor should work fine from a technical perspective. However, note the comments about the gauge of the monoprice cable and how it might impact your installation.
 
queequeg99 said:
Technically, manufacturers should not be marketing cables as "1.3" or "1.4" according to the HDMI gods. Instead, they should be using high speed or standard speed and hdmi with or without ethernet.
Click to expand...

Hmmm ... mind if I ask why? v1.4 is different than 1.3, in more ways than just offering ethernet. In particular, it offers standardization of 3D formats & resolutions and also 4K resolution for future display resolutions that exceed 1080p. There are other differences as well:

http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/hdmi_1_4_faq.aspx#1

IMHO, simply indicating high speed or low speed & ethernet or not wouldn't cover the other differences. Am I missing something here?
 
Ken90630 said:
Hmmm ... mind if I ask why? v1.4 is different than 1.3, in more ways than just offering ethernet. In particular, it offers standardization of 3D formats & resolutions and also 4K resolution for future display resolutions that exceed 1080p. There are other differences as well:

http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/hdmi_1_4_faq.aspx#1

IMHO, simply indicating high speed or low speed & ethernet or not wouldn't cover the other differences. Am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

Yes, you're missing the distinction between a transmitting/receiving device (e.g. a BD player, AVR, or TV) on the one hand and a cable on the other. Near the end of that that same FAQ there is a discussion about HDMI cables and the testing specification numbers are nowhere to be seen in the answers. A high speed cable that passes the 1.3 testing specs should pass the same AV signals that a high speed cable that passes the 1.4 specs will pass. The only thing the 1.3 cable lacks relative to the 1.4 cable is ethernet capabilities (as is also made clear in the fifth question of the FAQ).

If we were talking about a TV or BD player, however, much more than ethernet capabilities might be missing. If you were to use a BD player that meets the 1.4 spec to try to send a 3D BD signal to a TV set that meets the 1.3 spec only, you would not likely be able to take advantage of the 3D features because the set couldn't handle it. However, any high speed HDMI cable should carry the signal (even one that had only passed the 1.3 specs).

With the above in mind, the HDMI licensing body has made it clear that they want manufacturers to market capabilities only and not the testing specification numbers. This diktat is ostensibly intended to reduce consumer confusion (too late in my opinion). Because the confusion over cables is especially troubling to the licensing body, the new requirements went into effect earlier this month for cables. There are a lot of articles about this issue but here's one sample:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/hdmi-version-numbers-banned-20101121933.htm
 
queequeg99 said:
Yes, you're missing the distinction between a transmitting/receiving device (e.g. a BD player, AVR, or TV) on the one hand and a cable on the other. Near the end of that that same FAQ there is a discussion about HDMI cables and the testing specification numbers are nowhere to be seen in the answers. A high speed cable that passes the 1.3 testing specs should pass the same AV signals that a high speed cable that passes the 1.4 specs will pass. The only thing the 1.3 cable lacks relative to the 1.4 cable is ethernet capabilities (as is also made clear in the fifth question of the FAQ).

If we were talking about a TV or BD player, however, much more than ethernet capabilities might be missing. If you were to use a BD player that meets the 1.4 spec to try to send a 3D BD signal to a TV set that meets the 1.3 spec only, you would not likely be able to take advantage of the 3D features because the set couldn't handle it. However, any high speed HDMI cable should carry the signal (even one that had only passed the 1.3 specs).

With the above in mind, the HDMI licensing body has made it clear that they want manufacturers to market capabilities only and not the testing specification numbers. This diktat is ostensibly intended to reduce consumer confusion (too late in my opinion). Because the confusion over cables is especially troubling to the licensing body, the new requirements went into effect earlier this month for cables. There are a lot of articles about this issue but here's one sample:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/hdmi-version-numbers-banned-20101121933.htm
Click to expand...

Got it. That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification. :thumbsup:
 
2 - 25ft HDMI cables with equalizer in the middle is the most reliable method. The equalizer would need to be somewhere accessible should it fail. They are really small so you can install a receptacle box and just route the cable through it and put a cover plate on the box should you need access.

HDBASET will end all this HDMI nonsense but it is still going through the FCC for final certification of the first adapters. Hopefully in just a few months we will not have to worry about long HDMI cabling.
 
For what it's worth, at 25 feet, there is a difference in quality.

For instance, check out these tests:

http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/long-hdmi-cable-bench-tests/hdmi-cable-testing-results

http://gizmodo.com/268788/the-truth-about-monster-cable-part-2-verdict-cheap-cables-keep-upusually

For most people, it doesn't make a difference. In your situation (long run going in-wall), it's probably worthwhile to spend a bit of extra time and money and get something good.

For my 25' run in-wall, I went with BlueJeanCable BJC Series-1. For most of my shorter runs I went with Monoprice 22AWG or 24AWG cabling.
 
So let me get this straight .. I basically need to distinguish between High/Standard speeds rather than between 1.3 or 1.4 if I don't require the Ethernet capability, right ?

So based on that, any other 32 feet or longer High Speed cables that you know of ? .. I don't mind spending a little more than normal amounts if I have to ..
 
ahmadka said:
So let me get this straight .. I basically need to distinguish between High/Standard speeds rather than between 1.3 or 1.4 if I don't require the Ethernet capability, right ?
Click to expand...

Correct.

ahmadka said:
So based on that, any other 32 feet or longer High Speed cables that you know of ? .. I don't mind spending a little more than normal amounts if I have to ..
Click to expand...

I have always bought all of my cables from monoprice and have had great experiences. But I've never had to do a long run like yours. I personally would try monoprice again if I had to deal with your situation but I tend to be a pretty cheap bastard when it comes to things like cables. If the monoprice failed for some reason, I would move up to bluejeanscable. You really should ask your question over at avsforum.com to hear from someone with first hand experience with a cable of the length you're looking for. Here is a subforum that is dedicated to HDMI:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=168
 
Marlin1975 said:
Here is a 35foot Professional 22AWG HDMI cable
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10240&cs_id=1024002&p_id=2805&seq=1&format=2

Thats the thickest wire I see for HDMI. I have a 24awg 25foot cable for my 1080p HTPC setup and works fine. But if you are worried get the 22awg. Harder to twist but the extra couple feet, you said you needed 32, should help with that.
Click to expand...

I think that's the same cable as the clearance cables at BlueJeanCable, Chinese made Tartan Cable 22 AWG:

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/hdmi-cables/hdmi-cable.htm

Price is reasonably similar at $36 for the 35' one.
 
ahmadka said:
So based on that, any other 32 feet or longer High Speed cables that you know of ? .. I don't mind spending a little more than normal amounts if I have to ..
Click to expand...

Why not just get the AudioQuest Pearl cable I linked you to yesterday and be done with it? It's a top quality cable and seems to have everything you need at $130 less than the overpriced QED cable you were considering. And it's almost certainly a better cable. Are you looking for something that the AQ cable doesn't offer?
 
Marlin1975 said:
Here is a 35foot Professional 22AWG HDMI cable
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10240&cs_id=1024002&p_id=2805&seq=1&format=2
Click to expand...

Yes but this cable doesn't have ethernet in it, which I think I would want (to be future-proof) .. Also, it doesn't list in its specs if it supports any of the features given by 1.4 ..

How do you guy feel about this cable ? --> http://www.dcables.net/Commercial-In-Wall-Rated-Locking-HDMI-1-4-Cable-HEC-3D-35-Feet.aspx

And this one ? --> http://www.onecall.com/product/Audio...ble/_/R-104339

And this one ? --> BJC Series-1 Belden Bonded-Pair HDMI Cable

Remember I would like it to fully support HDMI 1.4 and preferably also have Ethernet as well ..
 
Alright, I talked to two Monoprice reps in detail and I'm convinced that their 35 feet cable should be okay for my HDMI 1.4 feature needs... Next question is this: They (Monprice) have various different cable options ..... Here is the list of all available 35 feet cables they have, along with their prices:

1) 24 AWG cable.. $23
2) 24 AWG 'flat' cable.. $23
3) 22 AWG cable.. $31
4) 22 AWG 'silver platted' cable.. $45

Their rep naturally recommended the last option to me as being the best at transferring signals .. But how much better is it ? I mean installation for a 22 AWG is also more difficult I understand .. Also, in the 24 AWG category, he said the 'flat' cable option is better as its more noise repelling, and is easier to install .. but i noticed people still go for the normal 'round' HDMI' cable ... Any logical reason for this ?


Can you suggest from the above list which cable I should go for ? I would of course prefer 22 AWG (I dont mind the extra $20 at all), but the problem is I don't know if it would be easy to install (as compared to a 24 AWG cable) in a 32 feet long conduit which has two 90 degree bends .. This is the reason why I'm asking for advice on the above choices ...
 
ahmadka said:
Alright, I talked to two Monoprice reps in detail and I'm convinced that their 35 feet cable should be okay for my HDMI 1.4 feature needs... Next question is this: They (Monprice) have various different cable options ..... Here is the list of all available 35 feet cables they have, along with their prices:

1) 24 AWG cable.. $23
2) 24 AWG 'flat' cable.. $23
3) 22 AWG cable.. $31
4) 22 AWG 'silver platted' cable.. $45

Their rep naturally recommended the last option to me as being the best at transferring signals .. But how much better is it ? I mean installation for a 22 AWG is also more difficult I understand .. Also, in the 24 AWG category, he said the 'flat' cable option is better as its more noise repelling, and is easier to install .. but i noticed people still go for the normal 'round' HDMI' cable ... Any logical reason for this ?


Can you suggest from the above list which cable I should go for ? I would of course prefer 22 AWG (I dont mind the extra $20 at all), but the problem is I don't know if it would be easy to install (as compared to a 24 AWG cable) in a 32 feet long conduit which has two 90 degree bends .. This is the reason why I'm asking for advice on the above choices ...
Click to expand...

I don't know why people go for the round cables.

Unless you're going to be running electrical wire in the same conduit (in which case you're begging for trouble) or running the conduit itself very near some power circuits (i.e. closer than 12 inches), I don't really buy into the benefits of their "noise repelling" description.

Given the minimal price difference, I would try to go with either of the last two options if you can make it work with your conduit. The thicker gauge will tend generally tend to be more of a sure thing from a transmission standpoint. Don't know about the silver plating (but for $14, can it really hurt too much to get it?).

How tight are the bends? If you go with 22 gauge option, you should probably consider some pulling lubricant. If you do, you might want to get Monoprice on the phone again and ask them if they recommend any specific type of pulling lubricant for the jacket material for their cables as you don't want to use something that might eat away at the jacket over time.
 
The jacket on the long monoprice hdmi cables are actually pretty "slick"...as in they do not catch very easily like cheaper plastic jackets.

I had no trouble running mine through the attic and walls.
 
I got a 35' (or 40'... can't remember exactly) 22AWG from MonoPrice for my uncle's HT setup a couple years ago and it still works great. Of course it was installed into an already-existing theater room, so it can be fairly easily replaced if it has to be (simple drop from attic to wall plate on both ends).

Whatever cable you get, be sure to test it before you install it! 🙂 Every brand can have its duds.
 
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