NBC: Mueller has 4 findings re: Trump Obstruction of Justice...report due soon

[UNCjigga]

Mueller is preparing a report due within 6 weeks regarding his team's findings on 4 possible instances of obstruction of justice:

1. Firing James Comey
2. Crafting false statement about Don Jr.'s Trump Tower meeting
3. Dangling pardons for Mueller witnesses
4. Pressuring AG Sessions not to recuse.

Supposedly they are moving ahead now with expectation that Trump will not sit for an interview. The confidential report will be released to Rosenstein, who decides whether or not Congress/the public get to see it.

So yeah, Trump *likely* obstructed Justice. Game over?

Edits: Report findings not definitive yet...first TV report I saw made it sound like Mueller already decided against Trump on these 4 instances, but we don't know that yet.

 

[vi edit]

I don't think it ends at four things. As to what happens... That's a really legally ambiguous area. We don't really know if the special counsel can indict a sitting president. It's up to Rosenstein to review and release to Congress. Then with a majority the GOP sits on it's hands until Dems win the house. Then we are still screwed because the Senate will not have a super majority to convict.

 

[UNCjigga]

I don't think it ends at four things. As to what happens... That's a really legally ambiguous area. We don't really know if the special counsel can indict a sitting president. It's up to Rosenstein to review and release to Congress. Then with a majority the GOP sits on it's hands until Dems win the house. Then we are still screwed because the Senate will not have a super majority to convict.

These are just the four things Mueller's team is expected to report on within the next 6 weeks... Has nothing to do with Russia investigation which is separate and ongoing.

 

[vi edit]

I know. I'm saying I don't think these are the only obstruction points that will be part of it.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

yo, donny, tick tock, motherfucker.

 

[Sunburn74]

Can we get a link to verify this? I can't find anything

 

[UNCjigga]

Can we get a link to verify this? I can't find anything

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/do...orward-without-presidential-interview-n865421

OK, I should edit my title...there are 4 findings *ON* obstruction, not 4 findings against Trump...yet. We have yet to know what the findings are obviously.

 

[Bitek]

This is the party that defends pedophiles and Nazis as long as there is an R next to the name. There is no shame.

Congress will roll like a bitch and do nothing

 

[pcgeek11]

Lots of speculation...

 

[alien42]

Lots of speculation...

What's so speculative about facts?

 

[HomerJS]

Lots of speculation...

No speculation on what Bitek said, it is a fact.
"Republicans are the party that defends pedophiles and Nazis as long as there is an R next to the name. There is no shame."

As for "Congress will roll like a bitch and do nothing" is less speculation and more of an assertion based on actions of Republicans to date.

 

[pcgeek11]

What's so speculative about facts?

No speculation on what Bitek said, it is a fact.
"Republicans are the party that defends pedophiles and Nazis as long as there is an R next to the name. There is no shame."

As for "Congress will roll like a bitch and do nothing" is less speculation and more of an assertion based on actions of Republicans to date.

You assume too much as usual.

Lots of speculation in the articles that were linked and from many of the posters about the linked articles. It said there were findings. Nobody knows what those findings are. Yet anyway.

I wasn't referencing Bitek as I did not quote him.

 

[Sunburn74]

What's so speculative about facts?

It's still speculation. You have to prove intent and whilst it looks bad it's still not definitive that the actions taken were specifically intensed to obstruct, at least it I'm not sure it'd win over a jury anyway.

 

[HomerJS]

Mueller is preparing a report due within 6 weeks regarding his team's findings on 4 possible instances of obstruction of justice:

1. Firing James Comey
2. Crafting false statement about Don Jr.'s Trump Tower meeting
3. Dangling pardons for Mueller witnesses
4. Pressuring AG Sessions not to recuse.

Supposedly they are moving ahead now with expectation that Trump will not sit for an interview. The confidential report will be released to Rosenstein, who decides whether or not Congress/the public get to see it.

So yeah, Trump *likely* obstructed Justice. Game over?

Edits: Report findings not definitive yet...first TV report I saw made it sound like Mueller already decided against Trump on these 4 instances, but we don't know that yet.

Seems #1,2 are the strongest. Trump admitted in an interview with Lester Holt why he fired Comey

#4 is the weakest since it requires knowing what Sessions would do in the future unless Mueller has evidence of intent.

 

[compuwiz1]

Who's the leaker? Seems none of Mueller's findings would be told to a news network, especially during an ongoing investigation.

 

[mikeymikec]

3. Dangling pardons for Mueller witnesses

Presumably in a 'keeping their mouths shut' kind of way, so a pardon in the event of a hefty sentence due to their lack of co-operation and being found guilty anyway?

 

[Puffnstuff]

This nothing burger is getting so large that a competitive eater might want to take it up as a food challenge.

 

[cytg111]

Who's the leaker? Seems none of Mueller's findings would be told to a news network, especially during an ongoing investigation.

Thats a good question, as Mueller has been driving a tight ship uptill now, if this is "leaked" it makes you think it could be on purpose. Maybe its to get a 5th row on that list?

5. Firing of Rosenstein and Tampering with the special counsel.

 

[Puffnstuff]

I like Rachel's take on this.

 

[mikeymikec]

I like Rachel's take on this.

I'm confused, why is Mueller's report coming earlier than expected inherently bad for Trump?

 

[Puffnstuff]

I'm confused, why is Mueller's report coming earlier than expected inherently bad for Trump?

Because of the facts it exposes. Its obvious that Trump is falling apart at the seams.

 

[pcgeek11]

Thats a good question, as Mueller has been driving a tight ship uptill now, if this is "leaked" it makes you think it could be on purpose. Maybe its to get a 5th row on that list?

5. Firing of Rosenstein and Tampering with the special counsel.

Or maybe NBC is Speculating about what they think is going to happen.

I certainly don't know what these finding are and neither do any one else here yet. I do not think Mueller's team is leaking. They have been too tight thus far, no need to leak this late in the game.

Just wait for the real facts to come out and then we will know one way or the other.

 

[mikeymikec]

Because of the facts it exposes. Its obvious that Trump is falling apart at the seams.

What difference does it make though? If there is sufficient proof that Trump has obstructed justice, then whether the process of going to trial starts in six weeks or six months isn't going to be what's on Trump's mind particularly, but the fact that he's going to trial?

If there's not sufficient evidence to take Trump to trial for it, then the whole premise of it being inherently bad for him falls apart (if anything in that case, the opposite would be true, he would want the findings to go public ASAP).

I don't see that Trump's decision not to be voluntarily interviewed on the topic necessarily points towards the scenario that there is sufficient evidence to go to trial, or that it allows Mueller to wrap things up quicker either. Such a fact could occur in either case (guilty or not guilty) I would have thought.

PS - where I've said "trial", IANAL so I don't know whether a trial in the evidence of sufficient evidence is a given or impeachment proceedings, or both.

 

[Puffnstuff]

What difference does it make though? If there is sufficient proof that Trump has obstructed justice, then whether the process of going to trial starts in six weeks or six months isn't going to be what's on Trump's mind particularly, but the fact that he's going to trial?

If there's not sufficient evidence to take Trump to trial for it, then the whole premise of it being inherently bad for him falls apart (if anything in that case, the opposite would be true, he would want the findings to go public ASAP).

I don't see that Trump's decision not to be voluntarily interviewed on the topic necessarily points towards the scenario that there is sufficient evidence to go to trial, or that it allows Mueller to wrap things up quicker either. Such a fact could occur in either case (guilty or not guilty) I would have thought.

PS - where I've said "trial", IANAL so I don't know whether a trial in the evidence of sufficient evidence is a given or impeachment proceedings, or both.

We won't know until the special counsel issues his report.

 

[Maxima1]

What difference does it make though? If there is sufficient proof that Trump has obstructed justice, then whether the process of going to trial starts in six weeks or six months isn't going to be what's on Trump's mind particularly, but the fact that he's going to trial?

If there's not sufficient evidence to take Trump to trial for it, then the whole premise of it being inherently bad for him falls apart (if anything in that case, the opposite would be true, he would want the findings to go public ASAP).

I don't see that Trump's decision not to be voluntarily interviewed on the topic necessarily points towards the scenario that there is sufficient evidence to go to trial, or that it allows Mueller to wrap things up quicker either. Such a fact could occur in either case (guilty or not guilty) I would have thought.

PS - where I've said "trial", IANAL so I don't know whether a trial in the evidence of sufficient evidence is a given or impeachment proceedings, or both.

Of course there's enough to nail his ass. Any poor or nonwhite person would have been charged 1000 times already. The problem is that it's an open question whether you can indict a sitting president at all. So that means impeachment, but... you know...