NBA: Outrage

[iversonyin]

Originally posted by: KK

Originally posted by: FoBoT

Originally posted by: Fausto
Meh. The NBA,MLB,NFL sucks. NHL Rules...

/thread

You guys don't even have a season this year.

 

[jsoles]

the mavs are one of the top teams in free throw margin over the course of the season...its not just this series.

and also mcgrady gets more calls than anyone in this series

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Queasy

Originally posted by: Patt
Whether or not Cuban was directly influencing what they're looking at or not, who knows? Every team sends tapes of 'violations' to the league.

From what I understand, it wasn't that Cuban sent in a tape. It was that there was a message on the referee site that basically said to keep a close watch on Yao Ming according to Van Gundy.

Yeah, but why are they watching Yao? Cuban's consistent stream of rhetoric directed at the league IMO.

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: iamme
officiating in the nba is pretty tough, imo. ideally, a foul is a foul and should be called regardless. however, given the physical nature of the game, you'd have players fouling out constantly.

i hate it when refs make calls at the end of very close games that determine the outcome. however, in a 7 game series, the refs don't win game for teams.

if there was some terrible conspiracy in the NBA, it would be FOR Yao to succeed.

you haven' been watching this series. the refs have had it out for the rockets the WHOLE time. game 1 the mavs took 3x the free throws the rockets did. don't even try to argue the rockets could possibly have committed 3x the fouls the mavs did.

Box score Game 1 the mavs were 33-42 from the line, Rockets were 18-20. Personal fouls, Rockets comitted 27, Mavs 20.

Game 5 box score game 5 Mavs comitted 26 fouls, Rockets 25. Rockets were 29-40 from the line, Mavs were 23-34.

Dampier had 5 fouls in 16 minutes. He fouled out in 18 minutes in game 4.

 

[Baked]

The owner of the Rockets should hire some ninja monkeys to murder Cuban. Damn, I hate that guy. Kill that cocky dirk bastard too.

 

[iamme]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: iamme
i have been watching.

i understand there are objectionable calls and that SOME calls do affect the outcome of a game. however, blaming the refs for Houston losing 3 straight to Dallas completely disregards everything the players control....like missing shots, FT's, etc.

Houston lost by 3 points last night, but missed 11 FT's. they were 5-13 from three point range.

also, i don't understand how FT attempts must be equal in a game. isn't it possible that one team commits more fouls than another team?

yes, the players miss shots. but when they don't have the opportunity to take additional shots because the refs screw up so bad on damn near every play, and the fouls aren't put on the right people so that 'superstars' can remain on the floor when they should be out of the game certainly doesn't mean that the refs have no bearing on the outcome of close games. no, i can't say that the rockets absolutely should have won last night's game. but i can say that they got several bad breaks down the stretch that hurt their chances of winning. yes, the actions of the first two teams on the court affect the outcome of the game, but the actions of the third certainly do as well. to say otherwise is to ignore reality.

and i didn't say that free throws have to be equal. i said that the mavs taking 3x the number that the rockets did is ridiculous. i don't think its possible that one team commit 3x the fouls that another does.

true. i just think that within a 7 game series, the ref's impact become less and the better team does end up winning. the OP said that if the Mavs win, "it won't be because the Mavs are a better team" and that's what i disagree with.

last season, i think it's generally accepted that david stern would have loved to see LA (with it's more marketed superstars) beat Detroit in the Finals. however, detroit was clearly the better team in the series and actually took more FT's in nearly every game. it's hard to argue that stern wanted detroit to win. in actuality, detroit attacked the basket more and LA wasn't athletic enough to keep up (thus, they were hacking instead of moving their feet on defense).

 

[RagingBITCH]

Bah hoo fvcking hoo. Van Gundy getting fined b/c he thinks Cuban rigged the refs somehow. Please. Cuban is the NBA and the ref's best friends, right :roll:

 

[iamme]

Originally posted by: Baked
The owner of the Rockets should hire some ninja monkeys to murder Cuban. Damn, I hate that guy. Kill that cocky dirk bastard too.

cuban always looks like a coke addict going on 1 hour of sleep, when i see him in the crowds.

 

[cyclohexane]

Yeah, the rockets got screwed by the refs...but not as badly as the kings got screwed 3 years ago. imo, the nba needs at least 10 refs per game.

 

[Gibsons]

Total fouls for five games:
Rockets 126
Mavs 123

Total free throws:
Rockets 138
Mavs 153

 

[NeoV]

If you don't watch NBA games, don't post in NBA related threads...period...

Also, how can some of you say "I haven't watched an NBA game in 2 years", and then comment on the calls in this series?

Other than T-Mac, who takes the ball to the basket for the Rockets? Anyone? No. They have the big fella and T-Mac that draw fouls and get to the line, that is pretty much it...the Mav's have a bunch of players who consistently take the ball to the basket and get to the free throw line.....it should not surprise anyone that the Mavs have taken more free throws.

If the NBA was really conspiring in the playoffs, the Rockets would win the title, and it would be the most viewed sporting series of all time.....specifically because of Ming - so why exactly would they conspire against him? Please, put the tin-foil hats away.

 

[purbeast0]

i just want to know why the refs in the NBA let the players travel like there's no tomorrow.

you never see them get away with traveling in NCAA basketball, but you can see it like almost every posession in the NBA. what is up with that?

 

[Queasy]

Originally posted by: NeoV
Also, how can some of you say "I haven't watched an NBA game in 2 years", and then comment on the calls in this series?

Well, if you go back and read the thread, I was the one who said I haven't watched a game in 2 years. But I haven't made any comment on the calls in the series. I've left my comments to the happenings between Van Gundy and Stern.

Now, if you want to start talking about SEC basketball refs and football officials, then I've got a whoooole list of complaints about the total incompetency.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: LeonarD26
Fouls against big men are not the same as fouls against guards..... at least in the refs eyes. Doesn't make it right...

Too true on all levels of the game. If anyone fouled Earl Boykins (or Allen Iverson) like they do Shaq, assault charges would be laid.

It works both ways. Did you watch any of the Heat/Nets game on Sunday? They replayed several "to-the-rim" moves by Shaq where he was throwing his weight and upper body around. How many shots to the face did the Nets take from Shaq without anything called?

 

[torpid]

Another year, another lunatic conspiracy theory that the refs favor x over y. Happens every year. Let's hope the rockets don't turn into the sacramento kings. Perennial whiners about the refs as an excuse for underachieving or imploding. It's easy to predict. If you miss a lot of free throws at the end of a close game in a contested series, inevitably somehow there is complaints about the referees and favortism.

 

[HardcoreRobot]

aside from any conspiracy, the rockets got screwed

 

[torpid]

Originally posted by: HardcoreRobot
aside from any conspiracy, the rockets got screwed

They got a few bad calls, but they still would have won if they had made some easy shots and free throws.

 

[Reckoner]

There's been some terrible officiating in the playoffs so far. The officials in game 2 of the Celtics/Pacers were terrible also.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

I don't even watch basketball anymore. The last two minutes aren't even basketball anymore.

 

[chowmein]

i'm sure by all means the Rockets probably did deserve to lose the game, b/c of missed FTs. Certain players do get away with certain things. all these fouls i don't even know whats considered a foul. for example, Erick Dampier and Alan Henderson basically wraps their arms around yao and pulls him behind him, doing so they're hackin' and grabbing. is this not a foul? i understand they're fighting for positioning but isn't that a bit excessive.

on another note, shaq does elbow the crap outta some centers, its not called. does anyone believe Jordan was giving the benefit of the doubt when it came to fouls or plays?

missing FTs and losing is one thing. but i wish the refs made the right and obvious calls when the game is on the line.

 

[torpid]

A lot of the time, all shaq is doing is rotating his torso. He has a big torso and people play him very close because that's the only effective way to defend him for most people. You see it often in duncan too.

 

[chowmein]

Originally posted by: torpid
A lot of the time, all shaq is doing is rotating his torso. He has a big torso and people play him very close because that's the only effective way to defend him for most people. You see it often in duncan too.

sometimes by doing so, he breaks the vertical line and the defender gets the foul.

 

[Phoenix86]

Originally posted by: chowmein
Game 5: funny how the refs got together when Jon Barry dove for a loose ball and reverse a call in favor of the mavs. i didn't see a ref meeting when finley smacked the ball loose while out of bounds in the final few mins. a foul on J. Howard was given, when it should have been Dirk's 6th (he eventually scored shortly after)

There was a similar reveresed call in game 3 or 4. Rockets benefited from the reversal.

Cuban is not popular with the league officials and has been fined out the wazoo for complaining about it in public/media. Why the sudden turn-a-round? You'd think all the bitching and moaning he's been doing, he'd have had the refs in his back pocket a long time...

At best I have seen a few bad calls and a few no-calls. Nothing different than any other objective call in any other game. There have been some that favor both teams.

3x the fouls my ass, not even 2x, but whatever. Yes a team CAN foul more than the other, in fact it'll probably happen in most games, get over it.

Rockets couldn't buy a FT and lost the game at the FT line.

 

[torpid]

Originally posted by: chowmein

Originally posted by: torpid
A lot of the time, all shaq is doing is rotating his torso. He has a big torso and people play him very close because that's the only effective way to defend him for most people. You see it often in duncan too.

sometimes by doing so, he breaks the vertical line and the defender gets the foul.

Yeah but shaq may have the "right of way" in many of those cases. The defender has a right to be in a stationary position that still allows the player to move. Because shaq is so big, sometimes it's hard to determine whether the defender is in his space or whether he invades the defender's space. It's been stated for years by refs and announcers that shaq is the most difficult player to officiate in the league because of this.

 

[shuan24]

the whole Finley-Barry ordeal was the craziest thing I have ever seen in the NBA. How can they let that slide? They really need a review like in the NFL. I have seen reviews done, especially when they're questioning a 3 pointer. It is pretty ridiculous that they would let such a blatant illegal move slide. Yeah where is Cuban now?