My Next PC (Any Suggestions?)

[Terrapin]

I thought I would take advantage of the wisdom out there and request feedback on the design of my next system. Thanks in advance for any comments you may have.

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($170)
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400)
Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525)
Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327)
Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125)
Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($575)
Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($62)
Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($250)
Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $3,453 *Ouch*

Terrapin

 

[mikee]

Why get pc150 sdram when you're going to run the 933 @ 133? Don't think you can overclock the 933's much anyways. Your estimates seem a bit high cuz I know of definite lower prices for some. I just got a PC60 case for $175. Don't think the Geforce Ultra is worth the money either. Anyways, here's a few price revisions:

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
--Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($140)
--Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400)--> 2x Mosel PC133(148 2-2-2) (~$230)
Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525)
Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327)
Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125)
--Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB (~$450)
--Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($50)
--Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($175)
--Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($58)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

BTW, check out the FS/FT section. People sell some of the stuff you want for pretty cheap.

 

[office boy]

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406) ok
Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($170) Good but found on Mwave for $140
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400) To pricey, get the Kingmax pc-150 from Mwave for $90 per 128, total of ~$190 including shipping
Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525) WHY?
Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327) See above comment
Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125) again why?
Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($575) er WOW! But I'd just get the non-untra and save er $200
Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($62) good
Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($250) how about a $100 antec or enlight
Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70) You mean that Lain Li has no PS and it's still $250
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51) Intel NIC's rock the casba
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200) yep, but try here for a little cheaper OEM version

BTW the reason I ask WHY about the SCSI stuff is that unless this computer is being designed with a specific purpose that requires SCSI. It is a TOTAL waste of money. (IMHO of course)

 

[GT1999]

I see lots of overkill there, but that's just me. I'll comment on each one.

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
Wow. I'd say this is overkill; also, don't expect to overclock, but you probably already know that since you're looking at a EB. Although, you do have PC150 SDRAM, and 150MHz FSB isn't uncommon now. Personally, I'd go for a 800E - 866EB.

Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($170)
Looks good. Since you're going Intel, not a bad choice. I would personally go with a Socket-A board and have an AMD T-Bird or Duron @ 1GHz, but not a bad choice.

Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400)
You won't need PC150 unless if you plan on overclocking.. Mosel Rev2 2-2-2 PC133 7ns goes up to 158MHz @ CAS2, I would opt for that.

Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525)
Shweet!

Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327)
See above! Shweet!

Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125)
Nice for DAE Where's the Plextor SCSI burner to accompany this?

Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($575)
Ok, stop making me drool already!! (I would choose the Elsa, but that's just me)..

Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($62)
Excellent choice. Maybe go for the 5.1? You've got the cash!!

Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($250)
Nice! Aluminum looks sweet..

Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70)
Nice choice. Sparkle and Antec are also excellent choices..

Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
I personally have both Intel and 3Com 10/100 NICs.. I prefer Intel. Nice choice.

Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)
Excellent OS!

 

[Rigoletto]

Obviously you don't give a fig about cost. In which case, why bother asking us? I wouldn't buy an Intel PIII no matter how rich I was. Stupid. Go lick your own ass.

 

[Vegito]

BTW, Andy mention there is a Asus CUSL2-C that is remove some of the limitation of CUSL2. So if you can wait, I get the CUSL2-C.. I already have 2 CUSL2 w/512mb on each, they're sweet.. supposely the CUSL2-C supports up to 1.5gig memory..

 

[office boy]

No kidding... Get a T-bird 1Gig or something and an A7V.

 

[Vegito]

Dude, I had 2 Abit VA6 (VIA 133), bunch of Soyo 6VBA133 (VIA133)... didn't like the speed of the old VIA & compatiblity. I had my old trusty BX6R2 and it was more stable. I now own 1 BX6R2 & 2 CUSL2s... till the MSI K7T Pro2 w/ata100 comes out, I would not touch another VIA board..

Everything ran on my old VIAs but the problem is sharing USB irq with either TV card, SCSI, etc. crashes..

 

[mikee]

Haven't seen the CUSL2-C being sold anywhere though...

 

[hans007]

SCSI is fast, but for a personal workstation probably not worth it. If you want high throughput get IDE raid, which i think isn't even worth it, just some IBM 75gxps are pretty good as single drives, the seek will end up being about the same anyways as a raid setup. Get an antec sx830 , the alluminum cases are way overpriced considering they dont do anything. Geforce Ultra now thats totally insane, just burn some money while you are at it, a 32mb geforce2 regular is probably good, the gf2 64mb is a waste of money since well, its not any faster than the 32, get a gf2 pro 64mb if you really must spend more than $200. a radeon card of any type is also something to consider, better 2d too. The p3-933 is good, but i think you'll be able to get a 1 ghz soon for around $480 so might as well get the 4 digits, or else just get an 800 or 866 , there isnt a noticeable performance difference. ALso for the ram cas2 pc150 is a total waste, just get some crucial 7ns cas2 256mb module. Heck if you go for generic cas3 pc133 (which is just as good as that premium stuff thats all marketing, its not gonna break any easier and cas3 will affect you overall system by like .5%) you can get 4 sticks for the $400 you have reserved for that pc150 and have a gig of ram. Though that would be a waste too i think 256mb is really optimum for win2k, you dont get anything out of it after that unless you are a server or run 3ds max / bryce / insane photoshop. You can get a live value for likr $45 at compgeeks not $62. The power supply is good but you can get a 400 watt antec for around that or a 300 watt for $35, Intel nics probably aren't worth it , a netgear or linksys for $20 is just as good, or you can get a 3com for like $35 OEM. Maybe all that management stuff is good but i think the cheaper ones have them anyways. The motherboard is good but $170 for a i815 is a little wasteful, i've seen the cusl2 for $140 and you can probably get the equivalent MSI for $130

 

[ares32585]

3 suggestions:
-AMD Athlon "Thunderbird" 1 GHZ processor ~$270
-Asus A7VPro motherboard ~$140 (same board as the Asus A7V, except without the Promise ATA100 controller chip)
-Get 2 X 128MB PC133 SDRAM or 1 X 256MB PC133 SDRAM CL=2 from Crucial ( I just got 2 128MB PC133 sticks yesterday for a total of about $200, however it might even be cheaper if you don't have to pay tax like I did.)

 

[office boy]

The PC-150 from Mwave is still cheaper (and performs better)

 

[Terrapin]

You guys are awesome. I really appreciate the feedback. No; I don't have money to burn. I've just always bought SCSI so that's what I'm used to and the same goes for Intel. I find that if I buy a fast PC to start with, I don't have to deal with upgrading for some time.

Anyway; I will look into alternative RAM choices and Case Choices. After similar reactions from friends as well, below is a revised system. Please; any comments would be appreciated. Thank you.

Before:

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($170)
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400)
Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525)
Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327)
Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125)
Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($575)
Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($62)
Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($250)
Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $3,453


After: REVISED

AMD Tbird Athlon 950MHz ($280)
CoolMaster CPU Fan ($28)
Albit KT7-RAID Mobo ($175)
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 SDRAM ($400)*See Below
2 IBM Deskstars 75GXP 30GP ($165) **See Below
Pioneer 16X IDE DVD Slot 40X CD ($145)
Elsa Gladiac GeForce2 GTS 32MG ($275)
Creative Live Value ($62)
Addtronics 7896A Full Tower ($133)
Enermax 330W Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $2,390 (Includes $180 Assembly,etc)

*256 Cas2 Ram (will look into less expense Cas2))
**2 IBM HD's (Stripped for RAID)

Terrapin

 

[office boy]

Can I have the extra PS out of your Addtronics
I've heard bad stuff about the Abit RAID. You might want to get the non-raid board and get an add-in card (ala FastTrak).

 

[TheNemesis]

Mucho better, But why no burner?

 

[Terrapin]

A burner will purchased after I recover from the initial drain on cash.

Interesting to hear that this board may not be the best choice. You know I'm sort of wondering if RAID is even necessary in the first place. I would mind going with my original mobo and one hard drive; or if I go RAID getting that additional component.

Thanks all. Any additional comments would be appreciated. This can drive a person nuts.

Terrapin

 

[Dulanic]

That price for the CPU is too high. Grab a 900 for about 170 and kick it up to 1Ghz. Im running a 900@1054... Running it at 1Ghz is a peice of cake and should beable to be done at default voltage so your CPU life will not noticably be effected. And get the OEM Win2K for like 100 bucks, I got the academic retail upgrade cause it is really the full version.

 

[PCResources]

I would recommend you keep the SCSI disks, the thing is, seek time increases with a RAID system, and an IDE RAID system, compared to one X15 it would be much slower (yes, i did my homework, i have tested it and this is what i found, if you are going to bash me over this, then test it yourself first).

The Abit board you mentioned is not one i would personally pick, i have had too much troubles with these boards. If i were to recommend a mobo for a T-bird setup it would have to be the MSI K7T PRO2, or if you are prepared to wait, a 760 mobo.

These recommendations are just that, recommendations, but i have had much experience as a system designer and this config is the one i would use.

Patrick Palm

Am speaking for PC Resources

 

[Terrapin]

I went over to the Crucial web site and saw the 128 Cas2 sticks for $100 each. Thanks for the lead. At Mwave I saw: CORSAIR CM654S128-133C2 16X64 PC133 128MB CAS2 SDRAM DIMM for like $125. I'm partial to Corsair and was curious if this is 2x2x2 or whatever term is used for true Cas2 ram.

All your input is terrific and has me seriously reconsidering my entire approach here. I think some of what I was going to do intially mixed with some tweaking of my "revised" system is where I will end up.

SCSI may very well be overkill, but you know, I've used SCSI for the past 8 years in my last three systems so I have a bias towards it. I love the speed it gives, the smoothness of operation, the multiple inputs and I like using the SCSI port on the back of my PC for a Printer or Scanner.

I can see that alternatives to Intel have come a long way from the last time I built a PC over two years ago. It sure does seem like AMD is the way to go given the price/speed equation and its flexibility to be overclocked a bit. It's hard breaking old habits and Intel and SCSI are old habits that have worked for me in the past.

The Ultra Vid Card does seem rediculous as I reflect on it. There are a lot less expensive Vid Cards that will have me flying. Us gamers just can't be controlled.

I have experience but its obvious I don't nearly as much about this stuff as you guys; so thanks for taking the time to give me your input. It really is very helpful.

It's nights like this I wish I didn't give up drinking. I can sure use a nice glass of Lagavulin 16 yr. single malt scotch on ice right about now.

Peace,

Terrapin

 

[dc]

still looks like you picked off the most expensive listings on pricewatch or something.

 

[Noriaki]

sh1t if you've got that much cash to spend get like dual 866 or 800EB You've got Win2k

 

[Shockwave]

Ok, I've asked it before, I ask again....What is the primary purpose of your system? Yes, its damned nice to have all scsi, fast as a raped ape processor and all the nifty stuff, but if all your doin is Word, its a huge waste of money....I like SCSi, but I would save the money unless I'm in a high end applications setting, such as graphic design where you need alot of processing power and good reliability. Otherwise, I would recommend IDE RAID, it is a bit faster and I am a very very anal retentive person about data integrity. Since I've archived most of my CD collection onto my hd, I like raid. Anyways, as for the Abit board, I have one, I love it. No complaints. Some other people out there arent so happy with it. (Note: Dont post your opinions directly to me about how you feel about the Abit... becasue I dont give a rats ass. I like it.) But, you for sure wont go wrong with Asus. I agree though, get a AMD. The price / performance ration is WAY in AMD's favor. I have a tbird 800, it runs @ 1 gig (not too stable, but still useable... ) The biggest question is if you get all this cool high end stuff, can you use, I mean USE, it? I could only name about three people I know that really need anything faster then 6 or 700 mhz at this time. But, its good for future use. Oh well, just my $.02 worth. Get good higher end stuff, but dont drop the money for the highest end, greatest stuff unless you will actually need that much number crunching, pixel pushing, average access power......
PS: Not only do I love my Abit, but I also love my IBM 75GXP...Definitely a sweet sweet hd.....

 

[Terrapin]

Yea DC, I see what you mean about prices. The prices I originally posted were just based on a local store here in the Bay Area, California. When I look out over the net I am indeed seeing much lower prices.

For example; that Hercules Ultra that I had at $550 I found for $460. The Adaptec SCSI card I found for a hundred less too. This was true for 75% of the components. I really didn't realize how over priced this place was till I looked around.

You know, I'm seriously considering ditching the whole SCSI and RAID thing completely and just going with:

NOW:

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($150)
Corsair PC133 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($280)
IBM DeskStar 75GXP 30 Gig ($140
Pioneer 16X DVD 40X CDROM ($120)
Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($460)
Creative Sound Blaster Live XGamer 5.1 ($85)
Elan-Vital Tower/3fans $120)
Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $2,082


Before:

Intel PIII 933EB FC-PGA Coppermine ($406)
Asus CUSL2 i815E Mobo ($170)
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 256MB SDRAM ($400)
Seagate Cheetah X15 Ultra 160 SCSI 18GB ($525)
Adaptec 29160 Ultra 160 SCSI Controller ($327)
Plextor 40X UltraWide SCSI CD-ROM ($125)
Hercultes 3D Prophet II Ultra 64MB ($575)
Creative Sound Blaster Live Value ($62)
Lian Li PC60 Mid-Tower ATX (or Coolmaster)($250)
Enermax 33-W ATX 2.03 Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $3,453


After:

AMD Tbird Athlon 950MHz ($280)
CoolMaster CPU Fan ($28)
Albit KT7-RAID Mobo ($175)
Mushkin PC150 CAS2 SDRAM ($400)*See Below
2 IBM Deskstars 75GXP 30GP ($165) **See Below
Pioneer 16X IDE DVD Slot 40X CD ($145)
Elsa Gladiac GeForce2 GTS 32MG ($275)
Creative Live Value ($62)
Addtronics 7896A Full Tower ($133)
Enermax 330W Power Supply ($70)
Intel EtherExpress Pro 10/100 BaseT ($51)
Windows 2000 Pro OS ($200)

Total: $2,390 (Includes $180 Assembly,etc)

*256 Cas2 Ram (Question: Will 512 Ram matter)
**2 IBM HD's (Stripped for RAID)

 

[Terrapin]

Shockwave:

I just saw your post as we were probably posting at the same time.

I agree with you man. I use the PC for lots of stuff but certainly no high end graphics or Cad work. The speed is really for two reason. First; I do notice it even in the progys I use ie: MS Office, Web Design, and definately in Gaming; and second, the speed ensures that my system can hold up over a few years as technology wizs past me.

That said; I'm getting older and tired of spending all this cash to tell you the truth. I really like the last system I listed above. I realize most people here would go AMD but I like Intel; it's what I'm used to. I also realize most people would go with a different Vid Card, but I'm a die hard gamer and the Ultra will ensure my system is up to snuff for the next few years.

My minds isn't made up tho. This is just how I'm feeling after this long day. The input has been really appreciated.

Peace,

Terrapin

 

[office boy]

Seriously, drop the crucial for some Kingmax PC-150. It's faster then you'll ever need, And it will knock $100 off the price tag.

and "Us gamers just can't be controlled." not controlled? Dude your spending $500 on a device that sticks video up on your monitor...
I think nVidea is doing a fine job controlling you.