doh I just ran some more checks swapping likely broken components with the HP computer downstairs and it seems like its my motherboard...I had a s3 1meg card lying around so I ran that upstairs and it didnt run anything, so I brought in a new moniter and that didnt help, so I took the moniter I had upstairs and the S3 to the HP and it ran! I couldnt test the Geforce cuz it was AGP , but I'm pretty sure its the mobo now though! Any seconds? my mobo is a Soyo6BA+ IV bought from Compusa less than a year ago new boxed!