My idea to reduce poverty and eliminate social program spending.

[JMapleton]

One of the biggest problems in the United States is our lack of ability to save.

The average US citizen lives paycheck to paycheck and lacks financial management skills. Because of this, the Federal Government has had to create numerous programs to assist people in times they should have been able to assist themselves. Examples are Social Security, Food Stamps, Medicaid, unemployment benefits, and numerous other benefits.

I plan to fix the majority of these with one simple program.

Forced savings.

For every citizen, create a government issued savings account that would eventually replace paying into FICA, which is nothing but a scam to rob citizens of their hard earned money.

The goal would be to force every US citizen to put 10% of their earnings into this savings account, which they cannot take money out of, with certain exceptions.

Exceptions would be:
Short term unemployment - this would replace unemployment benefits and save companies money, which would promote hiring.

Down payment on a house - I would allow a certain portion of your government savings to be used as a down payment on a house, as long as it meets a certain house/income ratio, so people don't buy too big of a house. This would encourage home ownership without the pitfalls of 0 down loans which led to the housing crash. Basically making it irresistible to purchase a house below your means because people would view "unlocking" their government savings and spending it as free money.

Welfare and other assistance programs - Most people work sometime in their life, even for the chronically unemployed, this would take some of the burden off of the federal and state governments to fund welfare programs for a while.

Healthcare - The uninsured would pay their own pay as far as their savings would take them, so the burden would be rely on others.

Retirement - Once you hit retirement age the money is yours to spend, unlocked.

This money would not be allowed to be invested in anything except US Government Bonds.

Why not? Combined, these savings accounts would create trillions in savings over the years and flood trillions of dollars into the stock and bond markets would create a liquidity bubble and artificially inflate stock prices. Yes, there is such thing as too much money in the stock market.

This idea would eliminate most poverty and not allow the government to steal people's savings.

Currently the system we know called "Social Security" is a scam. People pay into it all their life and if they get sick one day when their 60 years old, all that money they paid is gone.

Under my system, people would be allowed to pass their leftover savings onto their kids or charities by inheritance. This would create generations of "locked up" wealth and eliminate poverty over the long run. Maybe allow people a cap on their savings account and once they hit the cap they no longer have to contribute, they can keep their full paycheck. Or allow people, say, 50% of their inherited "government savings" from their parents to be money they can do whatever with and the rest is forced into their government savings.

This is just a very rough draft, but you guys get my idea.

Force people to do what they should have been doing to begin with.

Phase out these scam systems like Social Security and other programs and allow people to build something they own.

 

[Geosurface]

What I would favor is:

Complete elimination of all social programs

Forced sterilizations

Forced abortions

Spartan style baby inspections for fitness to live.

The species needs regular culling to maintain strength, and certainly to increase it.

I think I'm joking...

 

[woolfe9998]

What I would favor is:

Complete elimination of all social programs

Forced sterilizations

Forced abortions

Spartan style baby inspections for fitness to live.

The species needs regular culling to maintain strength, and certainly to increase it.

I think I'm joking...

You "think" you're joking, or you are joking? Which is it? It's not hard to see this as serious given the past views you've expressed.

 

[Geosurface]

You "think" you're joking, or you are joking? Which is it? It's not hard to see this as serious given the past views you've expressed.

Let's not get distracted with me, the nice OP man put a lot of thought and effort into making this thread and I already feel bad for derailing it, sorry nice OP guy.

I retract my joke, if it was a joke.

 

[NoStateofMind]

One of the biggest problems in the United States is our lack of ability to save.

The average US citizen lives paycheck to paycheck and lacks financial management skills. Because of this, the Federal Government has had to create numerous programs to assist people in times they should have been able to assist themselves. Examples are Social Security, Food Stamps, Medicaid, unemployment benefits, and numerous other benefits.

I plan to fix the majority of these with one simple program.

Forced savings.

For every citizen, create a government issued savings account that would eventually replace paying into FICA, which is nothing but a scam to rob citizens of their hard earned money.

The goal would be to force every US citizen to put 10% of their earnings into this savings account, which they cannot take money out of, with certain exceptions.

Exceptions would be:
Short term unemployment - this would replace unemployment benefits and save companies money, which would promote hiring.

Down payment on a house - I would allow a certain portion of your government savings to be used as a down payment on a house, as long as it meets a certain house/income ratio, so people don't buy too big of a house. This would encourage home ownership without the pitfalls of 0 down loans which led to the housing crash. Basically making it irresistible to purchase a house below your means because people would view "unlocking" their government savings and spending it as free money.

Welfare and other assistance programs - Most people work sometime in their life, even for the chronically unemployed, this would take some of the burden off of the federal and state governments to fund welfare programs for a while.

Healthcare - The uninsured would pay their own pay as far as their savings would take them, so the burden would be rely on others.

Retirement - Once you hit retirement age the money is yours to spend, unlocked.

This money would not be allowed to be invested in anything except US Government Bonds.

Why not? Combined, these savings accounts would create trillions in savings over the years and flood trillions of dollars into the stock and bond markets would create a liquidity bubble and artificially inflate stock prices. Yes, there is such thing as too much money in the stock market.

This idea would eliminate most poverty and not allow the government to steal people's savings.

Currently the system we know called "Social Security" is a scam. People pay into it all their life and if they get sick one day when their 60 years old, all that money they paid is gone.

Under my system, people would be allowed to pass their leftover savings onto their kids or charities by inheritance. This would create generations of "locked up" wealth and eliminate poverty over the long run. Maybe allow people a cap on their savings account and once they hit the cap they no longer have to contribute, they can keep their full paycheck. Or allow people, say, 50% of their inherited "government savings" from their parents to be money they can do whatever with and the rest is forced into their government savings.

This is just a very rough draft, but you guys get my idea.

Force people to do what they should have been doing to begin with.

Phase out these scam systems like Social Security and other programs and allow people to build something they own.

If only you were king.

 

[piasabird]

We tried forced savings and Congress keeps stealing our money in our social security funds. Your Idea will never work with congress in charge of the money. Every time republicans suggest individual accounts, Democrats call it playing games on the stock market. SS is like the holy grail.

 

[piasabird]

You could just give a child $5,000.00 upon birth and the Interest would compound naturally. This Idea has been brought up before. However, if the bond rate and prime lending rate is Zero or $0.125 it is kind of hard to make any money.

 

[OverVolt]

This thread makes the money system from Dayton "In Time" look like a Utopia.

 

[JMapleton]

We tried forced savings and Congress keeps stealing our money in our social security funds. Your Idea will never work with congress in charge of the money. Every time republicans suggest individual accounts, Democrats call it playing games on the stock market. SS is like the holy grail.

I definitely don't support the Social Security system. It robs people of what they paid in. And pumping a ton of liquidity into the stock market is dangerous, especially when the stock market is already overvalued, even in a depressed economy. Something must be done. The SS system is a ripoff.

 

[JMapleton]

What I would favor is:

Complete elimination of all social programs

Forced sterilizations

Forced abortions

Spartan style baby inspections for fitness to live.

The species needs regular culling to maintain strength, and certainly to increase it.

I think I'm joking...

Yeah sounds great until you're the one being sterilized or forced to do something you don't want to do. The ATOT attitude of kill off the weak gets old. Give it a rest.

 

[OverVolt]

I definitely don't support the Social Security system. It robs people of what they paid in. And pumping a ton of liquidity into the stock market is dangerous, especially when the stock market is already overvalued, even in a depressed economy. Something must be done. The SS system is a ripoff.

Forced savings implies you know how to better spend everyone elses money regardless of circumstance.

Sometimes older people borrow to the hilt and know they can't repay. Sometimes you need to plow all your money into a new business, every cent to make it work. Would college students be required to save while in college? College students are notoriously broke, they work for a couple dollars of spending money. Someone could invest for their income, a 1%'er. Would they be required to put some of their investment income into a savings account even though they already re-invest their income?

You know better so what is your 70,712 page forced savings bill going to look like? :awe:

Not everyone's income is 9 to 5 W2 income.

Why the focus on homeownership? For some people renting is better. Even in the peak of the housing boom in 2007 20-30% rented. Worked well for them.

 

[OverVolt]

You could just give a child $5,000.00 upon birth and the Interest would compound naturally. This Idea has been brought up before. However, if the bond rate and prime lending rate is Zero or $0.125 it is kind of hard to make any money.

Exactly. The purpose of that policy is to prop up assets. Who owns assets? Old people do

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

One of the biggest problems in the United States is our lack of ability to save.

The average US citizen lives paycheck to paycheck and lacks financial management skills. Because of this, the Federal Government has had to create numerous programs to assist people in times they should have been able to assist themselves. Examples are Social Security, Food Stamps, Medicaid, unemployment benefits, and numerous other benefits.

I plan to fix the majority of these with one simple program.

Forced savings.

For every citizen, create a government issued savings account that would eventually replace paying into FICA, which is nothing but a scam to rob citizens of their hard earned money.

The goal would be to force every US citizen to put 10% of their earnings into this savings account, which they cannot take money out of, with certain exceptions.

Exceptions would be:
Short term unemployment - this would replace unemployment benefits and save companies money, which would promote hiring.

Down payment on a house - I would allow a certain portion of your government savings to be used as a down payment on a house, as long as it meets a certain house/income ratio, so people don't buy too big of a house. This would encourage home ownership without the pitfalls of 0 down loans which led to the housing crash. Basically making it irresistible to purchase a house below your means because people would view "unlocking" their government savings and spending it as free money.

Welfare and other assistance programs - Most people work sometime in their life, even for the chronically unemployed, this would take some of the burden off of the federal and state governments to fund welfare programs for a while.

Healthcare - The uninsured would pay their own pay as far as their savings would take them, so the burden would be rely on others.

Retirement - Once you hit retirement age the money is yours to spend, unlocked.

This money would not be allowed to be invested in anything except US Government Bonds.

Why not? Combined, these savings accounts would create trillions in savings over the years and flood trillions of dollars into the stock and bond markets would create a liquidity bubble and artificially inflate stock prices. Yes, there is such thing as too much money in the stock market.

This idea would eliminate most poverty and not allow the government to steal people's savings.

Currently the system we know called "Social Security" is a scam. People pay into it all their life and if they get sick one day when their 60 years old, all that money they paid is gone.

Under my system, people would be allowed to pass their leftover savings onto their kids or charities by inheritance. This would create generations of "locked up" wealth and eliminate poverty over the long run. Maybe allow people a cap on their savings account and once they hit the cap they no longer have to contribute, they can keep their full paycheck. Or allow people, say, 50% of their inherited "government savings" from their parents to be money they can do whatever with and the rest is forced into their government savings.

This is just a very rough draft, but you guys get my idea.

Force people to do what they should have been doing to begin with.

Phase out these scam systems like Social Security and other programs and allow people to build something they own.

No provision for debt? What if you're already in debt when you enter into the programme, or you go into debt because you actually needed the 10% of your paycheck to keep afloat?

Also, forced saving doesn't really eliminate one of the major problems that got you into the situation in the first place - the almost irrational desire to buy lots of useless shit.

 

[Matt1970]

Forced savings implies you know how to better spend everyone elses money regardless of circumstance.

Sometimes older people borrow to the hilt and know they can't repay. Sometimes you need to plow all your money into a new business, every cent to make it work. Would college students be required to save while in college? College students are notoriously broke, they work for a couple dollars of spending money. Someone could invest for their income, a 1%'er. Would they be required to put some of their investment income into a savings account even though they already re-invest their income?

You know better so what is your 70,712 page forced savings bill going to look like? :awe:

Not everyone's income is 9 to 5 W2 income.

Why the focus on homeownership? For some people renting is better. Even in the peak of the housing boom in 2007 20-30% rented. Worked well for them.

I agree except the home ownership part. 99.9% of the time it's better to own. Renters pay more than what a mortgage would be on the same house and they have to pay it till they die or move.

 

[Anarchist420]

I wish I didn't sound like a broken record, but the worse symptoms of the cancer that the State is are the income tax, the payroll tax, the Fed, and the govt printing and coining money.
Another problem is not just that most States not only exist and have taxes due to the fact that they are States, but also that they have the highest taxes since Reconstruction and that are also very regressive.

I just don't see a forced savings program working given that the govt creates money and other high taxes.

I don't even think that mandating that all members of the Federal Reserve System charge a minimum of 33% interest per year would be much better than what we have now... correct me if I'm wrong though.

 

[Zaap]

All talk of forced savings and other such is useless so long as government crooks are allowed to spend all the value out of whatever make-believe pile of money before it's ever even received by any citizen.

So what good is 'savings' with all the value stolen out of it?

If we keep allowing our government to keep using third-world dictator style monetary policy with regards to borrowing/printing/spending money, then what's the point? Maybe by the time anyone "retires" they can have a wad of green toilet paper with presidential pictures on them.

It's truly sad to me how people just don't understand how easy it is to be robbed by a government full of unscrupulous financial crooks. Much of the third world already knows this. The problem with the first world, is we think we're somehow too good for our crooked governments to do the same thing, which is just a cloud of ignorance that gives them cover.

 

[child of wonder]

The solution isn't for the government to forcefully take our money because it knows whats best for us. The solution is to keep spending and taxes low, yet maintain reasonable social investment programs for citizens in an effort to help them rise out of poverty, not a free ride with little incentive to get out. These social investment programs could be college assistance, daycare assistance while going to school, food stamps that can only be used for raw ingredients so people are forced to learn to cook if they want to eat, etc. but they'd all be time limited and contingent on the individual not committing crimes and using birth control.

If they can't better themselves after using the time limited social investment programs then it's on private charities to help them out.

 

[drebo]

Bring back home economics in high school.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

The solution isn't for the government to forcefully take our money because it knows whats best for us. The solution is to keep spending and taxes low, yet maintain reasonable social investment programs for citizens in an effort to help them rise out of poverty, not a free ride with little incentive to get out. These social investment programs could be college assistance, daycare assistance while going to school, food stamps that can only be used for raw ingredients so people are forced to learn to cook if they want to eat, etc. but they'd all be time limited and contingent on the individual not committing crimes and using birth control.

If they can't better themselves after using the time limited social investment programs then it's on private charities to help them out.

I'm in concurrence with your suggestion. There needs to be more personal responsibility and accountability.

 

[Engineer]

The solution isn't for the government to forcefully take our money because it knows whats best for us. The solution is to keep spending and taxes low, yet maintain reasonable social investment programs for citizens in an effort to help them rise out of poverty, not a free ride with little incentive to get out. These social investment programs could be college assistance, daycare assistance while going to school, food stamps that can only be used for raw ingredients so people are forced to learn to cook if they want to eat, etc. but they'd all be time limited and contingent on the individual not committing crimes and using birth control.

If they can't better themselves after using the time limited social investment programs then it's on private charities to help them out.

Sounds reasonable.

 

[madoka]

How are you ever going to stop the entitlement attitude of multigenerational people on welfare?

Like this woman who insists that "somebody's needs to pay" for all her 15 children:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBqjZ0KZCa0

Or this woman who wants someone else to feed her six kids:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ufk7IXdxc-c

 

[raildogg]

Maybe some people want to keep other people down by creating the so-called entitlement programs? Maybe some people are so naive, or conditioned, that they believe that giving people free stuff, in the name of aid, will actually help them?

It is very rare to find any person who has succeeded without trying himself/herself. Unfortunately, when someone is given so much, they become dependent, less eager, less motivated and just grow accustomed to the way things are.

The level of conditioning is very strong. Therefore, these programs will continue and probably expand. All in the name of helping people.

 

[madoka]

It is very rare to find any person who has succeeded without trying himself/herself. Unfortunately, when someone is given so much, they become dependent, less eager, less motivated and just grow accustomed to the way things are.

Hell, the woman with 15 children (she's pregnant with a 16th at last count), isn't even grateful.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/courts...ws-no-gratitude-for-profuse-aid-given/1090453

A courtroom full of people who paid off Angel Yulee Adams' debts and found a rent-free, six-bedroom home for her and a dozen of her children waited Monday morning for a sign of gratitude, a clue of cooperation. They waited for a thank you.

They didn't get it. Angel Adams, 37, said she was glad to have the home. But she wanted them all out of her life.

. . . Officials from most of those agencies packed the judge's courtroom Monday to give a status report. Nick Cox, DCF's regional director, spoke for them.

"Everyone has bent over backward," he said. "The mother has been less than gracious."

Hillsborough Kids volunteered to help cover the more than $6,000 she owes to the Tampa Housing Authority. The Children's Home Society paid the first month's rent for the six-bedroom house and found furnishings. Her rent, adjusted for income and the size of her family, will be virtually nothing, Cox said. He couldn't estimate how much the state has spent on her in the past two years.

. . . Adams sat at a table just below the judge's bench, looking away from Sheehan.

"A lot of people have gone way extra miles for you," Sheehan said. "Do you understand that?"

Adams replied quietly, "No comment, your honor."

"Hear what I'm saying," the judge told her. "Reach out your hand to these people instead of looking a gift horse in the mouth and asking for more, more, more."

 

[OverVolt]

All talk of forced savings and other such is useless so long as government crooks are allowed to spend all the value out of whatever make-believe pile of money before it's ever even received by any citizen.

Lol have to admit that is rather funny

 

[JMapleton]

Forced savings implies you know how to better spend everyone elses money regardless of circumstance.

Sometimes older people borrow to the hilt and know they can't repay. Sometimes you need to plow all your money into a new business, every cent to make it work. Would college students be required to save while in college? College students are notoriously broke, they work for a couple dollars of spending money. Someone could invest for their income, a 1%'er. Would they be required to put some of their investment income into a savings account even though they already re-invest their income?

You know better so what is your 70,712 page forced savings bill going to look like? :awe:

Not everyone's income is 9 to 5 W2 income.

Why the focus on homeownership? For some people renting is better. Even in the peak of the housing boom in 2007 20-30% rented. Worked well for them.

My proposal doesn't really change people's paychecks in the big scheme of things. I'm replacing my idea with FICA. People pay into that already and you seem to have no complaint.

Everyone who works would pay, no exceptions. Even college students. College kids pay into FICA with no complaint, right?

My plan is not and would not be 70k pages. In fact it's very simple. We force you to save and there are a few exceptions which you can take money out early. When you hit 60 or 65, everything becomes yours and you can spend it how you please. It's a forced retirement account.