My friend got a ticket for selling a cigarette without checking ID.. any suggestion?

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BDawg
Tell him to suck it up, pay his fine, and stop selling cigarettes to minors.

All states perform compliance checks(sounds like that is what this is). They guy could have been 20, but if he looks under 27 he is supposed to be carded(federal mandate). It is not necessarily true that he was selling to a minor.

North Carolina laws.

It says they may use minors. Don't know if that means ONLY minors.

 

[0roo0roo]

heh, if the guys a grandpa i don't see why u really have to check id. yes i know ... technically...


but sometimes common sense is fun

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Yield

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

it's 27? I think it's 25 where I live...

It does'nt matter. The key words are "thinks" and "looks", sujective. He was in a hurry blah blah blah.

 

[giguana]

Originally posted by: N8Magic
Up here, they actually hire kids to go into variety stores and try and buy cigs.

If the kid comes out with a pack of cigs, the enforcement officer then goes in and tickets the clerk and fines the store! :Q

they do the same thing here, and they pull the store's tobacco license for x amount of time.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: rahvin

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

In Utah if the person is a minor it doesn't matter if they look 50. There is no legal immunity if they "look old". I would wager you are quite full of sh!t to say that there is in ANY state.

It was more than likely a compliance check.

http://www.wecard.org/Pages/utah.html

Every state has to have them. hollowman said "got a ticket for not checking id." Doesn't say he was selling to a minor, but simply that he failed to check ID.

It is a FEDERAL mandage to check id of everyone who appears to be under 27 that wishes to purchase tobacco. Look it up ass.

 

[CraigRT]

Originally posted by: Carbonyl

Originally posted by: Yield

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

it's 27? I think it's 25 where I live...

It does'nt matter. The key words are "thinks" and "looks", sujective. He was in a hurry blah blah blah.

well here in Ontario it says EVERYWHERE "Under 25? Prove it" So I guess here if they look under 25 then you have to card.. if not, they should be of age (19)

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Yield

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

it's 27? I think it's 25 where I live...

27 is the US Federal Mandate... oh yeah I am in the US not Canada(haven't changed my profile back yet).

 

[jlee]

I've been told I look 14 (middle aged real estate agent)..and at least 'drinking age' (21..told that by a 27yo cashier). When I was 15, I was mistaken for 18..now that I'm 19, I'm mistaken for 14-15 up to 21+. Go figure. Perceptions vary..lol

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: CadetLee
I've been told I look 14 (middle aged real estate agent)..and at least 'drinking age' (21..told that by a 27yo cashier). When I was 15, I was mistaken for 18..now that I'm 19, I'm mistaken for 14-15 up to 21+. Go figure. Perceptions vary..lol

So everyone should have carded you What's your point? JK

 

[WTT0001]

I also work in a grocery store, I have ID'd 60 year olds before, then again, I ID almost everybody Anyway, I am 18 but my age has been guessed as high as 30 before so I can totally understand how something like that could happen (Around here -30 = ID). Anyway, good luck to your friend

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: BDawg
Tell him to suck it up, pay his fine, and stop selling cigarettes to minors.

All states perform compliance checks(sounds like that is what this is). They guy could have been 20, but if he looks under 27 he is supposed to be carded(federal mandate). It is not necessarily true that he was selling to a minor.

North Carolina laws.

It says they may use minors. Don't know if that means ONLY minors.

I knew someone in high school who was a tobacco narc.

I just don't have any sympathy for someone who doesn't do everything in his power to keep kids from getting cigarettes.

 

[Mustangrrl]

So this person just bought one cigarette? Did he bust open the pack? Just kidding.

I don't think it's a big deal, just a fine, it's not like he'll do time or anything. I think it'd be a waste of money to hire a lawyer, but if he'd feel safer doing so, it certainly wouldn't hurt. I'm thinking the lawyer might cost more than amount of money saved if the fine is reduced.

I'm 34 and I get carded for cigarettes and alcohol every single time, I never leave home without my ID... people who smoke and drink know there's a chance they're going to get carded, it doesn't bother most of us, we just want our stuff! Card away...

 

[bsobel]

Tell your friend to sit down and watch Clerks At least it might make him smile after paying the ticket.
Bill

 

[XMan]

Originally posted by: hollowman
My friend works at a grocery store and got a ticket for not checking ID. He says the guy who was buying cigarette definetely look more than 25.. but oh well.

Anyway, he is called to go to court on May sometime but I was wondering if he should get lawyer involved instead of dealing by himself. Has anyone had similar experience or any suggestion? He has worked as a cashier for over 5 years and this is the first time he got caught like this. I wonder what I can do to help him.

Dante?

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: X-Man

Originally posted by: hollowman
My friend works at a grocery store and got a ticket for not checking ID. He says the guy who was buying cigarette definetely look more than 25.. but oh well.

Anyway, he is called to go to court on May sometime but I was wondering if he should get lawyer involved instead of dealing by himself. Has anyone had similar experience or any suggestion? He has worked as a cashier for over 5 years and this is the first time he got caught like this. I wonder what I can do to help him.

Dante?

Ahem...it was Randall who sold the little girl smokes.

 

[XZeroII]

I would card everyone who wasn't on life support. The person is dumb for not carding. I would recommend a lawyer because lawyers will get even the most guilty person off the hook.

 

[andrey]

http://www.wecard.org/Pages/arizona.html

Here is one more interesting part of the law:

Minor Possession
A minor who buys, has in his possession, knowingly accepts or receives from any person cigars, cigarettes, cigarette papers or smoking or chewing tobacco of any kind, will be guilty of a petty offense, punishable by a fine of up to $300.

 

[ViRGE]

IANAL, but legally, there isn't much he can do. He might be able to get the fine lowered by claiming the kid looked older, but the law is pretty straight-forward: you have to card people. These compliance checks are done specifically to keep clerks "on the ball" with checking, so that they don't get lasy or ignore the law in favor of subjective judgement.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BDawg

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: BDawg
Tell him to suck it up, pay his fine, and stop selling cigarettes to minors.

All states perform compliance checks(sounds like that is what this is). They guy could have been 20, but if he looks under 27 he is supposed to be carded(federal mandate). It is not necessarily true that he was selling to a minor.

North Carolina laws.

It says they may use minors. Don't know if that means ONLY minors.

I knew someone in high school who was a tobacco narc.

I just don't have any sympathy for someone who doesn't do everything in his power to keep kids from getting cigarettes.

Yeah. That is why I think the 27 and under law is pretty good. Hell, I normally only get cared about 1/4 of the time and I am 20. Then again when I am cleanly shaven I always get carded. When I have a beard I rarely get carded. Most of the time I go to the same stores so the people recognize me. I never buy alcohol though anywhere. I am not of age so I don't even try.

 

[rahvin]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: rahvin

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

In Utah if the person is a minor it doesn't matter if they look 50. There is no legal immunity if they "look old". I would wager you are quite full of sh!t to say that there is in ANY state.

It was more than likely a compliance check.

http://www.wecard.org/Pages/utah.html

Every state has to have them. hollowman said "got a ticket for not checking id." Doesn't say he was selling to a minor, but simply that he failed to check ID.

It is a FEDERAL mandage to check id of everyone who appears to be under 27 that wishes to purchase tobacco. Look it up ass.

The best part of your link is how none of it substantiates your point of view. In fact it says there are federal monies tied to random enforcement of underage smoking laws. In utah is not illegal to not card someone that looks under 27 as you say. In utah it is only illegal to sell cigarette's to those under 19. Utah uses undercover minors working for the police department to randomly screen retailers of tobacco products. Nevada does the same. So before you tell me to "look it up" and you intend to make a point why don't YOU provide evidence of your point of view. I can't speak for every state because some could have nice unconstitutional laws requiring a retailer to check ID if the person "looks" under 27, but I'm not arrogant enough, like some people, to proclaim that I know the law of every state.

 

[toant103]

Originally posted by: zer0burn
tell him to check all ID's next time.

good advice

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: rahvin

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: rahvin

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Yield
WTF? isn't it his own discretion? if your buddy thinks the guy looked over 25 then he shouldn't get in crap for this, PERIOD.

Nope has to be 27 for him to not be liable.

In Utah if the person is a minor it doesn't matter if they look 50. There is no legal immunity if they "look old". I would wager you are quite full of sh!t to say that there is in ANY state.

It was more than likely a compliance check.

http://www.wecard.org/Pages/utah.html

Every state has to have them. hollowman said "got a ticket for not checking id." Doesn't say he was selling to a minor, but simply that he failed to check ID.

It is a FEDERAL mandage to check id of everyone who appears to be under 27 that wishes to purchase tobacco. Look it up ass.

The best part of your link is how none of it substantiates your point of view. In fact it says there are federal monies tied to random enforcement of underage smoking laws. In utah is not illegal to not card someone that looks under 27 as you say. In utah it is only illegal to sell cigarette's to those under 19. Utah uses undercover minors working for the police department to randomly screen retailers of tobacco products. Nevada does the same. So before you tell me to "look it up" and you intend to make a point why don't YOU provide evidence of your point of view. I can't speak for every state because some could have nice unconstitutional laws requiring a retailer to check ID if the person "looks" under 27, but I'm not arrogant enough, like some people, to proclaim that I know the law of every state.

Hey here is some proof:

"On February 27, 1998, Vice President Gore and Health and Human Services Secretary Shalala announced the launch of FDA's new multimedia education and advertising campaign designed to help reduce sales of tobacco products to children.
The campaign kickoff coincides with the 1-year anniversary of the FDA tobacco rule that makes it a federal violation to sell cigarettes or spit tobacco to anyone younger than 18 years old and requires retailers to ask for photo identification (ID) from anyone younger than 27 who attempts to purchase these products. "

"The first provision of FDA's final rule to protect children from tobacco took effect Feb. 28, 1997, making age 18 the national minimum age to purchase tobacco products and requiring retailers to check photo ID of anyone under age 27"

"Starting February 28, 1997
No sales of cigarettes or smokeless tobacco to anyone under 18.*
Photo ID check required for anyone under 27. "

Link 1
Link 2
Link 3

*yawns* Now please stop being an ass to me in every thread.

 

[rahvin]

You should read your own links:

Q: What happens to retailers who do not card someone between 18 and 27
before selling them cigarettes or smokeless tobacco?

A: If FDA receives a complaint that a retailer is not checking IDs for young people under 27, it will not result in a monetary penalty. However, FDA will use these complaints for scheduling retailers for a compliance check, using a minor to ensure that the retailer is not selling to minors.


Q: Why don''t you cite a violator on the spot?

A: First, FDA chose not to issue letters on the spot out of concern for the safety of the adolescent and official conducting the compliance check. Second, FDA believes the compliance checks will be more effective if they are unannounced. If letters were given on the spot, retailers in the community would get word that compliance checks were underway in their area.

How's that crow? Taste good?

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: rahvin
You should read your own links:

Q: What happens to retailers who do not card someone between 18 and 27
before selling them cigarettes or smokeless tobacco?

A: If FDA receives a complaint that a retailer is not checking IDs for young people under 27, it will not result in a monetary penalty. However, FDA will use these complaints for scheduling retailers for a compliance check, using a minor to ensure that the retailer is not selling to minors.


Q: Why don''t you cite a violator on the spot?

A: First, FDA chose not to issue letters on the spot out of concern for the safety of the adolescent and official conducting the compliance check. Second, FDA believes the compliance checks will be more effective if they are unannounced. If letters were given on the spot, retailers in the community would get word that compliance checks were underway in their area.

How's that crow? Taste good?

You are the one who should be eating crow because they are then scheduled for a compliance check and if they do not check ID they are ticketed.

 

[rahvin]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: rahvin
You should read your own links:

Q: What happens to retailers who do not card someone between 18 and 27
before selling them cigarettes or smokeless tobacco?

A: If FDA receives a complaint that a retailer is not checking IDs for young people under 27, it will not result in a monetary penalty. However, FDA will use these complaints for scheduling retailers for a compliance check, using a minor to ensure that the retailer is not selling to minors.


Q: Why don''t you cite a violator on the spot?

A: First, FDA chose not to issue letters on the spot out of concern for the safety of the adolescent and official conducting the compliance check. Second, FDA believes the compliance checks will be more effective if they are unannounced. If letters were given on the spot, retailers in the community would get word that compliance checks were underway in their area.

How's that crow? Taste good?

You are the one who should be eating crow because they are then scheduled for a compliance check and if they do not check ID they are ticketed.

READ YOUR OWN LINK. The last link in your list that I quoted speaks quite specifically that the courts have ruled the FDA has NO jurisidiction to regulate cigarettes. The FAQ I quoted says that they don't cite people for not checking ID, they flag a check on the retailer by the STATE using a MINOR to attempt to purchase cigarettes. If they sell them cigarettes they don't ticket them for not checking ID, they ticket them for selling cigarettes to a minor. But keep those blinders on and argue a point that you are wrong on and that you proved yourself wrong on.