My actual stance on Gun control and why

Ulfwald

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
May 27, 2000
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Ok, for many months I have scoured the web looking for positive stories related to guns, ones where a victim has successfully used a weapon to defend lives and property. Many people have me pegged as a &quot;rabid fanatic&quot;, when actually I am not. I do believe in the Constitution and what it stands for. Here is where I stand on gun control:

We do not need more meaningless laws regarding gun control, the ones we have do not work as it is now. What we do need is CRIMINAL CONTROL. This comes in the form of harsher sentences.

I am in favor of background checks, but not waiting periods.

Gun registration is another government database on you. Adolh Hitler used gun registration to locate and remove all the weapons from the Jewish hands, and then proceeded to slaughter them.

A weapon is a means of defense, it is a means to an end, it should never be brandished in anger, or just to impress someone.

Parents with guns in the house, and who have small children should alway keep the weapon in a safe place, not a nightstand drawer where a tot can gain access to something they don't understand. I own a single gun, a Taurus 9mm, and it stays in a safe right next to the bed, the safe is a 4 button combination safe. I can open it in the dark and access my weapon at anytime. Once a child is older, it is the parents responsibility to educate the child about weapons, and what they can do.

Many of you have pointed out that aa gun is designed to do one thing, KILL, well, this is only partly true. A gun when used properly can act as a deterrant just by being shown. It is when the weapon is misused that it becomes a weapon of destruction. When in the hands of someone who has no regard for life, then it is a weapon of aggression. When used by someone as a defense, the it is a weapon of deterrance.

Now WHY

13 years ago, my girlfriend and I were coming back from a date when we were accosted outside her apartment. The man that grabbed her had a knife to her throat and told us in very explicit terms what he intended to do. At that time I drew my weapon and aimed at his exposed leg, I wounded him, and thus preventing a rape. he was also wanted for several similar crimes around the state.

6 years ago, I was the victim of an attempted car jacking, this time I pulled the weapon, but did not have to fire at all. instaed, I made the perp lay face down in the rain in the middle of December until the police arrived.

While many of my posts have come across harsh and arrogant, I do not wish to come across this way. I am just a firm believer in my right to be able to defend my life, and my family's life.


BTW, here is another story where the PERP loses:

Late last Wednesday night, Lashunda Taylor answered a knock at the door of her apartment on Chicago's south side. The man outside asked to see someone. Taylor refused to grant him entry. She tried to close the door--but the man forced his way in.

Armed with a gun, the man grabbed Taylor by the collar, forced her upstairs, threatened to shoot her, and demanded money and jewelry. Taylor led him to a stash of almost $6,000 in a closet. The money was from a tax refund and family savings. It was to be used as a down payment on a house, a car, and to pay for a birthday party for Taylor's niece, who was also in the home.

The man stuffed the money into his pockets. As he finished, he turned around and was shot. The gunshot came from 46-year-old Charles Daniels, who had been visiting his son in another bedroom of the apartment. Within 10 minutes, the intruder died. He is now food for worms. Police officials believe the shooting was in self-defense.

Now...how would this confrontation have ended if Charles Daniels didn't have that gun? Would he have been able to come to Taylor's aid if he had been required to keep a trigger lock on the gun? Would he and the other occupants have survived if the law required him to store the gun separately from its ammunition? If Charles Daniels hadn't used that gun, would we be reading about just another multiple shooting and home invasion in Chicago?

Ordinary, law-abiding Americans defend themselves from attackers 7,000 times each day. This was just one story that made the news because brandishing the gun wasn't enough to ward off the attack. In only 2 percent of self-defense cases does the would-be victim actually fire the gun.

Story


Once again, a predator has met the ultimate end. I am sorry that he lost his life, but, when someone chooses this sort of path, eventually they will meet up with someone who is willing to protect family at all costs.
 

Ulfwald

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
May 27, 2000
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No my girlfriend is not 13. At that time I was 20, and she was 21. I no longer know where she is, nor do I care.
 

Siva

Diamond Member
Mar 8, 2001
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Why do I think we need gun control? Well Ulfwald, since you like stories so much... :p

I don't know, maybe it was six years ago there was an armed robbery in my town. Some guys wife was held at gunpoint while the criminals stole all his valuables. Well the criminals left, but this guy (a gun owner) was still afraid they would come back. He was somewhere upstairs in his house when the cops came in. He heard them and fired his shotgun at one, and fatally wounded him. The police officer died a few days later, he was a close family friend and it sickened me. Someone I knew, someone I cared about was needlessly killed by a gun.

If gun control was used in the first place, the criminals could've never held his wife at gunpoint. If some people weren't so quick to grab their gun, then maybe a lot less people would die.
 

LemonHead

Golden Member
Oct 28, 1999
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If gun control was used in the first place, the criminals could've never held his wife at gunpoint

Don't you think that a criminal would have little trouble getting a gun illeaglly? I mean 'cmon, we already have laws against drugs and yet anyone of us could probably score some &quot;smoke&quot; or what have you with no problem.

It sucks what happend to that cop. Not a good thing. But to say that if we had gun control that it would somehow magically make the criminals have no access to guns is really Wishful thinking.

just my $.02
 

Pretender

Banned
Mar 14, 2000
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Ulfwald: That was more intelligent than all the liberal, anti-gun posts ever made here since the beginning of Anandtech, put together. You are one of the few people who actually deserve the elite status which you hold.
 
May 16, 2000
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Siva - as terrible as that story is (and believe me I sympathize) gun control has never disarmed a criminal...ever. I can go to ANY country in the world which has outlawed all private firearms and guarantee you in 48 hours I'd have an automatic rifle, AP ammo, and explosives. You can't fight crime by fighting the innocent population. I've carried a gun since I was 21 (8 years now). I've drawn it 3 times (other than for job reasons (I've been in security and bodyguarding before)) and never had to fire it, although by having it I stopped 3 different crimes.

You also need to seriously consider what would occur if America 'banned' private firearms. Civil war my friend. I for one would join an immediate full scale revolution aimed at overthrowing the existing government that was taking away my rights, just like my forefathers did over 200 years ago. What kind of bloodshed do you think a civil war with todays weapons and advanced tactical knowledge would cause?
 

Ulfwald

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
May 27, 2000
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Prentender,

thanks for the compliment. Lately, I have been a bit harsh in my posts regarding my views/stance on guns and gun control, I just felt like it was time to clear up a few things.
 

Tominator

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
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Good post!

Luckily I've never found out how I would have responded to the same situations.

As they say, they might preach more gun laws...until they are mugged...
 

Azraele

Elite Member
Nov 5, 2000
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Ulfwald: Thank you for the explanation. We may not always agree on the issue of gun control, but at least now I have a better idea of where you're coming from :)
 

myputer

Golden Member
Feb 14, 2001
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Ulfwald I am so proud of you! He really isn't as insane as he comes across in his threads.

Siva- I know three people that were killed by guns, a 19 year old girl that was killed for refusing to tell an abusive man where his wife was hiding, a 40 year old gun shop owner that was killed in his sleep by his son (who had a drug problem) and my husbands 33 year old cousin who committed suicide. There is no law that would have prevented any of these deaths. In my opinon the only thing that could have prevented any of these tradgies would have been interventions by family members. It's not like any of these people just woke up one day all messed up, there were most likely warning signs.

I am not trying to blame the victims,especially since I knew them all, but in the case of the gun shop owner, if you have a child that has a serious drug addiction it was his responsibility to get the guns out of his house, not the governments.

I also think if a child takes a parents gun and uses it to injury or kill someone they should be prosecuted. I think most gun owners would agree. I recently read an article where a police officer left his loaded gun on the seat of his car and his three year old son picked it up and shot himself. Yet the parent wasn't charged, to me that is just unreal.

And as far as tougher sentences go, I don't believe that will help either. Alot of people that resort to crime (and I am not defending them ) feel like they have nothing, and have nothing to lose, do you honestly think they stop and think wow if I get caught I am gonna go to jail?
 

rmeijer

Member
Oct 3, 2000
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<<I am just a firm believer in my right to be able to defend my life, and my family's life. >>

I don't think many people would disagree, including even the most liberal. This should be the key goal for all gun legislation (including obtaining guns for hunting) IMO if there is to be any.

That being said, why would you not favor waiting periods or tightening some restrictions around purchasing guns at trade shows? Such restrictions will still allow folks like you to own guns and protect yourself against possible infractions.
 

Ulfwald

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
May 27, 2000
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Waiting periods do nothing. Backgound checks doo. why should a person have to wait to protect themselves.

Gun shows are already under tight legislation as it is. In order to sell there as a dealer, you must possess a Federal Firearms Dealers liscence. Background checks are in effect there as well. Once again, current laws do nothing to keep guns from getting guns illegally, they restrict the rights of law abiding citizens, such as myself, in obtaining guns.

Here are some of my proposals:

1 Any criminal caught with a firearm in the commision of a crime faces the maximum sentence.

2 Take a life with a gun in a violent crime, your life will be taken as well. This does not mean that someone who takes a life in self defense faces punishment, but the criminal whjo commits MURDER faces the death sentance, but first a fair trial must take place.

3 Parents who are NEGLIGENT, and a child obtains a weapon because of this negligence will face prosecution.

4 background checks for all commercial firearms purchase.
 

jhu

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
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guns are good for pistol whipping people. pistol grip pump in my lap at all times
 

rmeijer

Member
Oct 3, 2000
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Don't wait periods allow for a more thorough background check?

Also, I think waiting periods are designed to give a person time to cool down in cases where a gun might be seen as the only solution... I don't think a waiting period, if the theory proves to be true, is too much to ask in this case. Protection is life long, the waiting period is only a brief stint. Certainly in your case a waiting period would not have harmed you or your family since (I presume) you were a gun owner for quite some time.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
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<< That being said, why would you not favor waiting periods or tightening some restrictions around purchasing guns at trade shows? Such restrictions will still allow folks like you to own guns and protect yourself against possible infractions. >>



Regarding waiting periods, the only reasonable justification I've seen is in order to allow sufficient time for background checks to be conducted. I totally support background checks, but in this information age, background checks can and are conducted instantaneously, so a waiting period really isn't needed.

Regarding the so-called 'gun show loophole', this is mostly a media distortion. I have purchased firearms at sporting goods stores, at gun shows, and in private homes, and on each occasion my background was checked. Why? Because I was purchasing from a Federally-licensed firearms dealer, who is legally bound to conduct such a check regardless of the location of the sale. When you buy from a licensed dealer, there is no such thing as a 'gun show loophole'. On the other hand, private sales are not similarly regulated, so if two private parties decide to engage in the sale of a firearm, there's not going to be a background check, regardless if they met at a gun show, at the range, or over the Internet. So the true issue is who is selling, not where they're selling. [In fact, at all the gun shows I've attended, the state police have set up a booth with a net connection to the criminal database, to authenticate each sale. They can usually OK or deny a sale in less than 10 minutes. ]
 

kintama

Banned
Jan 28, 2001
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I think everybody should be able to own a gun, as long as you have not commited any horrendus crimes against someone. I saw this show on tv the other day about the militia. Man, those dudes have got 50 cal sniper rifles:cool:
The Government is so paranoid about it too! There will be another revolution in this country someday, but until that time comes the government will try to take away more rights and tell us what to do. And no, I am not some wacko dude who is against the government.

And this so called president that we have now, what a joke. The rest of the world is even showing its disgust at him being a (leader) HAHAHAHA.
I think Nader should have won!! He was the only one of them that sounded smart enough to be the president. Someday the american people will come out of their shells and realize that we need a president and politicians that do act on the will of the people.
 

rmeijer

Member
Oct 3, 2000
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<< but in this information age, background checks can and are conducted instantaneously >>

Heh. I doubt that (or if they do, it won't be very comprehensive). The government is usually way behind the curve. Even some rich and mighty banks do a lot of sensitive business using fax and phone - very prone to errors.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
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<< <<I am just a firm believer in my right to be able to defend my life, and my family's life. >>

I don't think many people would disagree, including even the most liberal. This should be the key goal for all gun legislation (including obtaining guns for hunting) IMO if there is to be any.
>>



[In my most serious and heartfelt tone] Rmeijer, thanks for being reasonable enough to agree that most gun owners aren't nuts, psychos, or losers attempting to compensate for supposed feelings of inadequacy. I appreciate that you're making your points in an intelligent and mature manner. :)
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
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<< << but in this information age, background checks can and are conducted instantaneously >>

Heh. I doubt that (or if they do, it won't be very comprehensive). The government is usually way behind the curve. Even some rich and mighty banks do a lot of sensitive business using fax and phone - very prone to errors.
>>



No, it's true. I bought my first handgun in the early 90's, and the sports store clerk was able to call a special hotline number at the state police and verify the normalcy of my background.
 

GoldenBear

Banned
Mar 2, 2000
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Bad experiences happen to people of all sorts all the time. Guns, legally obtained, can do as much harm in this world as good. In some cases it may be good, like yours, but in others' it may not be.

Obviously anything in the wrong hands can be prove to be harmful, and of course something that gives someone as much power and authority as a gun does can make a major difference one way or another.

The problem with your solution, of more background checks, is that it's impossible to know where the guns will end up. There is such a thin line between people in our society between that of criminals and good samaritans. Because someone doesn't have a criminal background does not mean they can't be capable of harmful actions when influenced to do so.

The concept of having a gun is such that in a matter of seconds, you can make the difference between life and death. It only takes seconds to make a difference, and someone with an otherwise good background can easily do something they end up regretting.

And also..a gun is something that I would think you never really want to use, and when the moment comes up, who's to say it will do what you want it to? Under the stress of the situation, you can easily misfire, and shoot a victim instead of a suspect. In your first instance, with the woman, who's to say you couldn't have missed and hit her isntead. Who's to say that you someone else in a similar situation, who's going to use their gun for the first time doesn't make a mistake? Obviously none of it happened, but easily &quot;could have&quot;, and has in the past. For every positive instance that you've had, a negative instance has occured that involved guns, and couldn't have been prevented under tougher/different laws.

Could crime occur in a world without guns? Definitely, but it would change things a whole lot. You must agree that metal detectors as airports are for the benefits of the passengers, as it takes out the possibility that someone could do harm in that manner. Without a gun, it'd be nearly impossible to take over a plane, do harm to other passengers, or otherwise commit a harmful crime. Someone definitely could hurt someone else with the bare hands, but a gun would make it a tad easier. You can see that guns are prevented to be carried on airplanes not because they don't want anyone to protect themself, but to prevent harm. If it weren't such a hassle and inconvenience to set up metal detectors in everyday public places, there would be. Some schools even have them, do you agree that despite the inconvenience of it all, that it would be a safer place there without any possibility of someone carrying a gun on campus?
 

Ameesh

Lifer
Apr 3, 2001
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<< Waiting periods do nothing. >>



what a waiting period does is make sure people have a cool head when they purchase a gun, they make sure that somebody in aheat of rage goes out and buys a gun and shoots someone. thats why we have them
 
May 31, 2001
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Criminals are called such because they break the law. If a law is passed banning all guns, do you think they will give theirs up? Or, if they do not already have one, that they will quit trying to get one?