Muslim Woman Jailed For Refusing to Remove Head Scarf in Court (and then cussing at the court)

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,043
18,352
146
My take on this is if no hats or headgear are allowed, that's the rule. If any rule can be broken by claiming religious reasons, THAT is unfair to people who are not religious.

Look at the bolded part at the end of the story. Funny how that is saved for last, huh?

Looks to me like she was jailed for being disrespectful than it is for refusing to remove the headgear. She was asked to leave and cussed at the court. THAT is when they arrested her.

Yet the media portarys it as her being jailed for wearing a scarf. Makes ya think?

Your thoughts?

Muslim Woman Jailed Over Head Scarf

By DIONNE WALKER, AP

(Dec. 17) - A Muslim woman arrested for refusing to take off her head scarf at a courthouse security checkpoint said Wednesday that she felt her human and civil rights were violated.

A judge ordered Lisa Valentine, 40, to serve 10 days in jail for contempt of court, said police in Douglasville, a city of about 20,000 people on Atlanta's west suburban outskirts.

Valentine violated a court policy that prohibits people from wearing any headgear in court, police said after they arrested her Tuesday.

Kelley Jackson, a spokeswoman for Georgia Attorney General Thurbert Baker, said state law doesn't permit or prohibit head scarfs.

"It's at the discretion of the judge and the sheriffs and is up to the security officers in the court house to enforce their decision," she said.

Valentine, who recently moved to Georgia from New Haven, Conn., said the incident reminded her of stories she'd heard of the civil rights-era South.
"I just felt stripped of my civil, my human rights," she said Wednesday from her home. She said she was unexpectedly released after the Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations urged federal authorities to investigate the incident as well as others in Georgia.

The group cited a report that the same judge removed a woman and her 14-year-old daughter from the courtroom last week because they were wearing Muslim head scarves.

Jail officials declined to say why she was freed and municipal Court Judge Keith Rollins said that "it would not be appropriate" for him to comment on the case.
Last year, a judge in Valdosta in southern Georgia barred a Muslim woman from entering a courtroom because she would not remove her head scarf. There have been similar cases in other states, including Michigan, where a Muslim woman in Detroit filed a federal lawsuit in February 2007 after a judge dismissed her small-claims court case when she refused to remove a head and face veil.

Valentine's husband, Omar Hall, said his wife was accompanying her nephew to a traffic citation hearing when officials stopped her at the metal detector and told her she would not be allowed in the courtroom with the head scarf, known as a hijab.

Hall said Valentine, an insurance underwriter, told the bailiff that she had been in courtrooms before with the scarf on and that removing it would be a religious violation. When she turned to leave and uttered an expletive, Hall said a bailiff handcuffed her and took her before the judge.

----------------------------

 

Kirby

Lifer
Apr 10, 2006
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I wonder why you can't wear hats or headgear? If it goes through the metal detector, what's the problem?
 

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,742
42
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What about sports fanatics, they border on religious fanaticism with their sports gear, if this woman was allowed should sport hats?
 

manowar821

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2007
6,063
0
0
I almost want to agree with you... But at the same time, I don't give a shit about hats being worn, anywhere. I should be able to wear a jesters cap into court, if I want to.

I don't feel bad for her because of her religion, I feel bad because the no-hat rule is BS for everybody.
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?
 

Insomniator

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2002
6,294
171
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Its court policy, its fair.

Now if a cop walked up to her on the street and ordered her to take it off...
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,043
18,352
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Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

So courts cannot enforce dress codes?

What if my religion demands I be naked?
 

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,742
42
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Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

And you think hats should be allowed as well right?
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
9
0
Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

This is not a law, it is a local dress code. I can't think of any case where someone that got in trouble for this and got out of it.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
98,733
17,216
126
I think it is more likely she was jailed for the cussing at the court part. A lot of people get turned away at court proceedings.
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

So courts cannot enforce dress codes?

What if my religion demands I be naked?

If this ends up going through the court system the test will not be a silly absolute like appearing naked but rather what is reasonable vs unreasonable.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,544
924
126
We're throwing people in jail because they wore a religious head scarf? :confused: Nice tolerant society we've got here...

This is nothing more than a dumb fucking judge on a power trip and/or hatred if you ask me.
 

Kirby

Lifer
Apr 10, 2006
12,028
2
0
Originally posted by: Sawyer
Why do Muslims like this expect the society they live in to change for them?

Why did blacks in the 1960s expect society to change for them?
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,043
18,352
146
Originally posted by: Linflas
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

So courts cannot enforce dress codes?

What if my religion demands I be naked?

If this ends up going through the court system the test will not be a silly absolute like appearing naked but rather what is reasonable vs unreasonable.

And for hundreds of years it has been considered disrespectful to wear headgear indoors, especially in court. All of a sudden the rule must be changed because someone makes a religious claim?

The kicker here is, she was NOT jailed for wearing the headgear or refusing to take it off. She was jailed for being disrespectful and disruptive.
 

ICRS

Banned
Apr 20, 2008
1,328
0
0
Good for the judge. Nothing worst than religious people thinking they can break the rules and get away with it.
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Originally posted by: Sawyer
Why do Muslims like this expect the society they live in to change for them?

Do you really believe that if it was some little old lady that has lived in the area her entire life and showed up with a hat they would have said a word about it? Look at any picture of a courtroom before ladies hats went largely out of style and you will see plenty of women wearing hats in a courtroom.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,043
18,352
146
Originally posted by: nkgreen
Originally posted by: Sawyer
Why do Muslims like this expect the society they live in to change for them?

Why did blacks in the 1960s expect society to change for them?

Headgear is OPTIONAL. Skin color is NOT.

There is NO comparison. None whatsoever. Do NOT compare demands for special treatment based on religion to demands for equal treatment based on skin color.
 

Linflas

Lifer
Jan 30, 2001
15,395
78
91
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

So courts cannot enforce dress codes?

What if my religion demands I be naked?

If this ends up going through the court system the test will not be a silly absolute like appearing naked but rather what is reasonable vs unreasonable.

And for hundreds of years it has been considered disrespectful to wear headgear indoors, especially in court. All of a sudden the rule must be changed because someone makes a religious claim?

The kicker here is, she was NOT jailed for wearing the headgear or refusing to take it off. She was jailed for being disrespectful and disruptive.

For men, not women.
 

Papagayo

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2003
2,302
22
81
IF she doesn't like the law, then GTFO.

I was hoping that she get some jail time for this.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,043
18,352
146
Originally posted by: Linflas
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Linflas
Personally I think this rule wins:

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

A head scarf is not disruptive not harmful to anyone in the court and I see no reason why they cannot accomodate her. Would the court prohibit a Catholic wearing a crucifix or a jew with a Star of David necklace?

So courts cannot enforce dress codes?

What if my religion demands I be naked?

If this ends up going through the court system the test will not be a silly absolute like appearing naked but rather what is reasonable vs unreasonable.

And for hundreds of years it has been considered disrespectful to wear headgear indoors, especially in court. All of a sudden the rule must be changed because someone makes a religious claim?

The kicker here is, she was NOT jailed for wearing the headgear or refusing to take it off. She was jailed for being disrespectful and disruptive.

For men, not women.

Not in all courts. Obviously, different courts have different rules and those rules are up to the courts, not you.

Also, we can no longer have different rules for men and women. Women made that clear with the feminist movement. So no headgear applies to all now.

Or do you favor sexist rules?
 

SagaLore

Elite Member
Dec 18, 2001
24,036
21
81
Actually I think she shouldn't have been asked to remove her head scarf. That isn't some trivial thing for muslim women.