music theory question(trying to write a song)

[Lithium381]

I'm trying to write a song in the key of C......i want to try a bridge, maybe in the key of Am(the relative minor of C) are the chords the same, or should i just bump up 1/2 step for this part? suggestions(this is my frist time trying to write a song).......thanks

 

[Crusty]

If you could explain a little more i might be able to help.
Am i wrong if i assume that the "bump up 1/2 step" is for the minor third in the I chord in CM, that would make it Major again, defeating the purpose of making it minor.
or are you talking about the I chord in Am, because if you raise it 1/2 step you will get the I chord in AMajor, which you wouldn't want.

I hope this helps, if you dont understand post a little more info and I will try and help some more.

 

[Lithium381]

well as i understand it, the "bridge" of a song is slightly different from the rest of the song, so i was thinking to make it sound different, i'd either switch over to the relative minor of C(which is Am) OR go to C# and play everything a half step up....i've never written a song before as said before and any insight would be sweet.

so basicly i need to know what chords are in the key of Am

 

[Crusty]

Okay I see what you are saying now. I would not go into the key of C#. Going into a Aminor is a good choice. The key of A minor has 3 flats, b,e,a. None of the chords are the exact same, but you do have common tones.
Triads in A minor: (lower case letters are flat)
C e G - I
D F a - II
e G b - III
F a C - IV
G b D - V
a C e - VI
b D F - VIII

Triads in C Major:
C E G - I
D F A - II
E G B - III
F A C - IV
G B D - V
A C E - VI
B D F - VII


As you can see there are no common chords, but definently common tones. Try some of those, it will definently add some flavor to your song.

 

[Lithium381]

thanks a bunch! just some clarification though.....what is the pattern of tonic/semitonics for a relative minor key? also, what are the chord names of those in Aminor, since i can find the notes, i just can't name 'em i'll keep trying thouhg

 

[Crusty]

names in order i listed them:
c minor
d diminished
E-flat Major
f minor
g minor
A-flat Major
B-Flat Major

 

[Lithium381]

that almost doesn't sound logical....why would Am be flat if it's in the key of Am??? that looks like the key of Cm!?!?!?!? i do't know much about minor keys yet as i'm just now teaching myself theory.......but that seems odd

 

[Lithium381]

anyone else have any insight to this......key of Am.....

 

[JMaster]

oops

 

[KiLLaZ]

Try some of these progressions:

C F G
C Am F G
C G Am F
C G Am Em F C G
C Dm Em F G

Then change to one of these progressions for the bridge:

F G Am
Am C G
Am F C
Am F C G
Am G F G
Em C G D

 

[jcwagers]

I agree with Killaz on this one. Being a music education major(non-practicing at this point), I had to endure quite a bit of music theory. If it is your first time writing a song, try to make it relatively simple at first. After all, you can always change it around and make it more complicated or change keys after you figure out how you want it to sound. The most common progression in C Major is definitely C, F, and G.....as those are I, IV, and V in the key(and all are major chords). If you want to make a bridge, switch to F Major and try that(1 flat) or try G Major (1 sharp). That would be the simplest way IMO. And that way, after you get the bridge the way you want it, you can switch keys or modulate it or do whatever you want with it and it will still sound similar but with have a different "color" to it due to the different key.

jc

 

[KiLLaZ]

OH OH OH! I forgot my favorite "pop music trick"

C F G C F G F F Fm G C

INVERSION!!!

 

[Lithium381]

So far my progression is:

C F C G Am Dm Em7 F
Am F C G Am G F

the top line are all four beats....2nd lineAM is 4 beats, F an C are each two)(G is four beats, the Am and G are like dotted 1/8 notes, and the F finishes up the measure) i've got an mp3 of what i've got so far if anyone is interested...just IM me and i'll send it over AIM
Lithium381

 

[eviltoon]

As my wife told me years ago, you don't have a song if all you got is chord progressions. (That was a painful lesson at the time...) Hopefully there's a melody in there. Maybe some lyrics, or maybe some whomping lead guitar or sax. Anyway, congratulations on getting down to writing songs. It's a great thing to do, I've been at it now for 15 years. Tons of songs, and lots of satisfaction. I relied on my ears when I started out. Theory came later when I wanted to understand why somethings work and some don't. The chords you give are a long string of logical progressions. Man, these's a bridge in there somewhere. Just work with the chords you've got! In fact you have all the ingredients for a verse, chorus and bridge. The Dm is kinda quirky, maybe I'll see how it goes when I get home from work.

IMHO I would simplify for your future song writing. NOt that I'm a big country music fan, but those guys (and girls) can work minimal chords progresions like magic. A million songs out of 3 or 4 chords. A simple beauty Dx4/Ax4/Gx4/Dx2/Ax2 start all over. That 's what I call a universal progression. Anyone can use it, and the melody will make it your own.

 

[Lithium381]

Yeah, my friend has lyrics for it, and we're going to work out a melody line together. this all came about in about 30 minutes of just messing around.....i really wasn't thinking of theory, just going by ear, though i hope to take some theory classes maybe next semester...i'm playing this on guitar with a pretty fast tempo, about 110bpm. thanks for the input so far!

 

[yakko]

Why worry about theory? Why don't you just play it and see if it sounds good?

 

[sobriquet]

Originally posted by: MCrusty
Okay I see what you are saying now. I would not go into the key of C#. Going into a Aminor is a good choice. The key of A minor has 3 flats, b,e,a. None of the chords are the exact same, but you do have common tones.
Triads in A minor: (lower case letters are flat)
C e G - I
D F a - II
e G b - III
F a C - IV
G b D - V
a C e - VI
b D F - VIII

Triads in C Major:
C E G - I
D F A - II
E G B - III
F A C - IV
G B D - V
A C E - VI
B D F - VII


As you can see there are no common chords, but definently common tones. Try some of those, it will definently add some flavor to your song.

The key of A minor has NO flats. It is the parallel minor of C Major, meaning it keeps the key signature. The chords in A natural minor are as follows:
i - A minor
iiº - B dimished
III - C Major
iv - D minor
v - E minor
VI - F Major
VII - G Major

 

[Lithium381]

Sweet thanks, though how to i do it now? since it's the same chords....:-\ it'll sound the same

also, what are the major parts of a song i need to worry about? like intro/outro/bridge/chorus, verse etc..?

 

[sobriquet]

Originally posted by: Lithium381
Sweet thanks, though how to i do it now? since it's the same chords....:-\ it'll sound the same

also, what are the major parts of a song i need to worry about? like intro/outro/bridge/chorus, verse etc..?

It won't sound the same, since you've in a new key. So instead of going I IV V I with C F G C, it would be i iv v i with Am Dm Em (or E Maj if you want) Am.

 

[Lithium381]

Thanks a bunch! any other songwritters out there that want to give me some pointers?

 

[Placer14]

Do the bridge in Ab Major. That'll sound badass.

 

[Woodchuck2000]

Originally posted by: Placer14
Do the bridge in Ab Major. That'll sound badass.

Rock on, the flattened submediant!

Yeah, Am has no accidentals in it's key signiture. It's traditional to raise the G to a G# in the scale though (called the harmonic minor.)
It also means that you use E rather than Em in chord progressions.

The best way to write chord progressions is to sit down at a guitar/piano and play around. Unless you've got a serious grounding in muscial theory, there's little chance of sitting down and coming up with something through an academic process. Feel free to post any progressions you would like comments on btw...

Oh, and good luck

PS. It's often easier to write lyrics -> melody -> harmony -> instrumentation
as it builds up natrually like that.