Mueller talking to congress

[JEDIYoda]

He also is not at all serious. There is this thing called satire that dank and myself love to use to show just how stupid some people actually think.

danks for the memories...

 

[dank69]

So Pelosi has finally made it clear why she isn't so hot for impeachment unless the GOP gets on board: she wants to see Trump in prison and believes a failed impeachment will prevent that.

 

[zinfamous]

So Pelosi has finally made it clear why she isn't so hot for impeachment unless the GOP gets on board: she wants to see Trump in prison and believes a failed impeachment will prevent that.

Trump definitely deserves prison for his lifelong involvement in many many felonies--the least of which being his more recent dalliance with treason, of course--but impeachment will not fail if they go that route. The Senate will almost certainly not convict him at this point, but he will certainly be impeached.

I also don't think this is "political suicide" like it was in going after Clinton. The public saw the GOP for what they were. The actual investigation into "Crimes of the Clintons" turned up shit. Starr actually pivoted well outside of his mandate (unlike Mueller), and dug up some office BJs. The public understood this for what it was.

Laying the factual, evidence-based crimes of the Trump Criminal Organization and their long, long history before the public would be a much different matter. I understand that the Cult of Trump will never budge, but who really cares about these lost assholes, anyway? If anything, it would serve to out the treason of McConnell, Ryan, Graham, and all those other quislings that have enabled this enterprise for pure personal gain. ...and those conservatives and even Trump Cult members that claim allegiance to an idea of "all politicians are bad/Trump is here to drain the swamp!" will, one might think, at least accept that part of the scum for what it truly is.

Make no mistake: putting Trump on trial is the same as putting the GOP on trial, because they are so tightly-coiled in a mobius strip of genitals and assholes and mouths. This is, of course, why the GOP will kill itself fighting all the facts from being laid bare, and is all the more reason why it must be done so. This country can't really survive if the current GOP is not routed by the enema of justice.

 

[dank69]

Trump definitely deserves prison for his lifelong involvement in many many felonies--the least of which being his more recent dalliance with treason, of course--but impeachment will not fail if they go that route. The Senate will almost certainly not convict him at this point, but he will certainly be impeached.

I also don't think this is "political suicide" like it was in going after Clinton. The public saw the GOP for what they were. The actual investigation into "Crimes of the Clintons" turned up shit. Starr actually pivoted well outside of his mandate (unlike Mueller), and dug up some office BJs. The public understood this for what it was.

Laying the factual, evidence-based crimes of the Trump Criminal Organization and their long, long history before the public would be a much different matter. I understand that the Cult of Trump will never budge, but who really cares about these lost assholes, anyway? If anything, it would serve to out the treason of McConnell, Ryan, Graham, and all those other quislings that have enabled this enterprise for pure personal gain. ...and those conservatives and even Trump Cult members that claim allegiance to an idea of "all politicians are bad/Trump is here to drain the swamp!" will, one might think, at least accept that part of the scum for what it truly is.

Make no mistake: putting Trump on trial is the same as putting the GOP on trial, because they are so tightly-coiled in a mobius strip of genitals and assholes and mouths. This is, of course, why the GOP will kill itself fighting all the facts from being laid bare, and is all the more reason why it must be done so. This country can't really survive if the current GOP is not routed by the enema of justice.

The thinking here is that if the senate does not convict then it will be much more difficult to prosecute after he is out of office. Not saying I agree but at least I now understand her thinking.

 

[fskimospy]

While Trump can be and should be indicted for multiple crimes after he leaves office we shouldn't let that stop us from impeaching him as well.

Assuming he loses I think 2021 is going to be a really interesting year. Imagine what will happen when Trump appointees no longer head the various federal agencies and employees are no longer worried about reprisals. I think there is going to be an absolute avalanche of news about the wholesale corruption and mismanagement that's gone on for the last few years.

 

[zinfamous]

The thinking here is that if the senate does not convict then it will be much more difficult to prosecute after he is out of office. Not saying I agree but at least I now understand her thinking.

That's why I think he needs to be impeached on a single article (of the current dozen+ charges that now exist), each time. Start light. End with the treason. Force the senate to go through the effort of rejecting each one, individually, then start another hearing. By the time Trump is out of office, you still get several unaddressed charges to deal with.

Also, don't forget that NY will be doing its own thing regardless of the failure of the toads in the GOP to be concerned about this criminal. It really doesn't matter what happens in DC, as NY will deal with that fucker.

 

[nOOky]

The thinking here is that if the senate does not convict then it will be much more difficult to prosecute after he is out of office. Not saying I agree but at least I now understand her thinking.

I think the SDNY thinks differently, doubt it matters a whit to them if he's removed from office or not.

 

[fskimospy]

I think the SDNY thinks differently, doubt it matters a whit to them if he's removed from office or not.

It's going to be a tough situation for his successor, no doubt. Obama took a stand against prosecuting Bush administration officials but in Obama's case the idea of criminal charges was pretty nebulous. Here we have clear, unequivocal proof of the commission of multiple felonies by the president. I don't see how you can just brush that off without serious consequences.

 

[dank69]

That's why I think he needs to be impeached on a single article (of the current dozen+ charges that now exist), each time. Start light. End with the treason. Force the senate to go through the effort of rejecting each one, individually, then start another hearing. By the time Trump is out of office, you still get several unaddressed charges to deal with.

Also, don't forget that NY will be doing its own thing regardless of the failure of the toads in the GOP to be concerned about this criminal. It really doesn't matter what happens in DC, as NY will deal with that fucker.

Yeah I suggested that method soon after the Mueller report first came out. It just sucks because there are different rules for Democrats and Republicans. Republicans obstruct and investigate conspiracy theories multiple times over? Great! Stick it to the libs! No evidence found? They are guilty anyway! Investigate again! Democrats attempt to block obvious conflicts of interest? Obstructionists! Investigate Trump? Sore losers!

 

[Jhhnn]

It's going to be a tough situation for his successor, no doubt. Obama took a stand against prosecuting Bush administration officials but in Obama's case the idea of criminal charges was pretty nebulous. Here we have clear, unequivocal proof of the commission of multiple felonies by the president. I don't see how you can just brush that off without serious consequences.

I figure the 46th President will be Mike Pence, if only for a day, so that he can pardon Trump.

 

[fskimospy]

I figure the 46th President will be Mike Pence, if only for a day, so that he can pardon Trump.

If Trump loses I strongly suspect he will try to get Pence to do this, agreed. It will be interesting to see what Pence does as he'll be tying his entire future to Trumpism for a guy who just lost as his reputation with the rest of the country would be utterly destroyed for the rest of his life.

 

[Indus]

If Trump loses I strongly suspect he will try to get Pence to do this, agreed. It will be interesting to see what Pence does as he'll be tying his entire future to Trumpism for a guy who just lost as his reputation with the rest of the country would be utterly destroyed for the rest of his life.

The President can't pardon state crimes though. And if Pence is smart, he'll do what Ford did.. pardon only crimes while in office.

 

[soundforbjt]

I figure the 46th President will be Mike Pence, if only for a day, so that he can pardon Trump.

You left out "and his spawn".

 

[fskimospy]

The President can't pardon state crimes though. And if Pence is smart, he'll do what Ford did.. pardon only crimes while in office.

I don't think that matters much. If he pardons Trump in any way his standing with the non-Trump rest of the country will be destroyed, just as Ford's was. It's just a question of whether or not Pence is willing to do that and become a hero to Trumpworld while being held in contempt by everyone else.

As for the state crimes yes, a pardon may not be enough to keep Trump out of prison anyway.

 

[Maxima1]

The President can't pardon state crimes though. And if Pence is smart, he'll do what Ford did.. pardon only crimes while in office.

It's not necessarily going to be a smart thing for him to do. And hopefully we eventually get to impeaching Donnie because that should lower the odds of Pence doing this.

 

[Indus]

I don't think that matters much. If he pardons Trump in any way his standing with the non-Trump rest of the country will be destroyed, just as Ford's was. It's just a question of whether or not Pence is willing to do that and become a hero to Trumpworld while being held in contempt by everyone else.

As for the state crimes yes, a pardon may not be enough to keep Trump out of prison anyway.

Ofcourse he will. He cares about the Trump faction more than anyone because he hopes someday he'll inherit them.

 

[soundforbjt]

I don't think that matters much. If he pardons Trump in any way his standing with the non-Trump rest of the country will be destroyed, just as Ford's was. It's just a question of whether or not Pence is willing to do that and become a hero to Trumpworld while being held in contempt by everyone else.

As for the state crimes yes, a pardon may not be enough to keep Trump out of prison anyway.

I doubt Trump would spend a day in prison, his lawyers would keep it tied up in courts forever.

 

[Indus]

I doubt Trump would spend a day in prison, his lawyers would keep it tied up in courts forever.

You mean the same lawyers who can't wait to stop working for Trump and he stiffs them all the time?

And the best example is Don McGahn.

 

[fskimospy]

I doubt Trump would spend a day in prison, his lawyers would keep it tied up in courts forever.

Certainly possible, I guess we'll have to see.

 

[soundforbjt]

Certainly possible, I guess we'll have to see.

Worse case scenario, house arrest at Mar-A-Lago with SS protection.

 

[fskimospy]

Worse case scenario, house arrest at Mar-A-Lago with SS protection.

Not so sure about that, considering he is at substantial risk of indictment in New York State as well. Something tells me they wouldn't let him serve his sentence out of state.

I think people may be seriously underestimating the amount of legal jeopardy Trump could find himself in when 2021 comes around. He got away with a lot of shady shit in the past because he had money and he basically paid people off to let it slide. They were happy to do so because there was no advantage to going after him. Now, especially in NYS, the political incentives are very different. As I've said before if I were an AG or DA with eyes on higher office and I found a case against Trump that I could use I'd go for it. You want to be the next governor? Convict Trump of something and you're golden.

 

[soundforbjt]

Not so sure about that, considering he is at substantial risk of indictment in New York State as well. Something tells me they wouldn't let him serve his sentence out of state.

I think people may be seriously underestimating the amount of legal jeopardy Trump could find himself in when 2021 comes around. He got away with a lot of shady shit in the past because he had money and he basically paid people off to let it slide. They were happy to do so because there was no advantage to going after him. Now, especially in NYS, the political incentives are very different. As I've said before if I were an AG or DA with eyes on higher office and I found a case against Trump that I could use I'd go for it. You want to be the next governor? Convict Trump of something and you're golden.

Ok, Trump National Golf Club, Westchester: Located some 30 minutes from Manhattan.

 

[Maxima1]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/21/...-book-deal.html#click=https://t.co/U88sGnj9yc

Andrew Weissmann, a Top Mueller Prosecutor, Has a Book Deal

Seems like everyone wants a slice of that pie. How long before we find out that Mueller has a book deal?

 

[Viper1j]

Exactly how are the people at CBP different from the guards at Auschwitz and Treblinka?

Jeff Dahmer would be proud.

https://www.propublica.org/article/...-joke-about-migrant-deaths-post-sexist-memes#

Inside the Secret Border Patrol Facebook Group Where Agents Joke About Migrant Deaths and Post Sexist Memes
The three-year-old group, which has roughly 9,500 members, shared derogatory comments about Latina lawmakers who plan to visit a controversial Texas detention facility on Monday, calling them “scum buckets” and “hoes.”

Members of a secret Facebook group for current and former Border Patrol agents joked about the deaths of migrants, discussed throwing burritos at Latino members of Congress visiting a detention facility in Texas on Monday and posted a vulgar illustration depicting Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez engaged in oral sex with a detained migrant, according to screenshots of their postings.

In one exchange, group members responded with indifference and wisecracks to the post of a news story about a 16-year-old Guatemalan migrant who died in May while in custody at a Border Patrol station in Weslaco, Texas. One member posted a GIF of Elmo with the quote, “Oh well.” Another responded with an image and the words “If he dies, he dies.”

Created in August 2016, the Facebook group is called “I’m 10-15” and boasts roughly 9,500 members from across the country. (10-15 is Border Patrol code for “aliens in custody.”) The group described itself, in an online introduction, as a forum for “funny” and “serious” discussion about work with the patrol. “Remember you are never alone in this family,” the introduction said



Responsible for policing the nation’s southern and northern boundaries, the Border Patrol has come under intense scrutiny as the Trump administration takes new, more aggressive measures to halt the influx of undocumented migrants across the United States-Mexico border. The patrol’s approximately 20,000 agents serve under the broader U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency, which has been faulted for allegedly mistreating children and adults in its custody. The agency’s leadership has been in turmoil, with its most recent acting chief, John Sanders, resigning last week.

ProPublica received images of several recent discussions in the 10-15 Facebook group and was able to link the participants in those online conversations to apparently legitimate Facebook profiles belonging to Border Patrol agents, including a supervisor based in El Paso, Texas, and an agent in Eagle Pass, Texas. ProPublica has so far been unable to reach the group members who made the postings.

ProPublica contacted three spokespeople for CBP in regard to the Facebook group and provided the names of three agents who appear to have participated in the online chats. CBP hasn’t yet responded.

“These comments and memes are extremely troubling,” said Daniel Martinez, a sociologist at the University of Arizona in Tucson who studies the border. “They’re clearly xenophobic and sexist.”

The postings, in his view, reflect what “seems to be a pervasive culture of cruelty aimed at immigrants within CBP. This isn’t just a few rogue agents or ‘bad apples.’”

The Border Patrol Facebook group is the most recent example of some law enforcement personnel behaving badly in public and private digital spaces. An investigation by Reveal uncovered hundreds of active-duty and retired law enforcement officers who moved in extremist Facebook circles, including white supremacist and anti-government groups. A team of researchers calling themselves the Plain View Project recently released a hefty database of offensive Facebook posts made by current and ex-law enforcement officers.

And in early 2018, federal investigators found a raft of disturbing and racist text messages sent by Border Patrol agents in southern Arizona after searching the phone of Matthew Bowen, an agent charged with running down a Guatemalan migrant with a Ford F-150 pickup truck. The texts, which were revealed in a court filing in federal court in Tucson, described migrants as “guats,” “wild ass shitbags,” “beaners” and “subhuman.” The messages included repeated discussions about burning the migrants up.

Several of the postings reviewed by ProPublica refer to the planned visit by members of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, including Ocasio-Cortez and Rep. Veronica Escobar, to a troubled Border Patrol facility outside of El Paso. Agents at the compound in Clint, Texas, have been accused of holding children in neglectful, inhumane conditions.

Members of the Border Patrol Facebook group were not enthused about the tour, noting that Ocasio-Cortez, a Democrat from Queens, had compared Border Patrol facilities to Nazi concentration camps. Escobar is a freshman Democrat representing El Paso.

One member encouraged Border Patrol agents to hurl a “burrito at these bitches.” Another, apparently a patrol supervisor, wrote, “Fuck the hoes.” “There should be no photo ops for these scum buckets,” posted a third member.

Perhaps the most disturbing posts target Ocasio-Cortez. One includes a photo illustration of her engaged in oral sex at an immigrant detention center. Text accompanying the image reads, “Lucky Illegal Immigrant Glory Hole Special Starring AOC.”

Another is a photo illustration of a smiling President Donald Trump forcing Ocasio-Cortez’s head toward his crotch. The agent who posted the image commented: “That’s right bitches. The masses have spoken and today democracy won.”

The posts about Escobar and Ocasio-Cortez are “vile and sexist,” said a staffer for Escobar. “Furthermore, the comments made by Border Patrol agents towards immigrants, especially those that have lost their lives, are disgusting and show a complete disregard for human life and dignity.”



The head of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, Joaquin Castro, reviewed the Facebook discussions and was incensed. “It confirms some of the worst criticisms of Customs and Border Protection,” said Castro, a Democrat who represents San Antonio. “These are clearly agents who are desensitized to the point of being dangerous to migrants and their co-workers.” He added that the agents who made the vulgar comments “don’t deserve to wear any uniform representing the United States of America.”

Vicki Gaubeca, director of the Southern Border Communities Coalition, said the postings are more evidence of the sexism and misogyny that has long plagued the Border Patrol. “That’s why they’re the worst at recruiting women,” said Gaubeca, whose group works to reform the agency. “They have the lowest percentage of female agents or officers of any federal law enforcement agency.”

In another thread, a group member posted a photo of father and his 23-month-old daughter lying face down in the Rio Grande. The pair drowned while trying to ford the river and cross into the U.S.; pictures of the two have circulated widely online in recent days, generating an outcry.

The member asked if the photo could have been faked because the bodies were so “clean.” (The picture was taken by an Associated Press photographer, and there is no indication that it was staged or manipulated.) “I HAVE NEVER SEEN FLOATERS LIKE THIS,” the person wrote, adding, “could this be another edited photo. We’ve all seen the dems and liberal parties do some pretty sick things…”

 

[nickqt]

I mean, they really are fucking deplorable.

HRC's only mistake was voicing it out loud.