Moving to North Carolina (Raleigh/Durham area) next year, any advice?

[trmiv]

So after living in the SF Bay Area in California our entire lives, my wife and I have decided if we want to ever buy a house and have kids, we need to leave. We've settled on the Raleigh/Durham area of North Carolina, because it seems to offer everything we're looking for (jobs, cheap housing, decent amount to do, not a far drive from the ocean, lots of auto racing because I drive race cars). Plus know some people who have moved there and really enjoy it. My co-worker's family is from there and he visits often and loves it.

Anyway, we've convinced my retired parents to move as well. So they will move before us, and when my wife is done teaching this school year (June 2007), we will move back there and live with them until we find jobs and a house. They are actually going there next month for a week to scout out areas, look for houses, etc. Anyone have advice for areas to look for in that area? My parents want some land, like 2-3 acres. My wife and I don't want a big lot, just a normal house with a decent backyard. We've been looking a lot at Cary, NC, we've heard from people we know that's a nice place to live.

BTW, I do desktop support and my wife is a teacher.

 

[daveshel]

1. Don't.

2. If you choose not to listen to #1, at least don't consider Durham. I spent 4 years there in the mid 90s. Durham is unlike any city I've ever seen. Most places have fairly distinct nice areas/no so nice areas. Durham is one big not-so-nice area with little pockets of nice here and there. Pretty much the whole town is the other side of the tracks. Even in expensive complexes around Duke and RTP you are right next to Section 8 housing.

The climate isn't too bad, but they have no snow removal equipment, so the slightest bit of winter weather tends to cause big problems. And it is nice to have the ocean a few hours away in one direction and the mountains in another.

But the culture was want really drove me away. While I was there, a jury acquitted a white Durham homewoner who shot (and killed) a black youth in the back while the youth was running away from the home after an aborted burglary attempt. Southern Man is still very much alive even in the 'new south' and will never accept you if you weren't born there.

 

[Carbo]

Originally posted by: daveshel
1. Don't.

Worth repeating.

 

[trmiv]

I didn't say we'd be living in Durham. Likely Cary, Apex, Knightdale or somewhere around that area, closer to the Raleigh side. Of all the areas that we've researched that we would actually consider living, it seems like the best place. Neither one of us want to live in the midwest, or anywhere it snows a lot (I can deal with some, just not massive snow), so that limits our choices. Plus I drive late model stock cars, which is big in that area, so that might up my acceptance factor a bit.

 

[UDT89]

i visited a friend recently down there, about 2 weeks ago.

i think the area was called morrisville?

there are a lot of nice areas around there, just no where near durham or raleigh.

 

[fbrdphreak]

Why are people saying don't move here? Raleigh rocks. Like you said, cheap housing, jobs aren't in short supply, lots to do, not far from anywhere in NC.

North Raleigh has some nice places, but expensive and upper class. Depending where you want to live and work, South & South East Raleigh are less developed areas where you can get a lot of cheap houses & land. Specifically most of it is outside of Raleigh city limits, in towns like Garner. Morrisville is kinda between Raleigh, Durham, and RTP. There are some nice places for reasonable prices there too.

There is like one nice area of Durham, but still don't move there. They have high taxes & fees and frankly I'd be concerned about reselling the house later. Durham is a war zone, literally.

Cary is very nice, voted one of the best places in America to live. But its more expensive than Raleigh

You can use Raleigh Craig's List to scout out some nice areas. Also http://www.fmrealty.com has RTP-area specific real estate listings.

Any other questions feel free to PM me. The gf & I researched to buy our condo and she is researching now to get a house within the next year, so we're getting more and more knowledgeable about this.

EDIT Didn't notice your wife is a teacher. She shouldn't have trouble getting a job, but the pay is ******. I know that's std for the US, but it may be lower than where you are. My Mom's been a teacher all her life, been there done that.
What kind of desktop support do you do? I hear there are a lot of good IT opportunities with the State right now; supporting either K-12 public schools or you can search the individual universities' websites for college support jobs. I saw a listing that ended a few weeks ago for a job that was basically setting up PC's and fixing simple Windows/hardware problems starting with a range of $40-60K salary :Q And full benefits of course

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

I'd love to find a nice place outside Nor Cal too. We were blessed to get a house before the boom officially hit Sacramento, so a move out of state would probably mean paying cash for a house, but, realistically I haven't seen anywhere else I'd like half as much.

So let us know how you like it out there.

 

[Vette73]

What fbrdphreak is true.

I grew up in wilmington NC and after college moved to Raleigh. Now me and my new bride live in Cary.

Good middle ground for everything. Even good colleges for future kids if you plan on living your life here.

 

[trmiv]

Originally posted by: fbrdphreak
Why are people saying don't move here? Raleigh rocks. Like you said, cheap housing, jobs aren't in short supply, lots to do, not far from anywhere in NC.

North Raleigh has some nice places, but expensive and upper class. Depending where you want to live and work, South & South East Raleigh are less developed areas where you can get a lot of cheap houses & land. Specifically most of it is outside of Raleigh city limits, in towns like Garner. Morrisville is kinda between Raleigh, Durham, and RTP. There are some nice places for reasonable prices there too.

There is like one nice area of Durham, but still don't move there. They have high taxes & fees and frankly I'd be concerned about reselling the house later. Durham is a war zone, literally.

Cary is very nice, voted one of the best places in America to live. But its more expensive than Raleigh

You can use Raleigh Craig's List to scout out some nice areas. Also http://www.fmrealty.com has RTP-area specific real estate listings.

Any other questions feel free to PM me. The gf & I researched to buy our condo and she is researching now to get a house within the next year, so we're getting more and more knowledgeable about this.

EDIT Didn't notice your wife is a teacher. She shouldn't have trouble getting a job, but the pay is ******. I know that's std for the US, but it may be lower than where you are. My Mom's been a teacher all her life, been there done that.
What kind of desktop support do you do? I hear there are a lot of good IT opportunities with the State right now; supporting either K-12 public schools or you can search the individual universities' websites for college support jobs. I saw a listing that ended a few weeks ago for a job that was basically setting up PC's and fixing simple Windows/hardware problems starting with a range of $40-60K salary :Q And full benefits of course

Thanks for the advice. Yea, we never considered Durham. We're looking in Raleigh, and the areas south of Raleigh

Basically we're looking for an area we can start a life. In California we are resigned to the fact we will never be able to afford a home anywhere near where we work. It's gotten too out of control when in the area you grew up a 800sq/ft condo is $375,000. We pay $1730/month currently for a 760sq/ft 1 bedroom apartment! It's bleeding me dry! The thought of starting a family while living in a damn apartment is not a pleasant one to me.

We've already taken into consideration what my wife would make. Luckily for jobs like teaching, the pay scale is right out there and available to look at easily. So based on her two years of teaching (English BTW), we know exactly what she'll make. Me, I do desktop support at Kaiser Permanente right now (large HMO), so it's a lot of Windows 2000, XP, account creation, Lotus Notes, hardware installation, plus support of a lot of Kaiser specific apps, etc. Regular desktop support stuff, with a bit of administration thrown in.

Basically if I get a job making anywhere near what I make now (which based on my searches my job pays the same on average there as it does here), and my wife makes what she will make, if our mortgage payment is around $900-1100 a month we will still clear $500 more a month after our bills than we do in California. And thats with my wife taking a good paycut!

What makes this move easier for us is my parents deciding to move. They are retired and can move whenever they want. So once they find a house, we have that safety net where we can move in with them, and then take our time to find jobs and a house we truly want. They will move likely to a smaller city on the way outskirts, so they can have a bit of land (my Dad wants a large garage/workshop for our race car), but we'll be looking closer to Raleigh/Cary.

 

[JohnCU]

what's up with all the im moving to north carolina threads lately?

no love for SC? haters

 

[vrbaba]

Firstly, Welcome!

Umm, ppl who are saying no must be living in downtown durham, where im sure you are def. not moving to to have kids. Cary, Apex and north Durham, and parts of chapel hill are the perfect places. The research triangle park is where tons of IT and other jobs are are and the area is growing wayy too exponentially. Lots and lots of great homes and new ones are constaly building. If you play your cards right, you will have a great home whose value will be constantly increasing = a wondeful investment.

I am 24... lived here for all of high school, and went to college here. The duke campus is sort of a bubble in the city and students do go hang out in the city much, so college was great. have heard just great things about people with kids and great elementary/middle school education.
My parents still live here, and i am at texas for grad school. Although, if i had a choice, i would consider a busier city with ppl of my age, but sounds like a great place for you.

Regarding weather, i love it... after being to chicago, new york...and yes, Texas. Snows maybe once in twice a year to get things closed...which is a GREAT break from work and school for a couple days (if it snows enough). and not to mention it feels great to see the snow.

Any other details... feel free to ask/PM

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: JohnCU
what's up with all the im moving to north carolina threads lately?

no love for SC? haters

There are certainly some nice cities/areas in NC, just not as many. And NC seems a bit more progressive in a few areas.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: trmiv


Thanks for the advice. Yea, we never considered Durham. We're looking in Raleigh, and the areas south of Raleigh

Basically we're looking for an area we can start a life. In California we are resigned to the fact we will never be able to afford a home anywhere near where we work. It's gotten too out of control when in the area you grew up a 800sq/ft condo is $375,000. We pay $1730/month currently for a 760sq/ft 1 bedroom apartment! It's bleeding me dry! The thought of starting a family while living in a damn apartment is not a pleasant one to me.

We've already taken into consideration what my wife would make. Luckily for jobs like teaching, the pay scale is right out there and available to look at easily. So based on her two years of teaching (English BTW), we know exactly what she'll make. Me, I do desktop support at Kaiser Permanente right now (large HMO), so it's a lot of Windows 2000, XP, account creation, Lotus Notes, hardware installation, plus support of a lot of Kaiser specific apps, etc. Regular desktop support stuff, with a bit of administration thrown in.

Basically if I get a job making anywhere near what I make now (which based on my searches my job pays the same on average there as it does here), and my wife makes what she will make, if our mortgage payment is around $900-1100 a month we will still clear $500 more a month after our bills than we do in California. And thats with my wife taking a good paycut!

What makes this move easier for us is my parents deciding to move. They are retired and can move whenever they want. So once they find a house, we have that safety net where we can move in with them, and then take our time to find jobs and a house we truly want. They will move likely to a smaller city on the way outskirts, so they can have a bit of land (my Dad wants a large garage/workshop for our race car), but we'll be looking closer to Raleigh/Cary.

You can definitely look forward to more affordable housing. Generally, housing is pretty damn cheap in NC, depending on the location, of course.

 

[trmiv]

Originally posted by: Excelsior


You can definitely look forward to more affordable housing. Generally, housing is pretty damn cheap in NC, depending on the location, of course.

Yea I was shocked when I started looking and seeing the prices. It's crazy to see houses around 1800sq/ft for $150,000-$170,000. A house that size in the area I live is minimum $600,000-$800,000. I know we'd make less money there, but in California the housing prices are completely out of line with what normal people make. We could afford to get a small condo, or do some mortgage tricks to get a house, but I'd rather not be "house poor" my whole life and actually be able to enjoy life.

 

[JohnCU]

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: trmiv


Thanks for the advice. Yea, we never considered Durham. We're looking in Raleigh, and the areas south of Raleigh

Basically we're looking for an area we can start a life. In California we are resigned to the fact we will never be able to afford a home anywhere near where we work. It's gotten too out of control when in the area you grew up a 800sq/ft condo is $375,000. We pay $1730/month currently for a 760sq/ft 1 bedroom apartment! It's bleeding me dry! The thought of starting a family while living in a damn apartment is not a pleasant one to me.

We've already taken into consideration what my wife would make. Luckily for jobs like teaching, the pay scale is right out there and available to look at easily. So based on her two years of teaching (English BTW), we know exactly what she'll make. Me, I do desktop support at Kaiser Permanente right now (large HMO), so it's a lot of Windows 2000, XP, account creation, Lotus Notes, hardware installation, plus support of a lot of Kaiser specific apps, etc. Regular desktop support stuff, with a bit of administration thrown in.

Basically if I get a job making anywhere near what I make now (which based on my searches my job pays the same on average there as it does here), and my wife makes what she will make, if our mortgage payment is around $900-1100 a month we will still clear $500 more a month after our bills than we do in California. And thats with my wife taking a good paycut!

What makes this move easier for us is my parents deciding to move. They are retired and can move whenever they want. So once they find a house, we have that safety net where we can move in with them, and then take our time to find jobs and a house we truly want. They will move likely to a smaller city on the way outskirts, so they can have a bit of land (my Dad wants a large garage/workshop for our race car), but we'll be looking closer to Raleigh/Cary.

You can definitely look forward to more affordable housing. Generally, housing is pretty damn cheap in NC, depending on the location, of course.

except on the coast.

 

[Trikat]

Cary, NC is rated as one of the top ten places to live so you cannot go wrong with living in Cary. The neighborhood is awsome if you choose the right places, but there is an obvious different between the poorer Cary and richer Cary.
Raleigh is also a great place to live, but traffic is a lot worse. Actually traffic sucks all over that area when it is rush hour so it is a real pain.

If you really wanted to get close to the car racing deal then Charlotte is probably a better place, however, the neighborhoods arn't as good as Charlotte, but then again I don't know much about Charlotte except around UNC-Charlotte.

<- College.

 

[MaxDepth]

I love the Durham naysayers. I used to rant against their small minds and the pettiness with my own facts from the census bureau that population support and comfort rank higher in Durham because the infrastructure isn't taxed like wake county. Also I used to show crime statisitics where Durham made a 14% reduction in overall crime while the other cities increased. Yeah, I used to do that.

Now I welcome those knuckleheads and their spew. In fact I want them to say more and speak louder! OK, I'll admit I want to live in town and have that housing bubble to burst in a big way. So please, tell everyone how bad it is here, even though your anecdotal evidence is at least seven years old. I want a 3,000 sq ft house within walking distance of everything cultural and not pay half a mil.

Finally, I like my drive out to RTP. It only takes me 12 minutes, door to door. But oh yeah, BOOOOOOOO! We Durhamites are a scarey, scurvy lot. And don't let your wife near us, if ya know what I mean...

Originally posted by: daveshel
1. Don't.

2. If you choose not to listen to #1, at least don't consider Durham. I spent 4 years there in the mid 90s. Durham is unlike any city I've ever seen. Most places have fairly distinct nice areas/no so nice areas. Durham is one big not-so-nice area with little pockets of nice here and there. Pretty much the whole town is the other side of the tracks. Even in expensive complexes around Duke and RTP you are right next to Section 8 housing.

The climate isn't too bad, but they have no snow removal equipment, so the slightest bit of winter weather tends to cause big problems. And it is nice to have the ocean a few hours away in one direction and the mountains in another.

But the culture was want really drove me away. While I was there, a jury acquitted a white Durham homewoner who shot (and killed) a black youth in the back while the youth was running away from the home after an aborted burglary attempt. Southern Man is still very much alive even in the 'new south' and will never accept you if you weren't born there.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: JohnCU

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: trmiv


Thanks for the advice. Yea, we never considered Durham. We're looking in Raleigh, and the areas south of Raleigh

Basically we're looking for an area we can start a life. In California we are resigned to the fact we will never be able to afford a home anywhere near where we work. It's gotten too out of control when in the area you grew up a 800sq/ft condo is $375,000. We pay $1730/month currently for a 760sq/ft 1 bedroom apartment! It's bleeding me dry! The thought of starting a family while living in a damn apartment is not a pleasant one to me.

We've already taken into consideration what my wife would make. Luckily for jobs like teaching, the pay scale is right out there and available to look at easily. So based on her two years of teaching (English BTW), we know exactly what she'll make. Me, I do desktop support at Kaiser Permanente right now (large HMO), so it's a lot of Windows 2000, XP, account creation, Lotus Notes, hardware installation, plus support of a lot of Kaiser specific apps, etc. Regular desktop support stuff, with a bit of administration thrown in.

Basically if I get a job making anywhere near what I make now (which based on my searches my job pays the same on average there as it does here), and my wife makes what she will make, if our mortgage payment is around $900-1100 a month we will still clear $500 more a month after our bills than we do in California. And thats with my wife taking a good paycut!

What makes this move easier for us is my parents deciding to move. They are retired and can move whenever they want. So once they find a house, we have that safety net where we can move in with them, and then take our time to find jobs and a house we truly want. They will move likely to a smaller city on the way outskirts, so they can have a bit of land (my Dad wants a large garage/workshop for our race car), but we'll be looking closer to Raleigh/Cary.

You can definitely look forward to more affordable housing. Generally, housing is pretty damn cheap in NC, depending on the location, of course.

except on the coast.

Aye, which is why I said "depending on location". Almost anywhere in the US, a home on the coast will cost more than equivalent homes further inland.

 

[trmiv]

Originally posted by: Trikat
Cary, NC is rated as one of the top ten places to live so you cannot go wrong with living in Cary. The neighborhood is awsome if you choose the right places, but there is an obvious different between the poorer Cary and richer Cary.
Raleigh is also a great place to live, but traffic is a lot worse. Actually traffic sucks all over that area when it is rush hour so it is a real pain.

If you really wanted to get close to the car racing deal then Charlotte is probably a better place, however, the neighborhoods arn't as good as Charlotte, but then again I don't know much about Charlotte except around UNC-Charlotte.

<- College.

I wanted to live near Charlotte, and she wanted to live near Raleigh, so I had to compromise somewhere. There are still plenty of good places to race near there. I actually plan on racing South Boston Virgina right over the state line in Virginia.

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: JohnCU

Originally posted by: Excelsior

Originally posted by: trmiv


Thanks for the advice. Yea, we never considered Durham. We're looking in Raleigh, and the areas south of Raleigh

Basically we're looking for an area we can start a life. In California we are resigned to the fact we will never be able to afford a home anywhere near where we work. It's gotten too out of control when in the area you grew up a 800sq/ft condo is $375,000. We pay $1730/month currently for a 760sq/ft 1 bedroom apartment! It's bleeding me dry! The thought of starting a family while living in a damn apartment is not a pleasant one to me.

We've already taken into consideration what my wife would make. Luckily for jobs like teaching, the pay scale is right out there and available to look at easily. So based on her two years of teaching (English BTW), we know exactly what she'll make. Me, I do desktop support at Kaiser Permanente right now (large HMO), so it's a lot of Windows 2000, XP, account creation, Lotus Notes, hardware installation, plus support of a lot of Kaiser specific apps, etc. Regular desktop support stuff, with a bit of administration thrown in.

Basically if I get a job making anywhere near what I make now (which based on my searches my job pays the same on average there as it does here), and my wife makes what she will make, if our mortgage payment is around $900-1100 a month we will still clear $500 more a month after our bills than we do in California. And thats with my wife taking a good paycut!

What makes this move easier for us is my parents deciding to move. They are retired and can move whenever they want. So once they find a house, we have that safety net where we can move in with them, and then take our time to find jobs and a house we truly want. They will move likely to a smaller city on the way outskirts, so they can have a bit of land (my Dad wants a large garage/workshop for our race car), but we'll be looking closer to Raleigh/Cary.

You can definitely look forward to more affordable housing. Generally, housing is pretty damn cheap in NC, depending on the location, of course.

except on the coast.

you can live near enough the coast to enjoy it without having to pay through the nose for it. where i live isnt 2 hours from the beach, maybe 3 to wilmington, 2 to raleigh, 3 to williamsburg/va beach

some of the area culture does suck, though, at least in smaller towns and rural areas.
the accent drives me nuts somedays

 

[AcidicFury]

I suppose no one has suggested Chapel Hill yet? I think its probably one of the liveliest spots in the Triangle area. Why do I suggest it particularly for you?

1. Your wife's job and your future kids- the Chapel Hill- Carrboro City school system is the best in North Carolina (if not the Southeast) in terms of both teacher pay and educational quality.

2. Your job- Chapel Hill is on the other side of RTP from Raleigh- which is easier on the traffic for you. Easier commute++.

3. Decent amount to do- there's more than that in Chapel Hill! It's a college town, lots of nifty restaurants and shows and activities- things you're probably used to by now in Cali. Cary is really boring, as is Durham. (I lived in Cary for over 10 years- seriously, theres nothing but strip mall)

4. Housing- Cary's housing prices are about the same now as Chapel Hill's, but in time, Chapel Hill housing value will appreciate a lot more than Cary's just because of the education and great location to the universities.

If you give me some price ranges for housing that you're looking at, perhaps I could suggest some places to look.

 

[Excelsior]

Originally posted by: Trikat
Cary, NC is rated as one of the top ten places to live so you cannot go wrong with living in Cary. The neighborhood is awsome if you choose the right places, but there is an obvious different between the poorer Cary and richer Cary.
Raleigh is also a great place to live, but traffic is a lot worse. Actually traffic sucks all over that area when it is rush hour so it is a real pain.

If you really wanted to get close to the car racing deal then Charlotte is probably a better place, however, the neighborhoods arn't as good as Charlotte, but then again I don't know much about Charlotte except around UNC-Charlotte.

<- College.

There are definitely a few Cary-like areas around Charlotte. My father, who lived in the Raleigh area for 8 years or so (but grew up in Charlotte, and lives here now) prefers Raleigh. My sister just bought a house inside the beltline, and I believe that she likes Raleigh more.

I like Charlotte though, its not a bad place to live.

 

[TheGizmo]

my brother lives in cary, so i've had a number of chances to visit all over over NC.... and I wouldn't live anywhere except for in Cary..... although you're going to have to get used to the world closing at 10pm and black and white signs (lol.... those are weird things about cary)...... anyway, if you're gonna live in NC move to cary, and do it quick... its populating at quite an exponential speed

 

[trmiv]

AcidicFury: Honestly we're not "going out" type people, so we really don't do a lot that sort of thing in California anyway. We're more of the stay at home and watch a movie types. We do from time to time though, but we don't need it right outside our door. Doesn't mean we wouldn't consider Chapel Hill though, we have looked there a bit. Where my parents move is a bit of an influence as well though. Right now we live about an hour from them, which is a pain for me working on my race car. We'll probably end up somewhere thats like 15-20 minutes from them (not too close, yet not too far).

TheGizmo: We're on a timeline, so it WILL happen in late June/early July of next year. My wife has to start the second phase of become a "full" teacher (she's considered an "intern" right now, which means eventhough she teaches her own classes just like any other teacher, she still has to complete training in night classes), which here involves her starting some three year program here. She doesn't want to start that program here, so we have to move after she completes this current school year (starting in a couple of weeks), or she is somewhat stuck here until she finishes the program. So yea, about 10-11 months from now we'll be there.

 

[AcidicFury]

Originally posted by: trmiv
AcidicFury: Honestly we're not "going out" type people, so we really don't do a lot that sort of thing in California anyway. We're more of the stay at home and watch a movie types. We do from time to time though, but we don't need it right outside our door. Doesn't mean we wouldn't consider Chapel Hill though, we have looked there a bit. Where my parents move is a bit of an influence as well though. Right now we live about an hour from them, which is a pain for me working on my race car. We'll probably end up somewhere thats like 15-20 minutes from them (not too close, yet not too far).

Going out isn't for everyone, I understand. So then I guess its mostly up to where your parents live? Also, if your wife is taking courses- UNC is a 5 minute drive from anywhere in Chapel Hill.