Move over Papst. Verax is here.

[thesilentpc]

The new fans from Verax are becoming available in the US. These are 80mm ultra low noise fans that have built-in temperature control and RPM monitoring. If you could design the perfect fan(and you were smart) this seems like what you might come up with. The design is something between an axial fan and a centrifrugal blower.

When you see these you will immediately wonder what would happen if you slapped one on an 80 mm heatsink. Verax has already done that with their P14 and P16 heatsinks for Athlon and P4.

Are there any European readers on these boards that already have experience with Verax products? Do you think they are as revolutionary as the European press suggests?

 

[WileCoyote]

even if i couldn't hear the fans because they are dead quiet, almost $50 for a fan seems a bit insane - considering you can get nearly quiet fans for 1/5 that price.
regardless, i have to commend Verax for their work - they truly created a top of the line fan with all the features you could want.

 

[SWScorch]

I dont see any specs on the Silicon Acoustics website and I cant read German... I doubt the cfm ratings are that good. Look at the blades (if you can call them that) Its just my intuition, but I dont think tey would be able to move large amounts of air. If they can manage 25+ cfm at less than 21 db I would be impressed, however.

 

[Grendel99]

Holy !@#$ who would pay that much for a fan? I could buy 5 Panaflo's which I bet are just as good.

I couldn't help but notice, but you sound like you work for these guys :|

 

[Naythn]

Looks like their design would be worse for a heatsink, because of the larger dead zone above the processor. The cowling does look nice, though. Price is too high now for 99% anyway.

 

[thesilentpc]

What makes some of you guys so convinced that conventional fan design can't be improved upon? Checkout the technology page on the Verax website so you can how it works. The air is smoothly accelerated along the full length of the blade, which causes less turbulence. Less turbulence is important because that is the primary cause of noise in fans.

Yes the "dead spot" is slightly larger, but there is no point in trying to eliminate the dead spot in an axial fan when 95% of the air flow occurs at the tips of the blades anyway. Even if you had a fan with a very small hub (like the YS tip magnetic fans) there would still be a dead spot due to the fact that the blades turn so slowly near the axis compared to the tips. According to the reviews the Verax CPU coolers are getting, the noise/cooling performance ratio is better then everything else including the Silverado (which have no dead spot at all). Check out the PC Professionell test result. Click here for a list of other coolers also in the test.

Panaflos L1As are cheaper to be sure. They are also not thermally controlled, they don't have RPM monitoring and are only capable of low CFM. So you get what you pay for in that regard. The closest thing the Verax are comparable to is the thermo controlled Papst Variofans. Those fan runs $35-$40 in the US (if you can find one), don't include RPM monitoring and aren't as efficient as the Verax.

 

[Demonicon]

I don't know about you guys, but for $50 it better add Mhz!

thesilentpc, how 'bout some specs?

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

stop spamming us.

these fans look and sound interesting but without reviews and whatnot, they could do 2 CFM for all we know. 45 dollars is the most ridiculous thing i've seen in a long time. go buy panaflo L1A's for 2 bucks each at mpja or bgmicro...they're the best quiet fans out there and you can have them for cheap.

you are a spammer, we are not morons and you are annoying.

 

[ChrisADuffy]

too expensive.

 

[Underclocked]

Railways?

 

[Fireman]

BEAT IT SPAMMER!

Quite obvious what your doing here. Doing a search for your 5 pathetic posts yeild your self spamming results in 4 of them. The only one that doesn't have it is your lame attempt at justifying a $50 fan.
Do you really think your the first guy to come up with the idea of trying to get free advertsing on Anandtech?
Why don't you try this over on HardOcp. I hear they really like spammers over there.

 

[thesilentpc]

BingBongWongFooey, Fireman,
You guys obviously don't know what spamming is. Yes, I?m affiliated with a shop that sells quiet pc parts. Not coincidently I?m also an expert on such parts and have access to a vast amount of hardware. When you voluntarily read a public message board about cooling then you assume the risk of learning about new and interesting cooling products. Deal with it. I've got as much right to participate on these boards as you do and at least my posts to this thread contain information. I would NEVER spam a message board. You guys have links to your interests in your posts and I have links to mine. If I am not interested in what you have to say in your posts then I won't click on it, I won't read it, and I certainly wont respond to it. Please do me the same courtesy.

Underclocked,
"Railways" is how the word decibel gets translated from German.

Demonicon,
The specs are in the data sheet on the Verax site. They use the metric system in Europe so they are not directly comparable to the specs we are familiar with. I would convert them for you but this thread is getting hostile to someone who proposes that a 2 dollar Panaflo fan may not be the best you can get.

 

[Becks2k]

Who's gonna spend $50 on a fan and not see any specs on it even?

The pdf for the fan has a graph of the airflow at whatever pressures... a panaflo la1 is 24cfm with no pressure right?

the graph shows the fan spinning at 3500rpm? it says it moves 36m^3/h of air. 36m^3 = 1271feet^3/hour and per minut that'd be 21.1cfm
thats at full speed.

It better be pretty damn quiet at full speed to move less air than a la1.

You can get a 12dba papst that moves 19cfm.

" I would convert them for you but this thread is getting hostile to someone who proposes that a 2 dollar Panaflo fan may not be the best you can get."

Don't you sell that 2 dollar panaflo for 17 on your site? the one you sell has the same specs of 21dba/24cfm

That funky panaflo you sell might be good, maybe even for the money if quiet was importnat... but i'll stick to papst if from a bigger site if i had to.

Also that site you link to about the heatsink tests....
"With maximum CPU temperatures of 77,5 degrees Celsius during an amount of heat of 40 Watts and 89.5 degrees Celsius with 65 Watts is suitable the Verax P14 also for current Highend processors."
77C? wiht only 40watts of heat?

WTF?

thats a pos.

89C!?!?! with 65watts?

Why not just get a pal8045 w/12dba papst and get <60C temps with same heatload?

anand had the pal8045/12dba combo in one of his heatsink roundups.

 

[ChrisADuffy]

TOO EXPENSIVE, DON'T BUY THOSE.

 

[Zukatah]

I don't know for you, but if I had $50 more to spend on my computer for cooling, I'd go watercooling instead of going with those $50 fans. With an Antec 1080b you can place 5 fans plus replacing the one in the PSU if you wish. That's $250 for fans with low CFM. I don't see how they can sell those to people who are informed and know what else they can buy for the same money...

just my 2 cents

 

[keyeye]

thesilentpc,

You should just leave. It doesn't matter what you call it-- spam, whatever .... clearly you have a conflict of interest which you do NOT disclose in your messages (except the last one). While I am new to AT, I for one do not want to see this forum overrun by vendors hawking their 'stuff' no matter how expert they are.

 

[WarCon]

I am sure you get the point of what people are saying. I believe forum rules forbid vendors from advertising their products either themselves or through a third party. By your posts it seems that you are directly affiliated with the company your suggesting. That is why your getting harassed.

BTW, if you want to sell products in America you might try an English language version option and as far as fans go, give specs in the same format as other vendors of fans. That way people don't think your some kind of shyster.

Good luck with your business, but no more free advertising please.

 

[Fireman]

<< Yes, I?m affiliated with a shop that sells quiet pc parts. Not coincidently I?m also an expert on such parts and have access to a vast amount of hardware. >>



Ooooh....stand back......it's.......an.......EXPERT!....

 

[gorka]

<< .........You guys obviously don't know what spamming is. Yes, I?m affiliated with a shop that sells quiet pc parts. >>




ahhhh....the plot UN-THICKENS....you know, you could spam in a more subtle manner and people wouldn't be on your back so hard....I mean, you really do sound like you're a sales rep for these fans

in the already sceptical nature of message boards....do you thik the direct approach is the best way to go about it? try being a little more "discreet" next time.

BTW....too expensive...

 

[thesilentpc]

Beck,
Your math is correct that the manufacturer's specs say 21.8 CFM for Verax and 24 CFM for Panaflo L1A in a free air condition. But as you probably know a free air condition never occurs when a fan is actually in use. Did you notice that the Verax can deliver a maximum pressure of 40 pa while the Panaflo maxes out at 15.4 pa? Are you starting to see why this is not a normal fan? Try to find another quiet fan that can delivery 40 pa (.16 in/h2o). You have to judge a fan by its entire fan curve and the operating point at which it will be in use. The Verax has a linear operating curve from free air all the way to static pressure. The curve of a conventional fan will sag in the middle and will be much less steep. If you try to make assumptions about Verax fans from what you know about normal fans then you wont be able to understand how they work. As I said before they are a cross between an axial fan and a centrifugal blower and the performance curve has the advantages of both.

The Germans take performance benchmarking more seriously then we do in the US. Those heatsink performance numbers from PC Pro are based on a commercial CPU simulator. The actual numbers are not what matters, it's how they compare to others in the test using the same test equipment. The Verax P14 beat out the Alpha PAL8045 and the Swiftech MC462 in this test so maybe there is more going on here then you realize.

Zukatah,
People like me who want extremely quiet systems don't install 5 fans. We try to get by with as few fans as possible. Even if you go with water cooling you still have to use fans to cool the radiator. The idea is that the Verax fans are quieter.

keyeye,
Why should I leave? This is my thread if you didn't notice. If I leave there wont be anyone left who knows anything about Verax fans. Conflict of interest? This is not a courtroom this is a message board for talking about computer stuff. Geez.

WarCon,
I don't like advertising on message boards either and I?m sorry if my post was mistaken by anyone for an advertisement. I don't work for Verax and so I have no control over what language their website is in. I had a link to my website where you could get these fans but I took it off. People don't like it when people link to their own website for some reason and that is fine with me. I think primarily people don't like to know that there is something better then what they have that they can't afford. Just human nature I guess.

I started this thread to ask for opinions from other people who have used Verax fans, but instead got lot of opinions from people who didn't know anything about them. That is why I have posted some links to where people can find more info if they are interested. Maybe Anandtech will be able to do a review of them if enough people are interested.

 

[ChrisADuffy]

<< I think primarily people don't like to know that there is something better then what they have that they can't afford. Just human nature I guess. >>



They may be really great fans but they are tooo expensive to make sense. My human nature says I would be very stupid to buy them because of that.

 

[Aboroth]

All I know about Verax is that from now on, whenever I hear, read, or think about that name, the first things that will jump into my head are "overpriced", "underpowered", "spam" and "annoying salesman who thinks I am an idiot". I really can't stand people/companies who make me think of that last one.

 

[mechBgon]

The exhaust coming off my PAL8045 (with L1A at 12V) is currently 33C. At that temperature, the verax 80mm fan would be turning at perhaps 1500rpm, judging by the graph in the .pdf. Since its max free-air flowrate is 21cfm at 3100rpm, it's probably safe to estimate that at 1500rpm it would be about 2/3 of that, or 14cfm. 14cfm is below my "comfort zone" for cooling my AthlonXP, even with a PAL8045. If I did want a quiet 14cfm fan, I would get the 19cfm Pabst (12dB) and run it at 7 volts, or perhaps get the special "ring-cage" Panaflo FBL-version L1A.

I do give the verax fan "style points" for looking really cool, and if the pressure claims are correct then it might have some claim to fame in high-restriction situations, but when the cost is factored in, I need more excuses than cool appearance before I'll spend $50 instead of $20. And I make my own 7V adapters.

Junior, if you haven't caught on yet, no one here seems to like it when you come in with a chip on your shoulder and something to prove. Putting a link to your store in your signature works a lot better, just ask the Phams of phamcomputer.com.

 

[WarCon]

Assuming that your not a rep for Verax, then I have a comment or two about these fans. I see one real problem for me using one on my watercooler. I draw air through my watercooler because its simply more efficient, with those modified cowlings they don't look like they will mount real well the other direction. They also have such a large dead spot in the center, I would be personally hoping that the next really revolutionary fan will create linear flow (with a minimal dead spot) and a high pressure gradient.

 

[ChrisADuffy]

Is it me or are the expensive silent pc products popping up all over???? Please check this other Anandtech thread with expensive silent pc gear.

What do you guys think?