Info Motherboard software bug can accidentally kill AMD Ryzen X3D CPUs

[Steltek]

Might want to be careful with the voltage settings for your X3D overclocking.

Motherboard software bug can accidentally kill AMD Ryzen X3D CPUs

Apparently, the problem has been found in MSI, ASUS, Gigabyte, and ASRock boards.

The BIOS seems to be mis-identifying the X3D chips as the normal variant and allowing voltages to be set too high, which kills the CPU.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Sounds like the "Good ol' Days" of MOAR SPEED, MOAR FUN, where you needed deep pockets and balls of steel to overclock your brand-new expensive CPU, into realms unknown.

 

[IEC]

"Motherboard software bug allows users to manually exceed safe voltage limits for X3D chips" would be a more accurate and less clickbait title.

 

[Hitman928]

"Motherboard software bug allows users to manually exceed safe voltage limits for X3D chips" would be a more accurate and less clickbait title.

You actually have to install MSI control center which allows overlocking from Windows to let you do this in the first place. My guess is that there is no actual control or locking mechanism in the 3D chips that prevents the voltage from increasing to non-3D voltage (or more) but the limit is in the bios software. However, MSI’s software can override the settings in the bios and because it isn’t coded with knowledge of the 3D chips, it just lets you set the voltage however you want.

TL;DR, don’t install MSI control center and you shouldn’t have anything to worry about.

 

[Markfw]

You actually have to install MSI control center which allows overlocking from Windows to let you do this in the first place. My guess is that there is no actual control or locking mechanism in the 3D chips that prevents the voltage from increasing to non-3D voltage (or more) but the limit is in the bios software. However, MSI’s software can override the settings in the bios and because it isn’t coded with knowledge of the 3D chips, it just lets you set the voltage however you want.

TL;DR, don’t install MSI control center and you shouldn’t have anything to worry about.

While that is good to hear, why do ASUS, Gigabyte, and ASRock boards also have this problem ?

 

[Hitman928]

While that is good to hear, why do ASUS, Gigabyte, and ASRock boards also have this problem ?

I’m assuming MSI control center uses the same hooks that Ryzen Master does so it should work in any vendor.

 

[Markfw]

I’m assuming MSI control center uses the same hooks that Ryzen Master does so it should work in any vendor.

OK, to confirm for all, what you are saying is that if you leave bios alone, stock OR use PBO/CO with a negative offset (like all of mine are) then no problem. Its only of you actually overclock, which is not needed on the 7950x3d. or wanted. Or for the 7950x for that matter.

 

[Hitman928]

OK, to confirm for all, what you are saying is that if you leave bios alone, stock OR use PBO/CO with a negative offset (like all of mine are) then no problem. Its only of you actually overclock, which is not needed on the 7950x3d. or wanted. Or for the 7950x for that matter.

That and you have to use MSI control center to overclock as no other method will allow you to over volt a 3D CPU.

 

[In2Photos]

That and you have to use MSI control center to overclock as no other method will allow you to over volt a 3D CPU.

Der8eur set the voltage manually in BIOS when he killed his chip.

 

[Hitman928]

Der8eur set the voltage manually in BIOS when he killed his chip.

Thanks, that’s different than the original article I read. Looks like at least some motherboards still allow for manual voltage settings in the bios on these CPUs as well. Though to note, he used a pretty extreme overvolt when the chip died. I’d hope if someone knows how to go into the bios and turn on the necessary options to get to manual voltage control, they would know what they are doing.

 

[Markfw]

Thanks, that’s different than the original article I read. Looks like at least some motherboards still allow for manual voltage settings in the bios on these CPUs as well. Though to note, he used a pretty extreme overvolt when the chip died. I’d hope if someone knows how to go into the bios and turn on the necessary options to get to manual voltage control, they would know what they are doing.

There are too many idiots out there> lets just agree that its NOT AMDs fault.

 

[moinmoin]

lets just agree that its NOT AMDs fault.

OC'ing voids warranty so in that regard it technically and legally isn't AMD's fault in any case.

It's interesting though that the possibilities to do something wrong with the X3D chip are more readily available on AM5 than on AM4. If people weren't as uneducated nowadays (actual) OC'ers would welcome that.

 

[TheELF]

Sample of one, so it could mean nothing but there was a non x3d cpu found that also died from bios settings.

 

[AdamK47]

"Motherboard software bug allows users to manually exceed safe voltage limits for X3D chips" would be a more accurate and less clickbait title.

The title they came up with is very clickbaity. The "accidentally" part requires deliberate actions made by the end user.

 

[scannall]

It's not a bug. The bios will allow you to be stupid if you so choose. It would be a bug if the bios did these stupid things for you, without your consent.

 

[TheELF]

It's not a bug. The bios will allow you to be stupid if you so choose. It would be a bug if the bios did these stupid things for you, without your consent.

The software recognizes the x3d as the normal version, that's a bug.
Not everybody that buys a x3d chip is going to be an IT expert, they won't know any better.
Also since these settings can be changed from within a software in windows there is a chance for this to happen just by data corruption, or by somebody messing up an update (there have been driver updates frying GPUs in the past) ,heck hackers could figure out a way to make malware that will fry every x3d CPU that will run it.

Igor noticed the software was seemingly detecting the chip as a standard Ryzen 5xxx, which does not have 3D vertically stacked L3 cache

 

[StinkyPinky]

Reminds me of the time I modified my car and replaced my tires with monster tires, which then fell off and destroyed a child care with a 1000 babies inside it. Nissan tried to say my Versa wasn't suitable for such a mod, but we all know it was their fault.

 

[Hitman928]

The software recognizes the x3d as the normal version, that's a bug.
Not everybody that buys a x3d chip is going to be an IT expert, they won't know any better.
Also since these settings can be changed from within a software in windows there is a chance for this to happen just by data corruption, or by somebody messing up an update (there have been driver updates frying GPUs in the past) ,heck hackers could figure out a way to make malware that will fry every x3d CPU that will run it.

You do realize that everything you just posted about applies to non-3D chips as well, both AMD and Intel chips, and has been true for many years, right?

 

[IEC]

Reminds me of the time I modified my car and replaced my tires with monster tires, which then fell off and destroyed a child care with a 1000 babies inside it. Nissan tried to say my Versa wasn't suitable for such a mod, but we all know it was their fault.

I nearly spewed a beer at my monitor, the Versa was the clincher LOL

 

[TheELF]

You do realize that everything you just posted about applies to non-3D chips as well, both AMD and Intel chips, and has been true for many years, right?

Intel XTU has been recognizing my x3d CPU as an intel cpu for all these years?! ....

Yes, this can happen for every CPU but unlike the x3d they don't immediately die, if they get a setting they can't support they don't boot up and force the bios to reset.

 

[Hitman928]

Intel XTU has been recognizing my x3d CPU as an intel cpu for all these years?! ....

Yes, this can happen for every CPU but unlike the x3d they don't immediately die, if they get a setting they can't support they don't boot up and force the bios to reset.

Sure, the 3d chips are much more sensitive, but that's not the point. The point is if you chose to go through the steps to enable manual voltage settings, ignoring the warning messages along the way, and start increasing voltages with no knowledge of what the limits of the CPU are, then the chances are very high that you are going to kill (or at least severely damage) the CPU and it is entirely on the user being stupid.

 

[TheELF]

Sure, the 3d chips are much more sensitive, but that's not the point. The point is if you chose to go through the steps to enable manual voltage settings, ignoring the warning messages along the way, and start increasing voltages with no knowledge of what the limits of the CPU are, then the chances are very high that you are going to kill (or at least severely damage) the CPU and it is entirely on the user being stupid.

No, the point is that a software can do all of that.
Anything a software can do after you give it permissions it can also do without your permissions, either due to data corruption/someone messing up an update, or by hackers.

 

[Hitman928]

No, the point is that a software can do all of that.
Anything a software can do after you give it permissions it can also do without your permissions, either due to data corruption/someone messing up an update, or by hackers.

So post in the vulnerabilities thread? Doesn't seem to have much relevance in this very specific thread.

 

[DrMrLordX]

No, the point is that a software can do all of that.
Anything a software can do after you give it permissions it can also do without your permissions, either due to data corruption/someone messing up an update, or by hackers.

So you're claiming that "hackers" are going to try to overvolt and kill your X3D CPU using the same hooks used by MSI's software?

 

[Thunder 57]

So you're claiming that "hackers" are going to try to overvolt and kill your X3D CPU using the same hooks used by MSI's software?

Anything so long as it smears AMD.