Motherboard Questions

[Blinkme323]

Hi guys, I am using a Dell P4 2.8/533 processor and Dell pc3200 memory in a refrubished MSI SIS 661 motherboard. I just got it a few days ago and put a 9700 pro. I would think that it would be a huge upgrade from my old Athlon 1800 with 512 pc2100 and a Radeon 9100.

However, it really isn't. I got 14100 in 3dmark01 compared to 7800 with my old setup. That looks all fine and good, but CSS recommends medium settings whereas it recommended high settings for my old system. I tried switching the cards and the 9700 pro worked amazingly in my old system. The ram and cpu were both good too.

The only thing I can think of is the motherboard. I do have a 230 watt power supply but it is very underrated and powered my other systems fine. I have a few days left to return the motherboard and am wondering if I should. The system was very unstable and got terrible scores before I re-reformatted and downclocked the ram to 133 from 200 to sync with the cpu. If I raise it at all, my system crashes constantly.

I am seriously considering selling the cpu-mobo combo on Ebay and getting an Athlon XP mobile setup but don't know if I want to go through with all of that. Are there any tests I can do that are just for the Mobo, cpu, and ram. If I do return the motherboard, which one should I buy. $50 is the tops I'll go and my case only supports 3 pci slots and one agp slot. Do you think my performance would be better with a new motherboard. Thanks for the help..

 

[montag451]

GET another psu - the vga card itself uses upto 70w at full power!

sheesh

 

[Blinkme323]

I highly doubt the psu is the problem. It is an underrated Compaq power supply that has powered my other machines no problem. I even removed a cd drive. Does a power supply really reduce performance. I have an Antec 400 watt power supply that doesn't fit in my case, but I could try it. Also, my temps reported in the bios are around 140 F at idle. Could that be a problem. The motherboard was $33 shipped, that doesn't reduce performance at all. Also, why can't I run my ram at the rated speed of 200 and the cpu at 133 without crashing. I tried it in another machine and it is rock stable.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Um, did you install your chipset drivers? You might want to consider getting the chipset drivers from SIS themselves because motherboard drivers aren't as good when it comes to the chipset. Other than that, yea those are pretty sh!tty scores. It could very well be the motherboard but then agian a 2.8 with 533BUS is NOT ok. Can you overclock with this board? I know for a fact in that system, the memory is running under it's designed speed so if you don't want to overclock the 2.8 from 533 to 800MHZ FSB speeds (DDR400SPECS) then you should tighten the timings on the memory.

 

[Blinkme323]

I can't overclock at all except raising the bus from 133-200 which sounds risky since my temps are already high. Windows installed the chipset drivers this time. I will have to do that. The memory automatically runs at 200 but it crashes constantly so I have to downclock to 133. The stock timings are 2.5 3 3 6. I loosened them up a bit, but that didn't help.

 

[CraigRT]

so you are basing all of your problems on 3dmark and what CSS says?
have you even tried pushing past recommended settings?

either way you benchmarked better, so I am not sure exactly what the big deal is.

 

[Blinkme323]

I tried pushing it past the recomenced and it ran like crap regardless. I tried DX8 and it made no difference. Right now it runs on medium texture and model, high shader and shadows, no aa and trilinear aty 1024:768 with about 40fps. On my old system, I ran high everything, except shader detail, and 4aa and 8af at 1024:768 with 45-60fps.

 

[bocamojo]

I think you are on the right track with the memory. You want to run it 1:1 with your CPU/FSB settings, which is 133. Unless the mobo has the capability to use a 4:3 divider, I would leave it at 133. Also, your PSU could very well be the culprit to your system instability. I would recommend picking up a minimum 300-350W PSU. You can get a case with 400W psu from newegg for 40 bucks. I would keep the mobo, get the new case/psu, and go from there.

 

[Blinkme323]

Ok, thanks for the help guys. I just installed the latest SIS drivers and synced the ram. I am about to try the 400 watt power supply I have. One question though, I got the processor from an unused Dimension 3000 from work. Why would Dell put pc3200 in a 533 bus system.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Beats me but if your having system instability then the culprit is definately the PSU and lack of chipset drivers (Windows XP doesn't include chipset drivers for anything more recent then the PII).

 

[Philippine Mango]

I was in a situation kind of similar to yours (for my gaming rig), all of my problems were solved once I installed the new PSU. Once you install the new PSU, try to increase the FSB to 200MHZ and then run the memory at spec timings. Then try to tighten the timings for the memory and increase the VDIMM voltage to increase stability (no more then 2.8V). Since you have your chipset drivers installed, you should be significantly better off. Once you've done all of this, show us your scores before you overclocked it to 200MHZ FSB and then after.

 

[Blinkme323]

You really think I can overclock it to a 200 bus. Isn't that like overclocking the 2.8 to a 4.2! I don' think it has any voltage adjustments either.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Well then, try to overclock it to the highest possible then run prime 95 and see if it's stable. Be sure to update the bios as well because it can only help. Since the ram will be running under spec, you should tighten the timings. You did install a higher capacity PSU right? And the PSU is of high quality right? Putting a low quality 500WATT PSU is more stupid then putting a high quality 350 watt PSU.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Oh and BTW, when you find your overclock is safe, be sure to under clock your highest overclock by 5 or 10 MHZ (FSB).

 

[Blinkme323]

The only overclcok option is 200 bus. I installed the chipset drivers and my 400 watt power supply and it works good now, but I think I am going to sell it for a 3ghz Celeron-M setup. They are cheap and should perform equal or better right.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Originally posted by: Blinkme323
The only overclcok option is 200 bus. I installed the chipset drivers and my 400 watt power supply and it works good now, but I think I am going to sell it for a 3ghz Celeron-M setup. They are cheap and should perform equal or better right.

HAHAHAHAHA! NO! A celeron setup will NOT perform the same but instead slower. The celeron processors have less cache then the P4s. Why do you say your only option for overclock is 200MHZ FSB? Unless you actually CANT overclock this board...

 

[Philippine Mango]

Ok so even with default clock speeds on this system, you should be able to tighten the timings on the memory no? And since you've installed the chipset drivers and the PSU, you might want to run those tests agian to see what your score is. Also make sure your drives are running with DMA just because.

 

[Blinkme323]

The board has zero overclocking options and deosn't seem all that fast to me. I want something that I can overclcok and play around with. Karaktu's Celeron M does 3.2/800 and benches very well. That has to be faster.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Look to save money and aggrevation, you should do what I told you and then tell me your scores.
1. Tighten memory timings as far as possible.
2. Make sure you have the latest drivers
3. Benchmark your computer
4. Post on ATOT your finds.....
5. ........
6. PROFIT! LITTERALLY!

 

[Blinkme323]

I don't like these processors very much. I am about to buy an Athlon XP-Mobile setup with a Abit ISt-s version 2 motherboard that does 2.4/200 which is 3500 speeds for $75 shipped. I am selling my processor for $100 and returning mymotherboard for $30.

 

[Philippine Mango]

Well what ever rocks your boat but you STILL have not benched this machine. You might save money in the long run if you stick with this system now and then build a new system later because you will likely not see a very large improvement in performance with what you've mentioned... I just think your wasting your money if you don't utilize what you have already but if you think you can get a decent amount of money out of this a build a significantly better system then go ahead.

I'm also a little confused to what situation you have. Did you JUST build this system to replace your older system OR have you had this system for a while and now your just bitching. If you just built this system then try to get all the money can from it and build something better.

 

[Blinkme323]

I swapped my 2.0 with this 2.8 from work. It gets about high 14000 in 3dmark01. Doesn't run HL2 any better, in some cases worse, than my Athlon 1800. I can get a much better Athlon Mobile setup and make $30 bucks so it is a no brainer.