Lookin to buy an AMD 1600 system soon... would like some opinions on the best board available atm. Dont need on-board audio/video or Raid controllers etc... Forgive my ignorance, I havent bought a system in quite some time, I'm not sure if AMD's XP series uses ddr exclusively, but I plan on getting ddr when I purchase. Thanks in advance ppl.
motherboard opinions
- Thread starter Pezuzu
- Start date
Pezuzu, please ignore the fan boys, they just recommend whatever board they are currently worshipping without even bothering to consider what you actually need/want.
In your case, you should definitely go with a DDR solution. XP's can run on SDR boards as well, but they perform considerably better on DDR boards (extra bandwidth, SSE, and hardware prefetch capabilities are better utilized). The best performing and mature DDR chipset currently available is the KT266A.
I would look at the Shuttle AK31, MSI K7T266 Pro2, or the Epox 8KHA+. They all perform well and don't have any of the extra features you said you didn't want or need. The MSI and Epox can be had for @$100. The Shuttle is considerably cheaper...@$80??? The Epox is a great OCer, but I wouldn't run it on anything less than a good 350W PSU.
Also, be sure to jump on the Best Buy deal for Crucial 256MB DDR sticks for $25 after $10 MIR. That extra $$$ can be spent on a faster XP or a better HSF, which is also very important. I'd check out a Pal 8045 at SVC, which is the cheapest price on the web. Grab some Arctic Silver 2 while you're there.
Good luck on your new rig, hope you enjoy whatever you decide.
Chiz
In your case, you should definitely go with a DDR solution. XP's can run on SDR boards as well, but they perform considerably better on DDR boards (extra bandwidth, SSE, and hardware prefetch capabilities are better utilized). The best performing and mature DDR chipset currently available is the KT266A.
I would look at the Shuttle AK31, MSI K7T266 Pro2, or the Epox 8KHA+. They all perform well and don't have any of the extra features you said you didn't want or need. The MSI and Epox can be had for @$100. The Shuttle is considerably cheaper...@$80??? The Epox is a great OCer, but I wouldn't run it on anything less than a good 350W PSU.
Also, be sure to jump on the Best Buy deal for Crucial 256MB DDR sticks for $25 after $10 MIR. That extra $$$ can be spent on a faster XP or a better HSF, which is also very important. I'd check out a Pal 8045 at SVC, which is the cheapest price on the web. Grab some Arctic Silver 2 while you're there.
Good luck on your new rig, hope you enjoy whatever you decide.
Chiz
<< Pezuzu, please ignore the fan boys, they just recommend whatever board they are currently worshipping without even bothering to consider what you actually need/want. >>
Yes, you shouldn't listen to these people. The ones that think the KT266 chipset godly, when it's just surrounded by "hype". You can spend $20 less, but look up thosde boards in the threads, and notice the problems they are having! It's your funeral. I'm showing a motherboard, that will keep you one step ahead of technology for a cheap price, and without any problems. I posted a thread asking if anyone had any problems with the XP333, and I all I heard was, "Yeah, it doesn't have a KT266 chipset!". Yes, I read your mesasge, and I considered what your wants/needs were, and I came up with an opinion. I'm just letting you know about a good board that's not about the "bandwagon" popularity. Now I can agree on one thing with Chizow, the Epox 8KHA+ is a good board, but it has it's issues. You said you've been out of the industry for awile, and the XP333 board will make it very easy to get back in the flow.
Damn, funny how someone gets offended at the hint of being a fan boy, but lets clarify some points here first:
Yes, you shouldn't listen to these people. The ones that think the KT266 chipset godly, when it's just surrounded by "hype".
Lets see, the KT266A boards have been on the market for almost 3 months....the XP 333 is hitting the market. The KT266A has hundreds of benchmarks of numerous KT266A boards that clearly show it is the highest performing single-processor solution available. I think with the nForce's current problems and high price tag, this isn't even a question anymore.
You can spend $20 less, but look up thosde boards in the threads, and notice the problems they are having! It's your funeral. I'm showing a motherboard, that will keep you one step ahead of technology for a cheap price, and without any problems. I posted a thread asking if anyone had any problems with the XP333, and I all I heard was, "Yeah, it doesn't have a KT266 chipset!".
Thats funny, is the "AkumaBao Guarantee of Quality?" You don't even own the board, it hasn't been readily available for more than a week, and few sites have even gotten around to reviewing it....yet you can honestly say there aren't going to be any problems with it? The few that did review the board posted less than stellar results, certainly not in-line with the "XP 333" designation of this chipset. Couple that with the fact ALi has a horrible track record with DDR chipsets (heh, it only took them 1 1/2 years to get their Magik 1 chipset to perform on par with the KT133A boards) and it's your funeral. Add that to the fact this is a brand new board that hasn't gone through any revisions or "public betas" (ie. consumers like you buying the first boards).
By the way, can you please stop referring to your crippled A7V266 as a KT266A board? 'Cuz its not........... its a KT266 board. There is a difference. If you didn't know that, then well, I'll leave it at that.
I'm just letting you know about a good board that's not about the "bandwagon" popularity. Now I can agree on one thing with Chizow, the Epox 8KHA+ is a good board, but it has it's issues. You said you've been out of the industry for awile, and the XP333 board will make it very easy to get back in the flow.
Its popular for a reason, its the best solution available. Misery loves company, no one has problems with the XP 333 b/c no one has it. If you do have a problem with it, there's fewer people to help troubleshoot, and obviously there will be fewer complaints about the board. Its really just a matter of proportions and percentage.......100 complaints of a population of 1000 is the same as 1 complaint of a population of 10, cept no one cares about those 10
Anyways, the prices are essentially the same for this board vs. the Epox and MSI, ~$100, the Shuttle is still much cheaper. Considering he doesn't need the extra features (maybe he has PCI versions of those components, maybe he just doesn't need them at all...) pricing shouldn't be a factor between the KT266A boards and the XP333. I'll end with a quote from Anand's Comdex Mobo roundup that sums it all up nicely:
For the Athlon it seems like the KT266A is still the most desirable chipset and although the nForce definitely has its own niche, VIA shouldn't be too worried about it cannibalizing their Athlon chipset sales; not yet at least. The next wave of Athlon chipsets will bring about DDR333 support however unless the Athlon gets a boost in FSB frequency, something that isn't on any AMD roadmaps we've seen, you shouldn't expect to gain any performance improvement from DDR333.
Chizow
#1 hyped-up fanboy of KT266...errr KT266A
Yes, you shouldn't listen to these people. The ones that think the KT266 chipset godly, when it's just surrounded by "hype".
Lets see, the KT266A boards have been on the market for almost 3 months....the XP 333 is hitting the market. The KT266A has hundreds of benchmarks of numerous KT266A boards that clearly show it is the highest performing single-processor solution available. I think with the nForce's current problems and high price tag, this isn't even a question anymore.
You can spend $20 less, but look up thosde boards in the threads, and notice the problems they are having! It's your funeral. I'm showing a motherboard, that will keep you one step ahead of technology for a cheap price, and without any problems. I posted a thread asking if anyone had any problems with the XP333, and I all I heard was, "Yeah, it doesn't have a KT266 chipset!".
Thats funny, is the "AkumaBao Guarantee of Quality?" You don't even own the board, it hasn't been readily available for more than a week, and few sites have even gotten around to reviewing it....yet you can honestly say there aren't going to be any problems with it? The few that did review the board posted less than stellar results, certainly not in-line with the "XP 333" designation of this chipset. Couple that with the fact ALi has a horrible track record with DDR chipsets (heh, it only took them 1 1/2 years to get their Magik 1 chipset to perform on par with the KT133A boards) and it's your funeral. Add that to the fact this is a brand new board that hasn't gone through any revisions or "public betas" (ie. consumers like you buying the first boards).
By the way, can you please stop referring to your crippled A7V266 as a KT266A board? 'Cuz its not........... its a KT266 board. There is a difference. If you didn't know that, then well, I'll leave it at that.
I'm just letting you know about a good board that's not about the "bandwagon" popularity. Now I can agree on one thing with Chizow, the Epox 8KHA+ is a good board, but it has it's issues. You said you've been out of the industry for awile, and the XP333 board will make it very easy to get back in the flow.
Its popular for a reason, its the best solution available. Misery loves company, no one has problems with the XP 333 b/c no one has it. If you do have a problem with it, there's fewer people to help troubleshoot, and obviously there will be fewer complaints about the board. Its really just a matter of proportions and percentage.......100 complaints of a population of 1000 is the same as 1 complaint of a population of 10, cept no one cares about those 10
Anyways, the prices are essentially the same for this board vs. the Epox and MSI, ~$100, the Shuttle is still much cheaper. Considering he doesn't need the extra features (maybe he has PCI versions of those components, maybe he just doesn't need them at all...) pricing shouldn't be a factor between the KT266A boards and the XP333. I'll end with a quote from Anand's Comdex Mobo roundup that sums it all up nicely:
For the Athlon it seems like the KT266A is still the most desirable chipset and although the nForce definitely has its own niche, VIA shouldn't be too worried about it cannibalizing their Athlon chipset sales; not yet at least. The next wave of Athlon chipsets will bring about DDR333 support however unless the Athlon gets a boost in FSB frequency, something that isn't on any AMD roadmaps we've seen, you shouldn't expect to gain any performance improvement from DDR333.
Chizow
#1 hyped-up fanboy of KT266...errr KT266A
I have an MSI K7T 266 Pro 2, and I must say if I never had an excellent board before, this is it. I use to be skeptical about VIA chipsets because of bad experiences with them, however the KT266A is positively the best AMD chipset on the market now. Coupled with Crucial DDR memory you have a powerhouse. It is true that ALi has had bad track record period, whether with DDR or SDR, as a matter of fact, no chipset to my knowledge had ever came out of the fight with customer satisfaction without even the slightest of a bruise. The ALi MAGiK 1 M1647 will not be the first I can guarantee you that. Truth is the only chipset surrounded by hype is nVidia's nForce chipset. The KT266A is not hype, it is fact. It is a damn good chipset, stable and performing. Sometimes you even forget you have a VIA in your system. So without a doubt, if you looking for something now, tomorrow, next week or even next year, do not wait on Iwill's XP333. Get your self a KT266A based board.
rofl chizow. good post. i think you managed to shoot down all of akuma's ideas one by one, and then proceed to add humor (ie. "AkumaBoa's Guarantee of Quality")
wow, i sure do love this message board.
but back to the topic, i will agree with the consenus here and go with a kt266a solution from either epox (8kha+) or shuttle (ak31a). these are probably the best performing kt266a boards for the price. i myself own the 8kha+, and it is great. many ocing features and great stability. it does have onboard sound, but basically all today's mobos have this, so you aren't paying any extra for it. the shuttle ak31a is the best "budget" kt266a board you can get. it sells for about $80 and has decent overclocking features and also great stability. i would also add to the list the ecs k7s5a. definitely for the budget-minded, as it sells for $65. with the low price comes few ocing features and extras, but good stability. i dont know anyone personally who has had a problem with this board, but many here say it has more than its share of problems. all three of these support DDR, so you dont have to worry about that.
bottom line: any of these boards will give you a good start on the road to a great machine. all you have to do is decide what extras you want/need and pick a price range. hope my post helped, for the mobo is a very important decision...
t4t3r
wow, i sure do love this message board.
but back to the topic, i will agree with the consenus here and go with a kt266a solution from either epox (8kha+) or shuttle (ak31a). these are probably the best performing kt266a boards for the price. i myself own the 8kha+, and it is great. many ocing features and great stability. it does have onboard sound, but basically all today's mobos have this, so you aren't paying any extra for it. the shuttle ak31a is the best "budget" kt266a board you can get. it sells for about $80 and has decent overclocking features and also great stability. i would also add to the list the ecs k7s5a. definitely for the budget-minded, as it sells for $65. with the low price comes few ocing features and extras, but good stability. i dont know anyone personally who has had a problem with this board, but many here say it has more than its share of problems. all three of these support DDR, so you dont have to worry about that.
bottom line: any of these boards will give you a good start on the road to a great machine. all you have to do is decide what extras you want/need and pick a price range. hope my post helped, for the mobo is a very important decision...
t4t3r
I'll agree with the general concensus here and say that the KT266A is the way to go. I put a system together based on the Shuttle AK31A a few weeks ago and it was good to work with. It only had one IDE ribbon cable (but I have tons of those laying around) and no risers for the extra USB ports, but what can you expect for $80? The Epox is a good consideration as well and the ECS K7S5A is very inexpensive. There is even a new KT266A board out from ECS with the K7VTA3 designation for about $70 and there is a Soltek, a Gigabyte and an MSI all inbetween the prices of the Shuttle and the Epox. That should give you lots of choices and freedom to choose whichever one suits you. Unbelievable, 7 different great performing boards at affordable prices on AMD platforms. A great day to be building around AMD.
Mem
Lifer
- Apr 23, 2000
- 21,476
- 13
- 81
<< the Epox 8KHA+ is a good board, but it has it's issues >>
Really? well I`ve one and so do my friends they have no issues unless you get a bad board or user error in setup,I would go with a KT266A board now as for ATA-133 that is hyped up IMHO you won`t notice it over ATA-100 in real use.
Fanboy (FAN-boy)
n. - Term used to describe a male...fan of near-religious and rabid love for [noun]. Much of the time.....this term has a derogatory meaning to it. In its derogatory meaning, the term can be used to describe someone with no social or personal life outside of....[noun]. A stereotypical fanboy defends and loves [noun].........with the fervor of a holy crusader, at the cost of his image as seen by others, his personal appearance and hygiene, and his sociability. Milder definitions of the term can be attributed to someone with an intense love for [noun], but one who does so not at the cost of smelling like they've bathed.
This is an extreme definition used originally to describe anime fans, but it has evolved to describe pretty much an obsession/affinity for anything, while disregarding all else (be it fact, reality, evidence etc.). Combined with FUD this can be an extremely lethal combination.
Chiz
Btw: I try not to get short with people on these boards and keep my posts informative, but I can only take so much FUD; writing with a sharp pen and some wit seems to get the point across better than FUD Wars.
n. - Term used to describe a male...fan of near-religious and rabid love for [noun]. Much of the time.....this term has a derogatory meaning to it. In its derogatory meaning, the term can be used to describe someone with no social or personal life outside of....[noun]. A stereotypical fanboy defends and loves [noun].........with the fervor of a holy crusader, at the cost of his image as seen by others, his personal appearance and hygiene, and his sociability. Milder definitions of the term can be attributed to someone with an intense love for [noun], but one who does so not at the cost of smelling like they've bathed.
This is an extreme definition used originally to describe anime fans, but it has evolved to describe pretty much an obsession/affinity for anything, while disregarding all else (be it fact, reality, evidence etc.). Combined with FUD this can be an extremely lethal combination.
Chiz
Btw: I try not to get short with people on these boards and keep my posts informative, but I can only take so much FUD; writing with a sharp pen and some wit seems to get the point across better than FUD Wars.
<< Thats funny, is the "AkumaBao Guarantee of Quality?" You don't even own the board, it hasn't been readily available for more than a week, and few sites have even gotten around to reviewing it.. >>
Just becuase I haven't updated the freaking rig page doesn't mean I don't own it. My crippled ASUS: Yes, it's very crippled, crippled in performance. Hey, why don't we change the title of this thread to, "Do you have sex with your KT266 chipset too?" Nothing like a bunch of Iwill bashers to try to amke each other feel better that their chipsets SUCK! If you want to stick with VIA, that's your mistake. I don't know how this got to this point, since someone just asked for opinions, and not a bashing contest. If you can't stay on your side of the line, GET OFF THE GOD DAMN FIELD! I don't come to your threads bashing your boards. If you notice above, I even agreed with a recommendation.
<< Sounds like a term for somebody who bends over and offers a tube of KY jelly. >>
Just because that's what you do, doesn't mean everybody else does that.
<< Really? well I`ve one and so do my friends they have no issues unless you get a bad board or user error in setup,I would go with a KT266A board now as for ATA-133 that is hyped up IMHO you won`t notice it over ATA-100 in real use. >>
Well, at least that's what I've been reading in the motherboard setion the past 4 weeks! Where have you been?
<< n. - Term used to describe a male...fan of near-religious and rabid love for [noun]. Much of the time.....this term has a derogatory meaning to it. In its derogatory meaning, the term can be used to describe someone with no social or personal life outside of....[noun]. A stereotypical fanboy defends and loves [noun].........with the fervor of a holy crusader, at the cost of his image as seen by others, his personal appearance and hygiene, and his sociability. Milder definitions of the term can be attributed to someone with an intense love for [noun], but one who does so not at the cost of smelling like they've bathed. >>
I don't remember about asking what type of person you are, but that's exactly how I would picture you.
I don't worship that board. Just becuase it's been about the most fail-safe board I've run into, is where I get my opinion. If you can't respect that than why the fvck are you here!?! I'm done with this crap. I'm sick of talking to wanna-be mods.
I sticking to the technical threads. Forget my opinions, and my ideas. They don't get any respect anyway. I'll keep them to myself from now on. Sorry everybody.
Mem
Lifer
- Apr 23, 2000
- 21,476
- 13
- 81
<< Well, at least that's what I've been reading in the motherboard setion the past 4 weeks! Where have you been? >>
Well I`ve been here nearly 2yrs and yes the problems you speak off are mainly the bad batch of Epox boards with bad bios that have since been replaced now the fact that I`ve read virtually all the Epox thread problems and still went and purchased one going by all the great reviews and had zero problems in setup and stability along with my fellow Epox owners here in UK says a lot for the stability of the board.
Remember at the end of the day no brand or board is RMA proof , there`s also nothing wrong with Epox 8KHA+ there have been lots of threads where it has been either user error or wrong hardware(low PSU rating) along with some bad boards like bad bios batch etc remember even Asus gets returns on faulty boards.
You probably have already seen this, but in case you haven't check this thread:
Newegg.com to stop selling all Epox MB's
I just got an AK31A and a PAL8045. Plan to start putting it together this weekend. Will initially use with a T'Bird 900, but plan to upgrade to an 1800XP.
mdcrab
Newegg.com to stop selling all Epox MB's
I just got an AK31A and a PAL8045. Plan to start putting it together this weekend. Will initially use with a T'Bird 900, but plan to upgrade to an 1800XP.
mdcrab
<<
<< Thats funny, is the "AkumaBao Guarantee of Quality?" You don't even own the board, it hasn't been readily available for more than a week, and few sites have even gotten around to reviewing it.. >>
Just becuase I haven't updated the freaking rig page doesn't mean I don't own it. My crippled ASUS: Yes, it's very crippled, crippled in performance. Hey, why don't we change the title of this thread to, "Do you have sex with your KT266 chipset too?" Nothing like a bunch of Iwill bashers to try to amke each other feel better that their chipsets SUCK! If you want to stick with VIA, that's your mistake. I don't know how this got to this point, since someone just asked for opinions, and not a bashing contest. If you can't stay on your side of the line, GET OFF THE GOD DAMN FIELD! I don't come to your threads bashing your boards. If you notice above, I even agreed with a recommendation. >>
I'm just wondering, AkumaBao, have you seen any major reviews of this new board, because I would love to read one. I heard about it for the first time here on these boards and I was looking around for information and have not been able to find any yet. If you know of some sites or have some links I would appreciate it, seriously. All of the chipset reviews I have read lately have given the KT266A top marks so that is what I base most of my information on. As for bashing, VIA and standing with ALi, based on past experience I will have to say that seems like a mistake. While VIA has had its problems, it has produced more chipsets than just about any body else, so you've got to expect a higher number of problems to encounter. I still have a board in one of my rigs that is based on an old VIA chipset and it has a 450 MHz AMD K6-3+ in there and it is running great. I don't have any problems with VIA at all, but maybe I've just been lucky. Let me know where I can get some info on the ALi chipset that you like so well.
Well, yes, my ASUS I can see doesn't have KT266A now, and I'm probably going to get rid of it. So the problems of the 8KHA+ has just been a bad yeild of boards? Muntz, you're right about the older VIA chipsets, they seem to work great! About every Socket 7 board I've used has been A good board, even my FIC Pa-2013! I think I just got a bad impressing from this ASUS, and now I'm thinking about getting an 8KHA+ just to see how it runs, but I tihnk I'll wait until this bad batch clears up. I know I sound so Pro-Iwill, but that's just becuase I've had great luck with Iwill's. (except for the KA266-R , and ATI cards) That and their sound was actually decent for on-board sound! I got the XP333 just becuase I liked the specs, and I haven't really seen anyone else saying they wanted one. I don't know where to fan-boy came from, since I don't think Iwill's are considered "trendy". Well, thanx for the enlightenment.
do any of you well informed folks have an opinion of the Abit KG-7R? i'm going to use a 1700xp and winxp and set it up for raid. thx
If you go the Via chipset route, its always best to wait one generation, and go with their "A" version of the chipsets.. , KT133A, KT266A, and so on..
Shuttle AK31A, MSI KT266 PRO 2 are a coupe of my recommendations, for "bare-bone, no extra's" solutions..
A very important consideration is power supply issues. Alot of users, built top of the line systems, and put in a cheap @$$ power supply. You cant skimp on the power supply.. Absolutely, in no way possible. 350W minimum. That gives you plenty of overhead, even if you dont load your system down with multiple hard drives, multiple optical devices, Geforce 3, etc...
Good name brands such as Enermax, Antec, PC Power & Cooling, and I'm sure there are a few others..
Of course, I noticed you plan to get DDR.. Well, GET IT NOW!
Prices are rising, steadily. Most likely will not stabilize until after the shopping season, or longer..
I think there is a DDR shortage.. but if anyone can clarify this, in case I am wrong..
mello out chiz...............yes there are some problems with the xp333.....just like any other board ...the epox 8kha+ included....if you get the xp333.....it has to be the rev..2.1....and it has been out for at least a month or so....i read alot of good things from people that have it....your not looking in the rigth place for them......amdmb.com.......if you want to check it out.....
Epox 8KHA+ (KT266A chipset). Good mobo. The new rev 2.0 w/ "U=" bios is solid. W/ the latest bios (02/11/2001), most of the "issues" had been solved.
<< mello out chiz............... >>
Heheh I thought I was mellow
I take exception to certain posts on these forums for a reason. Many people come here for solid advice on what to get and to find "how to" information. I'm a consultant, and sound advice and information is what puts green in my wallet; anything less is unacceptable in my line of work. That being said, there are different approaches to giving advice which can be applied in any instance. I base my advice on a) first-hand experience, b) commonly accepted results from reliable sources (like reading something in the NYTimes), and c) technical, empirical evidence. There's nothing wrong with trumpeting a product based on opinion or optimism, but there should be some type of disclaimer. Without solid evidence as backup, that info is just FUD, and FUD sucks.
Akuma, I never directly called you a fanboy, someone asked what a fanboy was and I defined it. Whether you fit that mold or not, I'll not comment, but I've been reading your posts on the XP333 for the past month. Its just disturbing how someone can recommend a board like it is the clear choice when it wasn't released (at the time of your first post on the XP333), and reliable information on it was not readily available. I'm not going to call you a liar, but when you first posted your message in this thread, you had a post a day or two earlier that said you had not yet purchased/received an XP333. I didn't even bother to check your rig sig. Its fine to say you think this board will be excellent based on your past results with Iwill boards, but your posts don't convey that message and you recommend something that a) exceeds the scope of the original posters needs, and b) is still questionable in performance.
Most people that come here can read all the posts and formulate intelligent decisions, but bad advice creates noise that can cloud people's judgement. I take the time to think about what I'm posting and how it will be perceived by others; I'd feel awful if someone made a poor buying choice or modification based on erroneous information I provided. I think its pretty clear when I post opinion and what I believe to be fact. Nothing wrong with opinions, but when force-fed as gospel, its bad mojo. Just like in real life, its about accountability and credibility; just b/c this is an internet forum doesn't mean people should think there aren't repercussions for their actions.
Chiz
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