Motherboard and Ram Problem

[farmersdaughter]

I just purchased an Asrock A780FullDisplayPort and I can't get it to play nice with the memory. The CPU is a Phenom 9850 Black Edition. Using PC8500 memory at 1066 (2 x 2gb) I cannot get the board to post with both sticks installed no matter how I physically configure the sticks on the board. It will post and boot successfully with one stick installed. The memory is OCZ Reaper and I used their timing specs when configuring the bios. I then tried with two other sticks of OCZ Reaper memory (PC6400 2 x 2gb). I got the exact same results. So my question for the experts is.....Am I missing a critical setting in the bios to get this up and running or is it more likely that I have a defective board? Any help with this is greatly appreciated.

 

[jkresh]

what voltage did you set the memory at, its likely the pc8500 wants to run at higher then standard ddr2 voltages (probably its 2.1 and 1.8 is standard), if you haven't changed the memory voltage in the bios then try that (change it to what your pc8500 lists on the box).

 

[BonzaiDuck]

We can make some intelligent speculation about this, I think. [I'll suppress my . . . imagination . . . that you're . . . . . kicking back with jean-shorts and cowboy boots on a haystack . . . . ]

I'm assuming that you haven't OC'd the Phenom and Asrock yet?

I'm not familiar with AMD systems. But I'm assuming that memory will auto-configure with "Auto" settings with an AMD processor and board.

There's also something called "Native-mode" - at least with my Intel 775 boards. The DDR2-1000+ sticks are supposed to configure automatically at DDR2-800 and some very loose timings.

You don't say anything about voltage, but you do say you're running them at factory-spec manual settings (which usually are tighter than the default values.)

Also, I've been through this issue before with earlier-gen OCZ's. Some modules played nice with AMD systems, and others played nice with Intel, and you'd find some sticks that would go one way and not the other. So -- I know you've already purchased these -- but check the OCZ web-site configurator to assure compatibility.

Otherwise, start with "auto" settings on everything, and brush up on OCZ's maximum warranty voltage for those -- remembering that they have a margin of safety under warranty called "EVP" or something like that.

I'm not your AMD guy, though . . . and haven't ridden a horse for about . . . . 35 years . . .

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Hey, farmersdaughter!!

I forgot one thing: "Welcome to Anandtech forums!" -- and forgive my kidding around.


I'm just a little Daffy, and inth-tead of "Thilly Thavages," I say "Thirry Thavages."

 

[farmersdaughter]

Thanks for the welcome BonzaiDuck...Love your sense of humor. I really am a farmers daughter but to tell the truth it's been nearly as long since I was on a horse also! Heaven only knows where you might go with that one!

But on to business. To the question both of you asked, I have tried the PC8500 with the default settings of the bios and have also tried voltages of 2.0 and 2.1 using timings of 5-5-5-18 and 5-5-5-15. Not sure now if I've tried those in every possible combination or not.

Nothing has been OC'd at this point. I've never seen a "native-mode" on an AMD board but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist, and I've always went with AMD.

What makes me wonder most about the board is that the PC6400 ram was most recently on another AMD board (Asus, which I understand is the parent company of Asrock thought that wouldn't necessarily mean much) and I had no problems with it on that board. I did return the bios of this Asrock board to the default settings before I tried with the PC6400 sticks.

As for a memory configurator, I tried that route before I bought the ram and maybe because it's a fairly new board I didn't have any luck finding it in anybody's configurator. If anyone has anything more to offer I'd be really grateful and in the meantime I guess I'll try a little more experimentation.

 

[jkresh]

have you tried at 2.1 with everything else set to default? Also have you tried 2 sitcks but single channel (depending on the board that means either one in each color slot or both in the same slot). Part of the issue with an amd system (which will also be the case with Nehalem) is that with something like this it could be the board or it could be the memory controller (which is on the cpu), so since you have already tried another set of memory if you could get ahold of 2nd cpu to try (borrow from a friend or ...) it might help narrow things down. Also when you try to boot with both sticks what exactly happens, do you get a post code and if you do have you looked it up to see what it says the error is, or do you get nothing?

 

[farmersdaughter]

Thanks for the suggestions jkresh. I haven't tried either of those, so it's worth a shot. I'll post back with results. Absolutely nothing happens with both sticks in. The fans spin up (CPU and case) but that's it. No post at all...No beeps, no sign of monitor or hard drive life. Unfortunately there's no shot of getting my hands on another 9850 CPU to test that possibility so I'll just have to do the best I can to eliminate the board as the culprit.

 

[farmersdaughter]

Trying voltage of 2.1 with everything else at default gave the same results. However, installing the sticks in single channel mode allowed my system to post and boot! It's not exactly what I want, but I'll take it for now. Ram and timing issues aren't exactly my strong suit, so what exactly should this be telling me? Are there adjustments that can be made in the bios to allow dual channel mode, or is something defective, or am I just looking at more experimenting to further pin it down?

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Did you try both sticks one at a time in single channel mode? I was wondering if you didn't have a bad memory stick, but I think you said you'd tried two different pairs of RAM. Well, there are only so many parts which may now be candidates for "defective."

We must all be masochists for doing what we do here . . .

I wish I'd attempted to put my iron in the AMD fire. But without buckets of ducats, I chose to follow the Intel path. The last AMD processor I had was an 8 or 16 Mhz AMD replacement for an Intel 8088. [Geez. That's ancient history . . . along with Okidata 92 dot-matrix printers with ribbon spools . . . At least if I remember those items, I haven't contracted Oldheimers Disease . . . . yet . . . . ]

 

[farmersdaughter]

It's getting complicated now, isn't it?!?! With both ram kits the system would post and boot only if I installed one stick...dead as a doornail when I tried to use both sticks in dual channel mode. I can get the system to post and boot using both sticks of PC8500 in single channel mode...in other words there is one stick in the yellow A slot and one stick in the orange A slot.

And I don't know about you but I think what really makes us masochists is that we're up in the middle of the night trying to solve problems....And they try to tell us that computers make our lives easier and better..............

 

[BonzaiDuck]

It's as though I'm right there, feeling your pain, the way you describe it.

I could tell you stories about whole weekends -- days AND evenings. I would emerge barely able to make it to work on Monday, or stay awake after I got there. I reminded myself of Jeff Bridges' character at the end of the movie "Thunderbolt and Lightfoot," when he says to Clint Eastwood with a punch-drunk expression on his face:

"We did a good job, Ma-a-a-nnn!!"

before he finally punches out from his head injury, leaving Eastwood's character with all the loot.

 

[farmersdaughter]

Personally, I try to blot those weekends out of my memory. Guess that's why I've done it more than once.

My final questions remains though....Is this single channel only mode indicative of a defective piece of hardware? Are there tweaks, bios or otherwise, that can be implemented to enable dual channel mode? Is this a quirk of the hardware combination so it's as good as it's gonna get? The OCZ website refers to an SPD tool and I wonder if that might do the trick. They claim the Trfc setting is critical to 1066 memory running correctly and that is one setting that doesn't exist in this bios. If I understand the info about the SPD tool correctly, I could set the Trfc with that tool.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Well, I find it hard to accept that either the processor with it's memory controller or the motherboard are defective . . . and I'm totally out of my league here for not having built an AMD system in the past few years.

But there ARE times when I've either had trouble getting RAM to seat, or I've had defective RAM slots. I've bought motherboards to discover there was defective PCI_E x1 slot, or a bad LAN plug, or just a defective onboard LAN feature.

You need more input from AMD-savvy folks. Even with the "Hyper-Transport" and on-CPU memory controller, it cannot be that tricky to configure an AMD processor, mobo and memory. And I'll bet a hun . . . . don't cheat me . . . I'll just BET that you've got to know the Asrock user's manual inside and out by now.

I can imagine all sorts of things that I'd say have less than a 1% probability -- two bad RAM kits -- how likely is that? You've got to nail this thing down, though, and I appeal to all the AMD veterans here to help you.

ONe thing you might do while forging ahead - find the user forum for the Asrock motherboard -- that's one place to see if this isn't something to do with BIOS settings or circumstances that don't require RMA'ing a part.

 

[farmersdaughter]

It's definitely the board. I broke down and went through the hassle of what I really didn't want to do. Put a different AMD cpu that's also compatible with the board on, and got the exact same results with the ram. At least I have the peace of mind of knowing for sure it isn't the Phenom. So it's rma land for the board. Thanks so much to you, BonzaiDuck and you, jkresh. The two of you were invaluable resources with your suggestions and input. You pointed me in the right direction to help me sort it all out, and I got to learn a couple of new things along the way as well.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I was beginning to worry!

I have little basis for judgment about boards and board-makers -- except the ones I use, and I lean toward ASUS. I'd seen ASRock occasionally in bundle-deals at Frye's Outpost and in the LA Times Frye's ads. Did someone here say that ASRock is a rebadged ASUS, or that ASUS was making them?

We bought two $60 boards by Gigabyte with built in graphics for upgrades overdue in the fam-damn-ily. One of them had a bad PCI_E x1 slot, and we couldn't get a gigabit lan card to work in it. But with a PCI gigabit on hand, and given the price of the board, I hardly blinked and didn't even consider RMA'ing.