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Most Republicans think Trump is a better president than Lincoln

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Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,130
13,070
136
Are we talking about republicans or the democrats debates?

As for voters. Well Trump was a punch in the nose. I think a lot of people that voted for Trump felt disenfranchised. Every other politician wants to make promises to help minorities and gays and kind of leave the lower white middle class behind. I think a lot of Trump voters felt like they were being told by liberals that their belief system doesn't count and they didn't count. Maybe they weren't smart enough to understand. So they bloodied the liberals noses.

Unless democrats can impeach Trump AND remove him from office the poor stupid forgotten lower middle class is going to deliver a knock out blow and we get 4 more years of Trump.
It was a giant fuck you to the world from disaffected white people, mostly those who are actually more affluent.


They thought Trump was different. And he is, kinda. He's the ultimate Republican con artist.
 

GodisanAtheist

Platinum Member
Nov 16, 2006
2,540
1,028
136
Are we talking about republicans or the democrats debates?

As for voters. Well Trump was a punch in the nose. I think a lot of people that voted for Trump felt disenfranchised. Every other politician wants to make promises to help minorities and gays and kind of leave the lower white middle class behind. I think a lot of Trump voters felt like they were being told by liberals that their belief system doesn't count and they didn't count. Maybe they weren't smart enough to understand. So they bloodied the liberals noses.

Unless democrats can impeach Trump AND remove him from office the poor stupid forgotten lower middle class is going to deliver a knock out blow and we get 4 more years of Trump.
-This is it, exactly. Feelings. People **feel** disenfranchised, even if they're doing better than 99% of humanity that has ever existed, cause they're not shitting in gold toilets like the mega wealthy are.

At the end of the day, this is about white high school educated blue collar workers needing to feel special, needing to feel talked about, needing to feel like their problems matter to someone. I don't know if they feel like this is a zero sum game, where talking about minorities is breath that could have been used to talk about them, but ultimately they're upset that their issues aren't in the spotlight.

And thanks to the electoral college, these folks have an outsized influence on our electoral process.

I don't agree with it, but as they say you go to war with the army you got, not the one you wish you had.
 

sportage

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2008
8,882
1,161
126
Obviously, Lincoln freed the slaves which most Republicans consider to be the biggest mistake the country ever made. The idea that we should treat other races as equal is like the worst thing ever to a solid majority of the current Republican party. That Trump continuously attacks different ethnic and nationality groups makes him the perfect President to those people.
I would love to see Fox News or Rush Limbaugh or a Sean Hannity back in that Lincoln era. Does anyone really believe that Fox or Limbaugh or Hannity would be standing up for the slaves or for their freedom?
NO..... THEY WOULD NOT. DEFINITELY NOT. NEVER.
We all know that. And so do they.
They would be calling Abe Lincoln a traitor and anti American and their only concern would be with the loss of THE MONEY and loss of THE WEALTH and the loss of THE PROPERTY of those plantation owners.
For them, slaves were like owning cattle or owning a Mercedes Benz. If Abe Lincoln was to free those slaves then for Fox News and Limbaugh and Hannity it would be like taking away personal property and personal wealth from plantation owners.
At the least they'd have called Lincoln a socialist. At the best, a traitor.
AMAZING... after all these years since Abe Lincoln, the hate is as fresh as it was back then.
For bigots and racist like Fox and Limbaugh and Hannity, time changes nothing.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
25,073
9,946
136
I would love to see Fox News or Rush Limbaugh or a Sean Hannity back in that Lincoln era. Does anyone really believe that Fox or Limbaugh or Hannity would be standing up for the slaves or for their freedom?
NO..... THEY WOULD NOT. DEFINITELY NOT. NEVER.
We all know that. And so do they.
They would be calling Abe Lincoln a traitor and anti American and their only concern would be with the loss of THE MONEY and loss of THE WEALTH and the loss of THE PROPERTY of those plantation owners.
For them, slaves were like owning cattle or owning a Mercedes Benz. If Abe Lincoln was to free those slaves then for Fox News and Limbaugh and Hannity it would be like taking away personal property and personal wealth from plantation owners.
At the least they'd have called Lincoln a socialist. At the best, a traitor.
AMAZING... after all these years since Abe Lincoln, the hate is as fresh as it was back then.
For bigots and racist like Fox and Limbaugh and Hannity, time changes nothing.
Or Fox News back in the civil rights era...
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
11,504
2,713
136
Many Repubs think Trump is a better Prez than Lincoln because those Repubs never learned anything from the history lessons they had back in elementary school, if they even had the opportunity to begin with.

OR, they have been taught an "alternative" version of history where Lincoln suppressed their ancestor's rights to own slaves and are now suffering the resultant loss of wealth and "prestige" their ancestors would have bequeathed to them, their present day descendants.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
28,043
2,546
126
Lincoln wrote the Gettysburg address, on the back of an envelope while on a train. Trump is incapable of writing a coherent paragraph, largely because he is largely uneducated, functionally illiterate and ultimately incoherent. Sanity is not prevalent, let's be honest. And "truth is out of style." I expect nothing more from registered Republicans.

 
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Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
11,704
1,009
126
Lincoln wrote the Gettysburg address, on the back of an envelope while on a train. Trump is incapable of writing a coherent paragraph, largely because he is largely uneducated, functionally illiterate and ultimately incoherent. Sanity is not prevalent, let's be honest. And "truth is out of style." I expect nothing more from registered Republicans.

Not only that, he was sick as a dog when he wrote it and when he delivered it-apparently of a variation of smallpox, an often deadly disease.

I will concede that Trump is a better Republican than Lincoln-given that the GOP abandoned it's roots almost immediately.

 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
14,352
4,625
136
Rachel had a good spot yesterday on the Repussians brain defect, Duncan Hunter, Chris Collins ... major scumbags .. still reelected like that *snaps finger*.


These poor people are being held hostage by conservative media ... brainwashed... its a sect.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
47,635
7,703
126
See this is the bull shit lie that keeps getting repeated. Treating every member of society with respect does not mean others are being left behind.
The Party of Lincoln now believes that the proposition that all persons are created equal is socialism, and their white identity is more important than the ideals this country was founded upon.
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
7,287
2,000
136
-This is it, exactly. Feelings. People **feel** disenfranchised, even if they're doing better than 99% of humanity that has ever existed,
This part I absolutely agree with and think is pivotal.

cause they're not shitting in gold toilets like the mega wealthy are.

At the end of the day, this is about white high school educated blue collar workers needing to feel special, needing to feel talked about, needing to feel like their problems matter to someone. I don't know if they feel like this is a zero sum game, where talking about minorities is breath that could have been used to talk about them, but ultimately they're upset that their issues aren't in the spotlight.

And thanks to the electoral college, these folks have an outsized influence on our electoral process.

I don't agree with it, but as they say you go to war with the army you got, not the one you wish you had.
The rest not so much. The stated and most apparent measures of why someone might feel disenfranchised are not holding up, I agree. But instead of invalidating the feeling, I believe it just means the source of it has been misidentified.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
103,527
18,084
136
Rachel had a good spot yesterday on the Repussians brain defect, Duncan Hunter, Chris Collins ... major scumbags .. still reelected like that *snaps finger*.


These poor people are being held hostage by conservative media ... brainwashed... its a sect.
I'm wondering if you can pretty much set your watch to GOP criminals when they do their specific criming right at the same time they publicly and proudly start endorsing criminal Trump?
 
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GodisanAtheist

Platinum Member
Nov 16, 2006
2,540
1,028
136
The rest not so much. The stated and most apparent measures of why someone might feel disenfranchised are not holding up, I agree. But instead of invalidating the feeling, I believe it just means the source of it has been misidentified.
-I personally think problems are class based, but the dialogue around these problems isn't class based, it's race based, and that's what whites find alienating.

Poor white people and poor black people etc have the same problems, certainly problems that are much more similar than a poor white person and a rich white person etc.

Problem is when a Pol talks about police brutality, or civil rights, or economic enfranchisement, they mistakenly do it through the lense of minority identity politics instead of making it about class identity, and in the process make poorer/ less educated white voters feel like no one is addressing their issues, when really they will benefit from the same "minority" policies being stated.

This leaves a gap for politicians like DT to come in and play white identity politics and scoop up these voters in droves.

Personally think the best play for Dems is to go with Bernie or Warren, people who are strongest when talking about class based issues with a broad appeal rather than trying to beat the race issues to death.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
28,043
2,546
126
Wonder what the British think of Trump??
I asked my cousin's precoscious 12 year old son that very question when I visited with the British pair at Martha's Vineyard in MA the summer before the 2016 election. He and I had fun cruising the Internet for Trumpian material, laughing our asses off. His answer to the question was one word: "Disgraceful."
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
22,531
4,699
136
Turley: “It’s not bribery until hard cash changes hands! None of this “thing of value” nonsense!”
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
55,455
3,857
126
Not surprising given that Lincoln was a liberal.
Exactly too many people seem to forget that inconvenient little fact...and...< gasp> he freed the slaves, costing good, god-fearing businessmen millions of $$$.
 
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Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,130
13,070
136
-I personally think problems are class based, but the dialogue around these problems isn't class based, it's race based, and that's what whites find alienating.

Poor white people and poor black people etc have the same problems, certainly problems that are much more similar than a poor white person and a rich white person etc.

Problem is when a Pol talks about police brutality, or civil rights, or economic enfranchisement, they mistakenly do it through the lense of minority identity politics instead of making it about class identity, and in the process make poorer/ less educated white voters feel like no one is addressing their issues, when really they will benefit from the same "minority" policies being stated.

This leaves a gap for politicians like DT to come in and play white identity politics and scoop up these voters in droves.

Personally think the best play for Dems is to go with Bernie or Warren, people who are strongest when talking about class based issues with a broad appeal rather than trying to beat the race issues to death.
Please. Trump voters were actually the more affluent. Mere fact. The GOP has been the party of white culture warrior fear & xenophobia for at least 25 years. It's not like the medicaid expansion, food programs & the rest of it aren't the same in White Appalachia as in Baltimore.
 
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GodisanAtheist

Platinum Member
Nov 16, 2006
2,540
1,028
136
Please. Trump voters were actually the more affluent. Mere fact. The GOP has been the party of white culture warrior fear & xenophobia for at least 25 years. It's not like the medicaid expansion, food programs & the rest of it aren't the same in White Appalachia as in Baltimore.
-I did some reading and it looks like you're right: I made the same mistake a lot of analysts did and equated college education to wealth (college degree = makes more money = not people who voted en masse for Trump).

It looks like a lot of HS/some college educated, middle and upper class folks voted for Trump. That's funny, because it's basically my FIL to the dot, and he is as rabid a trump supporter as I imagine there is...

I stand corrected and will have to do some additional thinking on this.
 

Gabe323

Senior member
Apr 29, 2002
246
256
146
I actually heard one of the c-span callers say this today and I wanted to die. "All Lincoln did was free the slaves" and Trump "has done more for us than any other president".
 
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Viper1j

Diamond Member
Jul 31, 2018
3,149
2,027
106
I actually heard one of the c-span callers say this today and I wanted to die. "All Lincoln did was free the slaves" and Trump "has done more for us than any other president".
Probably the same person that said "All Hitler did, was pre-heat some ovens."
 
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