More evidence as to why the drive for density is a mistake.

[Moonbeam]

There is plenty of evidence for why nature and solitude are valuable for mental health. Now it seems that a lack of biodiversity in the environment is creating immunity deficiencies in children based on scientific discoveries.

Daycares in Finland Built a 'Forest', And It Changed Kids' Immune Systems

Playing through the greenery and litter of a mini forest's undergrowth for just one month may be enough to change a child's immune system, according to an experiment in Finland.

www.sciencealert.com

Sadly the unwillingness to actually pay for the kinds of social changes that would address the mental health aspects of homelessness have created civil unrest and anger, mostly at liberal urban politicians. “We want those bums off of our streets.” The result, of course, as it always is with the helplessly ignorant, is to become desperate to apply any old solution that comes to hand. This means padding the buck via laws that require local governments to build more housing regardless of the local wishes, as if people will not fight to protect what they have.

Homelessness is a problem like a million others that can only be solved by a social revolution that improves the quality of life for everybody rather than dragging some down to benefit others.

Without a revolution in conscious awareness stasis is the result.

 

[fskimospy]

I wonder what effects mass homelessness has on people.

Any thoughts?

 

[vi edit]

We can do both. I live in a place with enough urban density that I can bike to work, my kids can walk to all three of the primary schools(Portland, OR). But we also have gardens in almost every elementary school here, community gardens in almost every community, and more front yard gardens, plant diversity and flora than I've ever seen. Prior to Covid the schools also had an entire week of "outdoor school" to celebrate and appreciate what we have outside.

Oh but we also have a raging homeless crisis. So there's that.

 

[fskimospy]

We can do both. I live in a place with enough urban density that I can bike to work, my kids can walk to all three of the primary schools(Portland, OR). But we also have gardens in almost every elementary school here, community gardens in almost every community, and more front yard gardens, plant diversity and flora than I've ever seen. Prior to Covid the schools also had an entire week of "outdoor school" to celebrate and appreciate what we have outside.

Oh but we also have a raging homeless crisis. So there's that.

None of this is complicated. For the last half century people have viewed home ownership as a means of wealth generation, and it has been.

Logically though this cannot be an endless cycle. What’s happened is it has reached a breaking point.

 

[vi edit]

We need more mixed use urban areas. Basically the European model. Here we want these corporate downtown areas and have no one live there. Or Suburbs that have endless miles of big box shopping that you have to drive to. Instead, offer more mixed use spaces where more people live near where they shop/dine/work. But zoning laws are hard to change.

 

[MrSquished]

Do you have any articles on the negative effects of urban sprawl? All the driving it takes to get anywhere? All the extra effects on the environment it takes to build and sustain larger and larger homes in single family zoning?

You can build density while incorporating green spaces. You can never fix the terrible effects of urban sprawl, and not just on housing prices and homelessness, but also the environmental effects it has.

 

[sdifox]

Practice what you preach. Stop posting.

 

[Moonbeam]

I wonder what effects mass homelessness has on people.

Any thoughts?

I described the effects in my OP. Homelessness is such a profound and difficult issue that all solutions are hand offs to some other group to deal with it. Here is the simplest result. Homelessness is caused by people not having a home so build more homes. Build them on top of each other if need be. Just get the homeless and the liberals off my ass.

How we develop our society should be scientifically designed to maximize human happiness. Dying of thirst? A few sips of water look like relief. Where is the national effort to redesign civilization scientifically so that all children can feel a connection to the earth? Why isn't most of our food grown locally? Why isn't every person vital for human survival? I think for the sake of your decent morality you keep the issues small to manage the stress.of the real magnitude of the problem. Our whole society is fucked. There are no one dimensional fixes.

 

[Moonbeam]

Do you have any articles on the negative effects of urban sprawl? All the driving it takes to get anywhere? All the extra effects on the environment it takes to build and sustain larger and larger homes in single family zoning?

You can build density while incorporating green spaces. You can never fix the terrible effects of urban sprawl, and not just on housing prices and homelessness, but also the environmental effects it has.

I do not disagree with this.

 

[Moonbeam]

We can do both. I live in a place with enough urban density that I can bike to work, my kids can walk to all three of the primary schools(Portland, OR). But we also have gardens in almost every elementary school here, community gardens in almost every community, and more front yard gardens, plant diversity and flora than I've ever seen. Prior to Covid the schools also had an entire week of "outdoor school" to celebrate and appreciate what we have outside.

Oh but we also have a raging homeless crisis. So there's that.

Everyone homeless wants to be homeless in places like Portland.

 

[eelw]

Let’s examine sentinel island as case study

 

[MtnMan]

Wait... What?

Is the link broken? When I click on it, I get an article about how children exposed to natural organisms, dirt, etc., in the natural environment develop a better immune system, which is a good thing.

I have always said that germaphobe parents that don't allow their kids to play and get dirty outside are handicapping that child's immune system. How many kids have never walked barefoot on grass or dirt? Children need to develop their immune system, and that doesn't happen when they never touch anything that hasn't been Lysol'ed and bleached daily.

 

[MtnMan]

Let’s examine sentinel island as case study

This post should put in the running for the non-sequitur award of the week.

 

[Moonbeam]

This post should put in the running for the non-sequitur award of the week.

The point was rather simple. The greater the density of housing in some unit of urban area the less open space and biodiversity there is likely to be. And because the organic intelligence of the body is likely to recognize this the more prized real estate with open space will be prized by people. The greater it's value in job rich areas will be as well as the desire of fortunate owners for whatever reason that happen to live there will want to preserve it unchanged. If you want to create improvements in the lives of the homeless one thing one may not wish to do is go right out and piss into the wind.

 

[MtnMan]

The point was rather simple. The greater the density of housing in some unit of urban area the less open space and biodiversity there is likely to be. And because the organic intelligence of the body is likely to recognize this the more prized real estate with open space will be prized by people. The greater it's value in job rich areas will be as well as the desire of fortunate owners for whatever reason that happen to live there will want to preserve it unchanged. If you want to create improvements in the lives of the homeless one thing one may not wish to do is go right out and piss into the wind.

But the competition for a non-sequitur post of the week is heating up...

 

[Zor Prime]

I travel and work abroad for months on end, I spend most of my time in CA lately. The city I'm in most of the time has over half the population of my home state. It sure is nice when I get to go home back to Nowhereville USA where I can go out in my yard at night and piss and odds are nobody is going to see. That's one way I measure quality of life, can I go outside and take a piss w/o causing a ruckus?

 

[Jaskalas]

All this article really told us, is that we are largely altering our immune system and microbe biome by living indoors in somewhat sterile environments, cut off from both fresh dirt and organic things.

We are growing stale.
It could be harmful, it could be beneficial.
And while there are obvious correlations to heavily urban and industrial areas, featuring hundreds if not thousands of square miles of pavement far as the eye can see.....
Density does not require a dead concrete environment with absolutely no organics. We've simply chosen to make our homes (and by extension our home cities) that way.

 

[MrSquished]

I travel and work abroad for months on end, I spend most of my time in CA lately. The city I'm in most of the time has over half the population of my home state. It sure is nice when I get to go home back to Nowhereville USA where I can go out in my yard at night and piss and odds are nobody is going to see. That's one way I measure quality of life, can I go outside and take a piss w/o causing a ruckus?

I use that measuring stick when I go camping or hiking or out in nature. But for that to be my regular abode is a warning sign that it's too far away from culture, food, art, all the good stuff.

 

[hal2kilo]

Seems there must be way too many people on this ball. Let's make more laws that humans won't obey.

Edit: it's too damnit.

 

[senseamp]

Given same overall land area and population, higher density housing with more open space is better than lower density housing with less open space.

 

[sandorski]

Density allows for more wilderness.

 

[vi edit]

It's also amazing what happens when you tell HOA's to fuck right off. I live on some rando street in inner SE Portland. I've got a couple dozen restaurants/bars within a few minutes walk of me. I've got a light rail less than a mile and bus route that gets to most of the major metro areas.

But we also have more food growing in tubs/planters/random things in front yards than I've seen in any other city. If I want to put a bunch of galvanized horse troughs in my yard to grow veggies and herbs and fruiting shrubs...I can! Oh and I did. I've got one 2x3 tub that is my herb garden. Another that is my leafy stuff (spinach, butter lettuce, ect) and one that's rotating peppers/onions/ect. I've also got another half dozen blueberry bushes in rainbow pots that are in my front yard. I'm growing cherry trees and grape vines. Have bamboo in planters in the back yard. There's half a dozen houses on my street that do similar. I have like 5' easement around my house I'm making the most of it because I can. I don't have an HOA breathing down my back and bitching about every petty thing.

 

[K1052]

It's also amazing what happens when you tell HOA's to fuck right off. I live on some rando street in inner SE Portland. I've got a couple dozen restaurants/bars within a few minutes walk of me. I've got a light rail less than a mile and bus route that gets to most of the major metro areas.

But we also have more food growing in tubs/planters/random things in front yards than I've seen in any other city. If I want to put a bunch of galvanized horse troughs in my yard to grow veggies and herbs and fruiting shrubs...I can! Oh and I did. I've got one 2x3 tub that is my herb garden. Another that is my leafy stuff (spinach, butter lettuce, ect) and one that's rotating peppers/onions/ect. I've also got another half dozen blueberry bushes in rainbow pots that are in my front yard. I'm growing cherry trees and grape vines. Have bamboo in planters in the back yard. There's half a dozen houses on my street that do similar. I have like 5' easement around my house I'm making the most of it because I can. I don't have an HOA breathing down my back and bitching about every petty thing.

Basically a testament to the superiority of urban neighborhoods over sprawly suburban tract home developments lorded over by overzealous busybodies.

 

[vi edit]

Yep. I've got more freedom to do what I want with my yard(or house) here in the socialist Republic of Portland than I ever did in Kentucky, Arizona or Nebraska suburbs.

 

[senseamp]

Zoning in US is trash.