Moar Mercury, Freddie!

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
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Trump Administration Prepares a Major Weakening of Mercury Emissions Rules

"The proposal also highlights a key environmental opinion of Judge Brett Kavanaugh, the embattled Supreme Court nominee, whose nomination hearings have gripped the nation in recent days.

The coal industry initially sued to roll back the mercury regulation, and in 2014 its case lost in the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit. However, Judge Kavanaugh wrote the dissenting opinion in that case, highlighting questions about the rule’s cost to industry.

Should the legal battle over the proposed regulatory rollback go before the Supreme Court, some observers expect that Judge Kavanaugh, if elevated to a seat on the high court, would side with the coal industry.

Specifically, the new Trump administration proposal would repeal a 2011 finding made by the E.P.A. that when the federal government regulates toxic pollution such as mercury from coal-fired power plants, it must also, when considering the cost to industry of that rule, take into account the additional health benefits of reducing other pollutants as a side effect of implementing the regulation. Under the mercury program, the economic benefits of those health effects, known as “co-benefits,” helped to provide a legal and economic justification for the cost to industry of the regulation.

For example, as the nation’s power plants have complied with rule by installing technology to reduce emissions of mercury, they also created the side benefit of reducing pollution of soot and nitrogen oxide, pollutants linked to asthma and lung disease.

The Obama administration estimated that it would cost the electric utility industry an estimated $9.6 billion a year to install that mercury control technology, making it the most expensive clean air regulation ever put forth by the federal government. It found that reducing mercury brings up to $6 million annually in health benefits — a high number, but not as high as the cost to industry. However, it further justified the regulation by citing an additional $80 billion in health benefits from the additional reduction in soot and nitrogen oxide that occur as a side effect of controlling mercury.

The new proposal directs the E.P.A. to no longer take into account those “co-benefits” when considering the economic impact of a regulation."

^^^ More mercury, and more Toxic Brett . . . it's the Republican way! :(
 
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Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
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Trump is great for our economy, doing away with over reaching restrictions.
Overreaching is one word. "Over reaching" /= overreaching . . . grammatically, the former is as nonsensical and ignorant as many of your political stances.

s8zU0n0.png
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
25,715
10,471
136
Why wouldn't Republicans just content that these economic "co-benefits" are tax-deductible as long as the mercury control costs are on the balance sheet, since the industry is bearing the costs but the public is reaping the benefit?
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
1,002
126
Egads, you've been brainwashed. Either that or you're a not particularly clever troll.

I think the EPA in general is over reaching, stifles grown and business. I assume that you, like me, feel their needs to be a balance in how we go about regulations and safety while still allowing business to thrive and us to meet the needs of our appetite for energy. We probably just fall at slightly different place on that spectrum. If you use power to post on the internet, use powered transportation, have the climate in your home to your liking, etc. etc., we're probably really quite close in the grand scheme.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
88,254
55,808
136
Yeah, why on earth would we want to account for all the things a regulation does instead of just one of them.

The good news about all these shitty EPA regulations you keep hearing about is that lots of them aren't ever going to go into effect. For the EPA to change regulations that have already been published in the federal register they have to show their new position is better supported by the science than their old one. In most cases the Trump EPA has either been so lazy that they didn't bother or...well... incapable of doing it because Obama's EPA got the science right. So, when these new regulations are invariably challenged in court lots and lots of them are already being struck down.

https://biglawbusiness.com/so-much-losing-trump-deregulatory-efforts-flounder-in-court/

So while it forces people (and the government) to waste time and money getting the courts to slap Trump down, it's pretty effective in neutering his attempts at deregulation.
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
1,002
126
Overreaching is one word. "Over reaching" /= overreaching . . . grammatically, the former is as nonsensical and ignorant as many of your political stances.

s8zU0n0.png


I must have really hit close to home, made a point that made good sense against your emotional held position when I said Trump is winning big lately. You felt the need to post something back, but all you could come up with was a grammar issue. You, sadly, put your agenda ahead of America, and America doing great today is worse to you than America doing poorly so you can beat your chest and tell yourself how right you are about Trump being awful. Sorry reality doesn't agree with you, the left today has to pretend like everything is terrible to keep their emotion-based agenda intact. Today's left has become evangelical and are getting further and further away from logic.
 
Nov 29, 2006
15,928
4,505
136
Yeah, why on earth would we want to account for all the things a regulation does instead of just one of them.

The good news about all these shitty EPA regulations you keep hearing about is that lots of them aren't ever going to go into effect. For the EPA to change regulations that have already been published in the federal register they have to show their new position is better supported by the science than their old one. In most cases the Trump EPA has either been so lazy that they didn't bother or...well... incapable of doing it because Obama's EPA got the science right. So, when these new regulations are invariably challenged in court lots and lots of them are already being struck down.

https://biglawbusiness.com/so-much-losing-trump-deregulatory-efforts-flounder-in-court/

So while it forces people (and the government) to waste time and money getting the courts to slap Trump down, it's pretty effective in neutering his attempts at deregulation.

Way to go GOP, wasting our money. I thought you were the party of fiscal responsibility. Why challenge something you know you cant win on feels and waste tax payer money. I know i know. Fiscal responsibility is just a lie you feed your sheep.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
Trump is great for our economy, doing away with over reaching restrictions.


I second that, can't wait til he lowers the standards enough so we can compete with countries like China on an equal footing,

maxresdefault.jpg


Totalitarianism-Crushes-Pollution-in-China.jpg



Maybe then Americans can understand the actual costs of their cheap throwaway goods that they refuse to pay for an American to make while crying for free healthcare, living wages, paid maternity leave, etc.
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
16,142
8,740
136
Well if they can manage to have those relaxed regs only apply to solidly red owned states that's downwind from any blue ones I think it's OK. I mean, every Repub that's worth their salt shouldn't have a problem with that, right?
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,936
10,827
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You, sadly, put your agenda ahead of America...

[...]

Sorry reality doesn't agree with you...

[...]

Today's left has become evangelical and are getting further and further away from logic.
Projection!

Projection!

Projection!

How do you even begin to engage someone so brain dead? He's the butt of his own unconscious jokes! :eek:
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,960
6,802
126
Projection!

Projection!

Projection!

How do you even begin to engage someone so brain dead? He's the butt of his own unconscious jokes! :eek:
You don't but then I ask myself can anybody be so absurd without being on somebody's payroll. All I see is a Russian or a Russian dupe sowing discontent and division. He could just be brain dead but I think it just as likely he's a swine.
 

mect

Platinum Member
Jan 5, 2004
2,424
1,637
136
I think the EPA in general is over reaching, stifles grown and business. I assume that you, like me, feel their needs to be a balance in how we go about regulations and safety while still allowing business to thrive and us to meet the needs of our appetite for energy. We probably just fall at slightly different place on that spectrum. If you use power to post on the internet, use powered transportation, have the climate in your home to your liking, etc. etc., we're probably really quite close in the grand scheme.
You're obsessed with second hand smoke and yet support this kind of deregulation. Hilarious in a tragic way.
 
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SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
1,002
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You're obsessed with second hand smoke and yet support this kind of deregulation. Hilarious in a tragic way.

I am not seeking any further regulation on second hand smoke. I simply use that liberty and its cost to society to compare and contrast against guns, another right that can cause harm to society. When looked at and compared in this way, guns to relatively little harm, yet the left will shit all over the constitution over guns while ignoring much lower hanging fruit that have no upside. It just shows how agenda driven and see-through their partisan bs is.
 

UglyCasanova

Lifer
Mar 25, 2001
19,275
1,361
126
The environment seems like a logical place for government to intervene. Has the EPA overstepped its mandate? At time I’m sure they have, but regulating the environment should be in the hands of the government since it effects us all and there are external costs being borne by all of us as a result of pollution.

How do we grapple with that in the world of globalization though. It seems like we’re just offshoring our pollution. Cheap stuff from Walmart plus our air isn’t smoggy, but CO2 emissions globally are still going up because we never stopped consuming (and hell everything is being shipped further so even more emissions due to transport). Anywhom that’s a tangent since it’s beyond EPA's scope, but I definitely am pro environmental regulation.
 
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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,613
11,256
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Why wouldn't Republicans just content that these economic "co-benefits" are tax-deductible as long as the mercury control costs are on the balance sheet, since the industry is bearing the costs but the public is reaping the benefit?
It is a benefit against a cost they are creating. It's like if you burned down your neighbor's house, but then have them your used furniture and then claimed that as a tax write off.
 

mect

Platinum Member
Jan 5, 2004
2,424
1,637
136
I am not seeking any further regulation on second hand smoke. I simply use that liberty and its cost to society to compare and contrast against guns, another right that can cause harm to society. When looked at and compared in this way, guns to relatively little harm, yet the left will shit all over the constitution over guns while ignoring much lower hanging fruit that have no upside. It just shows how agenda driven and see-through their partisan bs is.
A common theme among the right, you seem to only be concerned with the rights and liberties of abusers, and not those abused by the exercise of these liberties.
 

mect

Platinum Member
Jan 5, 2004
2,424
1,637
136
The environment seems like a logical place for government to intervene. Has the EPA overstepped its mandate? At time I’m sure they have, but regulating the environment should be in the hands of the government since it effects us all and there are external costs being borne by all of us as a result of pollution.

How do we grapple with that in the world of globalization though. It seems like we’re just offshoring our pollution. Cheap stuff from Walmart plus our air isn’t smoggy, but CO2 emissions globally are still going up because we never stopped consuming (and hell everything is being shipped further so even more emissions due to transport). Anywhom that’s a tangent since it’s beyond EPA's scope, but I definitely am pro environmental regulation.
To me, this would seem an appropriate application of tariffs, particularly if we could get cooperation from the rest of the developed world. Having said that, the US is still one of the top producers of CO2 on both a gross and per capita scale.
 

outriding

Diamond Member
Feb 20, 2002
4,676
4,179
136
I have no desire to live in CA, silly 2A limits there.

I dont think you get my point..

Hinkley was part of the PG&E waste dumping ground that caused tumors and cancer for the residents..

But feel free to live in anywhere that was impacted by lack of regulating that causes people to get sick due to dumping of toxic chemicals