Mini Cooper contends for Car of Year

[NFS4]

http://auto.com/reviews/ulrich8_20020808.htm

 

[Sluggo]

I have to drive by the BMW dealership twice a day, I can look past the sedans and stuff, but these things really catch my eye. I even love to see one cruising down the road.

The "S" ?? are the best with the fat little tires.

 

[Rallispec]

::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: Rallispec
::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

Why, b/c the Cooper S faster than the Spec-V? B/C it has a better interior? B/C it comes with more standard features and safety equipment? B/C it can outhandle the Spec-V? B/C it comes with run-flats? B/C it has a longer warranty? B/C it gets better gas mileage?

Why oh why do I see this hatred?

 

[NutBucket]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: Rallispec
::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

Why, b/c the Cooper S faster than the Spec-V? B/C it has a better interior? B/C it comes with more standard features and safety equipment? B/C it can outhandle the Spec-V? B/C it comes with run-flats? B/C it has a longer warranty? B/C it gets better gas mileage?

Why oh why do I see this hatred?

 

[thedarkwolf]

Does anybody know where they get the engines for the minis? Just curious how many people know its a dodge neon engine . Actually I just wanted to see if anybody could confirm what I read over at linky to a turbo dodge thread about it. I don't really care either way since I would never own one but it could make for some interesting mods turbo 2.4l .

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: thedarkwolf
Does anybody know where they get the engines for the minis? Just curious how many people know its a dodge neon engine . Actually I just wanted to see if anybody could confirm what I read over at linky to a turbo dodge thread about it. I don't really care either way since I would never own one but it could make for some interesting mods turbo 2.4l .

It's NOT a Neon engine.

It's a brand new engine that was developed by BMW and Chrysler. And the Mini uses a 1.6 liter engine, not a 2.4 liter engine.

 

[bonk102]

those things rule, i want one

 

[thedarkwolf]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: thedarkwolf
Does anybody know where they get the engines for the minis? Just curious how many people know its a dodge neon engine . Actually I just wanted to see if anybody could confirm what I read over at linky to a turbo dodge thread about it. I don't really care either way since I would never own one but it could make for some interesting mods turbo 2.4l .

It's NOT a Neon engine.

It's a brand new engine that was developed by BMW and Chrysler. And the Mini uses a 1.6 liter engine, not a 2.4 liter engine.

I knew it was a 1.6l but according to those guys its a destroked 2.0l and since a 2.4l is the same block I was thinking swap.

"The engine is a "joint venture" between pre-merger Chrysler and BMW. It is in essence, as noted here, a destroked 2.0L. It is being used by Chrysler nearly everywhere in the world but North America.

If you read any story about the Mini and this will be mentioned. Or you can pick up the latest Mopar Now and there's an editorial that mentions it....."

I am not saying they are correct btw I just never bothered to read much about these since I find them to be fugly but found it interesting that BMW teamed up with Chrysler.

 

[SgtBuddy]

I doubt they are using a current gen destroked 2.0L engine in the Mini. Doesn't the Mini come with a DOHC 1.6L? Current gen Neons only come with a SOHC engine.

Now the SRT-4, coming out early next year, will give the Mini some troubles. Take the savings and upgrade the already decent Neon suspension and you got a Mini Eater right there.

(SRT-4 comes with a 2.4L turbocharged 4-cyl, 5.9sec 0-60 {hopefully they don't reneg on that number...it's been hyped enough}, and a bunch of other goodies. 205-215HP (numbers move back and forth) and 225-240ft/lbs torque (also a moving number). Under $20K. Nice

)


<-owns a 97 DOHC SC, 5sp and spends just about the same amount of time on the Neon boards as he does AToT

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: SgtBuddy
I doubt they are using a current gen destroked 2.0L engine in the Mini. Doesn't the Mini come with a DOHC 1.6L? Current gen Neons only come with a SOHC engine.

Now the SRT-4, coming out early next year, will give the Mini some troubles. Take the savings and upgrade the already decent Neon suspension and you got a Mini Eater right there.

(SRT-4 comes with a 2.4L turbocharged 4-cyl, 5.9sec 0-60 {hopefully they don't reneg on that number...it's been hyped enough}, and a bunch of other goodies. 205-215HP (numbers move back and forth) and 225-240ft/lbs torque (also a moving number). Under $20K. Nice

)


<-owns a 97 DOHC SC, 5sp and spends just about the same amount of time on the Neon boards as he does AToT

Yeah, the Mini uses a DOHC engine. The guys on the Mopar board are smokin' something

Also, comparing the Mini to the Neon isn't really a comparision. The Neon is a bargain basement econobox with a cheap interior and riced out exterior (in SRT-4 trim). I'll gladly take the better built, better finished, quality interior, 6-speed manual, and 3-Series rear suspension of the Cooper S. Not to mention that resale value on Neons is HORRIBLE. Also, power front windows, but roll up back windows...WTF???

What Emunds.com said about the Neon SRT which placed dead last in a 6-car comparo:

A curious mix of luxury and cheapness characterize the cabin. On one hand is the gathered leather on the seats, a padded center console armrest up front and chrome door release levers, all lending an upscale look and feel. But on the other are manual controls for the rear windows (even though the fronts are powered) and a cheesy plastic trim plate that surrounds the center stack. And then there is that quirky, upside-down steering wheel and a nearly hidden "in-dash" CD changer. If you can't find the changer, look down under the center stack. A few features did manage to win favor with our critical staff, however, such as the hefty leather gearshift knob and a compass/outside temperature display conveniently located beneath the rearview mirror.

But away from the track and out in the real world, the R/T felt leaden and somewhat disconnected due to its droning engine, imprecise gearshift and numb steering. Plenty of wind and road noise invade the cabin, and added to the engine noise, they will have you testing the power of the stereo. Combine this cacophony with marginal front seat comfort and long trips in the Neon can get tiresome. Backseat occupants, however, will enjoy plenty of room and a well-contoured seat.

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/61394/page001.html

 

[imported_vr6]

Originally posted by: SgtBuddy
I doubt they are using a current gen destroked 2.0L engine in the Mini. Doesn't the Mini come with a DOHC 1.6L? Current gen Neons only come with a SOHC engine.

Now the SRT-4, coming out early next year, will give the Mini some troubles. Take the savings and upgrade the already decent Neon suspension and you got a Mini Eater right there.

(SRT-4 comes with a 2.4L turbocharged 4-cyl, 5.9sec 0-60 {hopefully they don't reneg on that number...it's been hyped enough}, and a bunch of other goodies. 205-215HP (numbers move back and forth) and 225-240ft/lbs torque (also a moving number). Under $20K. Nice

)


<-owns a 97 DOHC SC, 5sp and spends just about the same amount of time on the Neon boards as he does AToT

but then again.. its neon..

anyway back to the topic, what other cars are up for car of the year?

 

[BatmanNate]

Are these not a big thing in the Pacific Northwest? I've never even seen one on the road here near Seattle.

 

[Sluggo]

Originally posted by: BatmanNate
Are these not a big thing in the Pacific Northwest? I've never even seen one on the road here near Seattle.

There are at least 3 that cruise near my house.

1 black S Cooper
1 Black Cooper
1 Black S cooper with the roof painted black, and tinted windows, it looks really nice.

Ummmm all the Coopers I have seen are black, did Henry Ford design them?

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: Kwan1

Originally posted by: SgtBuddy
I doubt they are using a current gen destroked 2.0L engine in the Mini. Doesn't the Mini come with a DOHC 1.6L? Current gen Neons only come with a SOHC engine.

Now the SRT-4, coming out early next year, will give the Mini some troubles. Take the savings and upgrade the already decent Neon suspension and you got a Mini Eater right there.

(SRT-4 comes with a 2.4L turbocharged 4-cyl, 5.9sec 0-60 {hopefully they don't reneg on that number...it's been hyped enough}, and a bunch of other goodies. 205-215HP (numbers move back and forth) and 225-240ft/lbs torque (also a moving number). Under $20K. Nice

)


<-owns a 97 DOHC SC, 5sp and spends just about the same amount of time on the Neon boards as he does AToT

but then again.. its neon..

anyway back to the topic, what other cars are up for car of the year?

Most likely the '03 Viper SRT-10 and the '03 Accord

 

[Nemesis77]

Originally posted by: Sluggo
Ummmm all the Coopers I have seen are black, did Henry Ford design them?

Do you need other colors besides black ? It doesn't matter what color it is, as long as it's black.

 

[iamwiz82]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: SgtBuddy
I doubt they are using a current gen destroked 2.0L engine in the Mini. Doesn't the Mini come with a DOHC 1.6L? Current gen Neons only come with a SOHC engine.

Now the SRT-4, coming out early next year, will give the Mini some troubles. Take the savings and upgrade the already decent Neon suspension and you got a Mini Eater right there.

(SRT-4 comes with a 2.4L turbocharged 4-cyl, 5.9sec 0-60 {hopefully they don't reneg on that number...it's been hyped enough}, and a bunch of other goodies. 205-215HP (numbers move back and forth) and 225-240ft/lbs torque (also a moving number). Under $20K. Nice

)


<-owns a 97 DOHC SC, 5sp and spends just about the same amount of time on the Neon boards as he does AToT

Yeah, the Mini uses a DOHC engine. The guys on the Mopar board are smokin' something

Also, comparing the Mini to the Neon isn't really a comparision. The Neon is a bargain basement econobox with a cheap interior and riced out exterior (in SRT-4 trim). I'll gladly take the better built, better finished, quality interior, 6-speed manual, and 3-Series rear suspension of the Cooper S. Not to mention that resale value on Neons is HORRIBLE. Also, power front windows, but roll up back windows...WTF???

What Emunds.com said about the Neon SRT which placed dead last in a 6-car comparo:

A curious mix of luxury and cheapness characterize the cabin. On one hand is the gathered leather on the seats, a padded center console armrest up front and chrome door release levers, all lending an upscale look and feel. But on the other are manual controls for the rear windows (even though the fronts are powered) and a cheesy plastic trim plate that surrounds the center stack. And then there is that quirky, upside-down steering wheel and a nearly hidden "in-dash" CD changer. If you can't find the changer, look down under the center stack. A few features did manage to win favor with our critical staff, however, such as the hefty leather gearshift knob and a compass/outside temperature display conveniently located beneath the rearview mirror.

But away from the track and out in the real world, the R/T felt leaden and somewhat disconnected due to its droning engine, imprecise gearshift and numb steering. Plenty of wind and road noise invade the cabin, and added to the engine noise, they will have you testing the power of the stereo. Combine this cacophony with marginal front seat comfort and long trips in the Neon can get tiresome. Backseat occupants, however, will enjoy plenty of room and a well-contoured seat.

http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/61394/page001.html

they compared the R/T not the SRT. the SRT has a different engine, gearbox, slightly redesigned interior. I'd take that over a cooper any day. You can sped $26k on a freaking go kart.

 

[Rent]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: Rallispec
::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

Why, b/c the Cooper S faster than the Spec-V? B/C it has a better interior? B/C it comes with more standard features and safety equipment? B/C it can outhandle the Spec-V? B/C it comes with run-flats? B/C it has a longer warranty? B/C it gets better gas mileage?

Why oh why do I see this hatred?

Or because the mini-S cost at least 4k+? Or because the Mini-S can only compare to a Spec V (or most other econohatches for that matter)?

Give me a break, the Mini is a great little car, but for what it is, its WAY too much to pay. As for run-flats and (laf) better gas milage, you really have to see what you want the car for - a yuppie status symbol like a Beetle or a performance oriented subcompact. Unfortunately, the Mini will be the first.

 

[Rallispec]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: Rallispec
::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

Why, b/c the Cooper S faster than the Spec-V? B/C it has a better interior? B/C it comes with more standard features and safety equipment? B/C it can outhandle the Spec-V? B/C it comes with run-flats? B/C it has a longer warranty? B/C it gets better gas mileage?

Why oh why do I see this hatred?

what are you smoking NSF4?!! how are you even comparing the cooperS to the spec V. Of course the cooper S is going to be a quick little car.. the little sh!t barely weighs a ton. Lets see you cram 5 adults into it though, With thier luggage! It can't be done. Quick little car, maybe. Practical. No. Ugly as sin. yes.

not to mention the starting price on the cooper S is what,... like $19,900 i believe? well for nearly 3 thousand more than the starting price of the spec v (17,200) it had damn well have some nicer interior. Speaking of that.. so how much does a loaded cooper S cost? Seeing as how i got my V, fully loaded for $2,000 less than the starting price of the cooper S, i dont see how you can compare the two.

 

[UberDave]

it's a mercury capri 1.6L engine back in the 91-94 days. DOHC.


j/k

 

[GTaudiophile]

I test drove a MINI Cooper S at Hank Aaron BMW in Union City, GA. It was loaded will everything. Color was dark silver with black roof/mirror treatment, and it had some special foglights. It's a blast to drive and certainly worth the effort to drive to your nearest BMW dealer. The version I drove MSRPed for $24K. I hear some dealers are marking them up, some aren't.

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: Rallispec

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: Rallispec
::::grumble:::::

i might have to cave in and take one of these for a test drive sometime.

until then i stand by my opinion of hating them still.

Why, b/c the Cooper S faster than the Spec-V? B/C it has a better interior? B/C it comes with more standard features and safety equipment? B/C it can outhandle the Spec-V? B/C it comes with run-flats? B/C it has a longer warranty? B/C it gets better gas mileage?

Why oh why do I see this hatred?

what are you smoking NSF4?!! how are you even comparing the cooperS to the spec V. Of course the cooper S is going to be a quick little car.. the little sh!t barely weighs a ton. Lets see you cram 5 adults into it though, With thier luggage! It can't be done. Quick little car, maybe. Practical. No. Ugly as sin. yes.

not to mention the starting price on the cooper S is what,... like $19,900 i believe? well for nearly 3 thousand more than the starting price of the spec v (17,200) it had damn well have some nicer interior. Speaking of that.. so how much does a loaded cooper S cost? Seeing as how i got my V, fully loaded for $2,000 less than the starting price of the cooper S, i dont see how you can compare the two.

I was just raggin' on you for hatin' on the Cooper S

THe Spec-V is a dandy little car, and looks are subjective.

 

[MrBond]

Most likely the '03 Viper SRT-10 and the '03 Accord

Motor Trend will give it to the Mini I'd be willing to bet. They'll almost certainly go with a retro reintroduction (the mini) over an upgraded previous model (viper/accord). The accord is getting a lot of praise though, so I imagine it'll run away with top honors from other publications.

I saw a dark silver/pewter and black Mini the other day, looks damn sharp. I expected it to look like a deathbox, being shorter then the miata, but it actually looked a littler longer as I was driving by. I'll have to test drive one when I get closer to buying a car, but I still think I'll be going with something that's got four doors. I'm afraid I'm tall enough that the mini would essentially be a 3 seater with my seat all the way back.

 

[NFS4]

Like I was saying about resale value on the Mini Cooper

Mini Cooper may hold residual value best, lease guide reports

 

[Rallispec]

Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
I test drove a MINI Cooper S at Hank Aaron BMW in Union City, GA. It was loaded will everything. Color was dark silver with black roof/mirror treatment, and it had some special foglights. It's a blast to drive and certainly worth the effort to drive to your nearest BMW dealer. The version I drove MSRPed for $24K. I hear some dealers are marking them up, some aren't.

24k!!!! jesus.. i thought this was supposed to be an affordable car.

okay, so that puts the cooper S in the same class as the WRX now. and NSF4--- dont even TRY to tell me this thing could take a wrx off the line.