Militia Madness Right In the US Army

[Perknose]

Long, but extremely interesting New Yorker article.

I don't really have any snap judgements here, except to say that, while I understand the need for more highly trained soldiers these day, I strongly regret the demise of the draft and of our previous citizen army, for a whole host of social and political reasons.

 

[Genx87]

You really regret the demise of our govt forcing people into the armed forces?

 

[Perknose]

You really regret the demise of our govt forcing people into the armed forces?

Giving back to the country that has given you everything with two years of service . . . which ensures a CITIZEN army and not an elite and segregated class of professional warriors? Yeah, on balance, that's ok with me.

What I would prefer is for every single citizen, male or female, flat feet or poor eyesight or not, give one or two years of national service to our country -- not just in the military.

 

[PokerGuy]

What I would prefer is for every single citizen, male or female, flat feet or poor eyesight or not, give one or two years of national service to our country -- not just in the military.

Yeah, screw that freedom of choice, force people to serve their country. After all, we are all but servants to our government and rulers, the sooner we learn that the better

 

[Genx87]

Giving back to the country that has given you everything with two years of service . . . which ensures a CITIZEN army and not an elite and segregated class of professional warriors? Yeah, on balance, that's ok with me.

What I would prefer is for every single citizen, male or female, flat feet or poor eyesight or not, give one or two years of national service to our country -- not just in the military.

Its not giving if it is forced. And what a wonderfully free country that it can take two years away from people to serve it.

I think you have a skewed view of the conscript army. The 60s were in part a revolt of that institution. The level of competency is also lower in a conscript army. That gets more people killed in our endless wars.

 

[rudder]

Forced labor... what you get is a real effective workforce when you have a bunch of people who would rather be home playing xbox versus having to work.

 

[Thebobo]

That would never fly these days, but a program where if you spent 2 years in service to your county something like the peace core in the US you could get something like grants or zero percent loans for school and maybe credits for your degree.

 

[OCGuy]

I'm sorry but it seems the premise of this is that militia = 100% bad. There are also some quotes in that article that paint "supporting 2A" as somehow negative as well.

Yawn

 

[MasterOfUsers]

Giving back to the country that has given you everything with two years of service . . . which ensures a CITIZEN army and not an elite and segregated class of professional warriors? Yeah, on balance, that's ok with me.

What I would prefer is for every single citizen, male or female, flat feet or poor eyesight or not, give one or two years of national service to our country -- not just in the military.

Armies like that are notoriously bad at their job, especially if you allow fragile women to serve in combat positions.

Just look at the IDF, it's complete shit.

Sarcasm aside, i agree with you. Serving makes you a citizen and helps build character among individuals that have seen themselves as not part of society but rather of their own group in the society.

 

[MasterOfUsers]

I'm sorry but it seems the premise of this is that militia = 100% bad. There are also some quotes in that article that paint "supporting 2A" as somehow negative as well.

Yawn

I'd say that militias are 100% a bad idea.

 

[OCGuy]

I'd say that militias are 100% a bad idea.

Are you not a member of the reserve militia? If you live in the US, my guess is you are according to the Dick Act.

Luckily the drafters of the US Constitution could foresee certain future attitudes, and protected against them.

 

[Sonikku]

The good thing about the draft is that wars when coupled with the draft did a good job of winding down the poor and impoverished population trash that could be a liability to the state while leaving the job creators to do what they do best (create jobs) without fear of being killed.

 

[MasterOfUsers]

Are you not a member of the reserve militia? If you live in the US, my guess is you are according to the Dick Act.

Luckily the drafters of the US Constitution could foresee certain future attitudes, and protected against them.

Do you think I was referring to private militias?

Of course you knew what i was referring to but playing unusually stupid gets to earn you a point in retard land so you do that.

The drafters of the constitution were referring to a well trained militia (such as the US army) to defend the nation, not some retarded imbeciles on ATV's carrying AK's and AR15's who store their piss in jars for the day the revolution comes.

 

[MasterOfUsers]

The good thing about the draft is that wars when coupled with the draft did a good job of winding down the poor and impoverished population trash that could be a liability to the state while leaving the job creators to do what they do best (create jobs) without fear of being killed.

If a true draft was instituted it would mean the politicians would have to send their own children to fight in wars (or even have to fight in them themselves).

We're not talking about service depending on who you are related to or how much money you have. EVERYONE has to serve their 2 years and if they happen to find themselves serving in war time they will have to do their tour just like everyone else.

If nothing else it would make politicians more weary of going to war.

 

[OCGuy]

Do you think I was referring to private militias?

Of course you knew what i was referring to but playing unusually stupid gets to earn you a point in retard land so you do that.

The drafters of the constitution were referring to a well trained militia (such as the US army) to defend the nation, not some retarded imbeciles on ATV's carrying AK's and AR15's who store their piss in jars for the day the revolution comes.

So the BoR was drafted to ensure the government had a strong military?

Holy shit there can't be people who actually think that...

 

[MasterOfUsers]

So the BoR was drafted to ensure the government had a strong military?

Holy shit there can't be people who actually think that...

You think the BoR only functions as a document to preserve the nations sovereignty? Because if you don't then your question makes no sense.

I disagree that that was why it was drafted, militias or national army aside.

I do believe that with the national army the removal of external threats is met and I do believe that domestic threats are being dealt with through law enforcement which pretty much removes the need for state militias.

If you believe that private militias were the idea then history disagrees with you, if you think private militias can become powerful enough to fight the US armed forces then you are per definition delusional. All it serves to do is so that fat fucks with AK's and ATV's can feel like they are true libertarians.

 

[OCGuy]

If you believe that private militias were the idea then history disagrees with you, if you think private militias can become powerful enough to fight the US armed forces then you are per definition delusional. All it serves to do is so that fat fucks with AK's and ATV's can feel like they are true libertarians.

I've never seen a "fat fuck" with firearms on ATVs. But I have seen "fat fuck" suburbanite armchair-warriors who are too scared to go outside, and couldn't defend themselves for the life of them.

Rag-tag militias did pretty well in the Revolutionary War, Vietnam, and Afghanistan

 

[MasterOfUsers]

I've never seen a "fat fuck" with firearms on ATVs. But I have seen "fat fuck" suburbanite armchair-warriors who are too scared to go outside, and couldn't defend themselves for the life of them.

Great, i don't care. I support the 2A for entirely different reasons than what was ever intended by the drafters and so do you and everyone else. It's pathetic that some people can't admit that but that is up to them.

Rag-tag militias did pretty well in the Revolutionary War, Vietnam, and Afghanistan

First of all, modern times only please so no Revolutionary War. In Vietnam every battle was won but the war was lost based on political decisions. Do you think that would be the case if the politicans arses were what was on the line?

I think that in real life a revolution by militias would depend on one thing alone, is the military on their side, if not they'll lose and if they are then the militias won't even be needed.

 

[MongGrel]

I still liked the ole Robert Heinlein thing, even before the horrible (IMHO) Starship Troopers movie was made.

Serve in the Government in a capacity, or you're not allowed to vote.

But that's pushing it, but his point was basically if you weren't willing to serve for the government for some period of time, shouldn't be allowed to dictate how it is run.

I've admittedly softened up on stances like that over time, that and the fact the military does not need a draft.

 

[OCGuy]

Great, i don't care. I support the 2A for entirely different reasons than what was ever intended by the drafters and so do you and everyone else. It's pathetic that some people can't admit that but that is up to them.

Man you just have everyone all figured out, don't you.

*bow*

 

[brandonb]

Giving back to the country that has given you everything with two years of service . . .

You mentioned it has given me everything so I challenge you to list 1 item.

 

[Perknose]

You mentioned it has given me everything so I challenge you to list 1 item.

One thing? You're posting on it.

 

[JEDIYoda]

What I would prefer is for every single citizen, male or female, flat feet or poor eyesight or not, give one or two years of national service to our country -- not just in the military.

I totally agree!!! Amen brother..I see that hand...Rise and be healed!!

 

[JEDIYoda]

You mentioned it has given me everything so I challenge you to list 1 item.

You really have to be dense to even ask that question.....
I challenge you to go to any other country and then come back here......you will know right away what Perknose is talking about!!

 

[brandonb]

One thing? You're posting on it.

They might have conjured up the concept, but they are not giving me the internet access to post on it. I pay for it. If I didn't pay for it, I wouldn't be on it, and the government has then effectively given me nothing.

Next.