Military vs. Education

[keystroker]

Ok I'm about to graduation high school in July. I used to get pretty good grades in early HS A's and B's. Now I get C's and D's mostly because I thought I wouldn't be able to afford my college education so I said F-it. Now when I graduate I'm either going to go to Junior College or some sort of military.

Pro's of JC
I can save up money
Get an education, I want to study computers

Cons of JC
I have to stay at home
I'll feel like i'm going no where in my life

Pros of military
Out of the house!
Making money
Trying new things getting out of L.A.
Disaplin

Cons of military
I don't think I'll move on in my career with computers
Don't think I'll be able to have the kind of job i want when i get out
I don't know exactly how the military works
How much money will I really be making? I want a vette and a nice house one day....

I really hate living with my parents and I know if I goto junior college I wouldn't like moving out and paying the bills to my own place so I would probally stay with my parents (which I can't stand it anymore). I don't know if the military will help me in my goal to be a computer network admin or something in computer science. WHAT TO DO? I think the military is what I want.

 

[b0mbrman]

<< I don't know exactly how the military works
How much money will I really be making? I want a vette and a nice house one day.... >>



Ask your questions. You'll get more than a few answers.

As for that first question, if you enlist, you won't be making very much (less than $1000 a month before taxes and not including the free food and lodging) but you *will* get a decent amount of college money/experience. Also, it's very fun...

You can choose your MOS upfront and enlist for as little as two years so much sure you keep up a *good* dialogue with your recruiter and people you know who've been in

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

<< Pros of military
Out of the house!
Making money
Trying new things getting out of L.A.
Disaplin

Cons of military
I don't think I'll move on in my career with computers
Don't think I'll be able to have the kind of job i want when i get out
I don't know exactly how the military works
How much money will I really be making? I want a vette and a nice house one day.... >>

They don't teach spelling and grammar, so you're off the hook on that one. Oh, and, people don't go into the military to make money -plain and simple. You get paid crap. Here's an example...

You go in to become some sort of avionics mechanic. You get paid $1,400/month (THAT'S GENEROUS) working on the military's crap. You get out and make three times that much in a job at a major city airport. You get paid crap for your skills. People go in to serve their country, not get money for college, dude.




<< but you *will* get a decent amount of college >>

Dude... the only money that you get extra other than what you make per month is your signing bonus. That crap about $50,000 for college is so full of loopholes and deception to get you in. That money comes out of your paycheck, alotted towards an education -as if you can't put that money into a savings account for later on your own. Now, don't get me wrong -I'm one of the biggest supporters of military that you'll ever meet. But their lying to people upon signing about things such as what job they'll get and college money is so *arg!*

Nik

 

[UltraQuiet]

Stroker- I am in the Navy(18 years) and have been a network administrator for the last 6 years. If you have any specific questions I will be happy to answer them. Here's a link to a pay chart. Military Pay

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

linkie no workie for meie

Nik

 

[b0mbrman]

<<

<< but you *will* get a decent amount of college >>

Dude... the only money that you get extra other than what you make per month is your signing bonus. That crap about $50,000 for college is so full of loopholes and deception to get you in. That money comes out of your paycheck, alotted towards an education -as if you can't put that money into a savings account for later on your own. Now, don't get me wrong -I'm one of the biggest supporters of military that you'll ever meet. But their lying to people upon signing about things such as what job they'll get and college money is so *arg!*
Nik >>



If you're from Oklahoma or Texas, enlisting gets you fully paid tuition...I'm out and I get MGIB here in California--$270 a month. Not enough to buy anything but a decent amount for being out.

The bonus you get comes in parts---after basic, after being in for a year, after being in for two years...I'm not exactxly sure how it works. Don't expect them to give you a handful of cash as soon as you sign up though.

Also, he's right...you're competing with a bunch of guys who almost wouldn't mind doing the job for free (people from Alabama and Florida who love the USA) so they don't pay you very much at all.

 

[KK]

I was in the AF for 3 1/2 years. The pay does stink but most of what you need is provided for you, therefore you don't know it stinks. GI Bill works like this, at least it did for me. You pay in $100 a month for the first year, after that you don't have to contribute any more. It is good I believe 10 years after you get out. Total amount I believe I can get is around 14,000. It may have gone up since 93. I have yet to have used mine. I got out early to take a decent paying job and haven't had time to start college. My plan when I entered was to go in, do my 4 years, get out and go to college. Well one thing lead to another, now I'm married with a child, so free time is precious. I think the military is a great place to start if you have no idea what you want to do with yourself. You get to travel, although some places do suck. Only go in if you can get a guarantee what your field will be, don't be a cook whatever you do. As far as picking a station, you'll be able to put down couple of places you want to go to. You will probably get one of them if you career field is at those locations.
Good luck in whatever you choose.

KK

 

[b0mbrman]

<< You get to travel, although some places do suck. Only go in if you can get a guarantee what your field will be, don't be a cook whatever you do. As far as picking a station, you'll be able to put down couple of places you want to go to. You will probably get one of them if you career field is at those locations. >>



If you go airborne, you're pretty much going to Fort Bragg (or Italy/Washington state)

 

[Grunt03]

keystroker

Let me get this straight;
1. You want to continue your education.
2. You want to study computers.
3. You do not want to live at home.
4. You want a Vett and a home.

This is simple..
1. If you stay at home the it looks like you will be working a part time job at least. While you are continueing your
education it will be sometime before you can buy that Vett and own your own house. At least four years then you
will have to land a great job in which you will start at the bottom.

2. Joining the military - You will sure enough be able to move out on your own. There are many thousands of different
jobs in the military not all of us are the "Knuckle dragging War Dogs". Each of the services have computer fields that you
could check out. The schooling is free then after that you will have what we call your MOS. There are many different ways
to continue your eductaion while in the military. Every base has an eductaion branch that will help you plan out when you
can attend classes, nighttime or weekends. Though I do not entirely agree with "FFMCobalt", he does have a point. Do not
come into the service to get rich.It would be sometime before you could afford that Vett and the house. I am in the United
States Marine Corps, and have been in for 17 years. My entire time in I have been Reconnaissance or infantry, I have
traveled around the world twice, I have served nine years over seas. Being in the infantry I have managed to continue
studying computers.

3. The choice is yours, and it should not be taken lightly. I would say join up for only four years, see some of the world,
save some money, get out and continue your eductaion.

 

[cthulhu]

Just remember this: once you sign up you a$$ is theirs to do as they see fit. What I mean is that if they need someone in a certain position (nevermind what you wanted to do) you will be assigned to that job.

If I had it to do all over again, I would join the military for probably 4 yrs right outta high school. I would have done this for the following reasons: some college money, travel, meeting new people, life expierence.

I had to work in college and that made things hard for me. I never got to "enjoy" college. If I wasn't in class, I was working.

 

[KK]

<< 5. A Purple Heart just proves that were you smart enough to think of a plan, stupid enough to try it, and lucky enough to survive. >>



I like that one.

KK

 

[Rent]

While my opinion will be null, I'll share my current situation with you.

I've been going to a community college for nearly 2 years now. I've barely done anything there partly because of myself, partly because of the college. I was working and going to school at the same time (and I had a nice internship working with system admins, MCSEs, and then all sorts of administrative people)

Well, I was laid off last month. Fvck corporate America :| now I'm left with a lot of hassles, then school. I've been mulling over the idea to enlist for sometime now.

The Service seems like a great place to start off in life. They kick the living sh!t out of you and prepare you for real life. If I had known what was going to become of me after high school, I might have enlisted sooner.

2 years after I've graduated from High school, I'm finding myself in your position too. Hopefully I'll find some resolution soon, but this type of decision is not to be taken lightly. You are their b!tch once you sign those papers, so don't expect a walk in the park while making money.

 

[KK]

<< You are their b!tch once you sign those papers, so don't expect a walk in the park while making money. >>



While that is probably true in some branches, for me, being in the Air Force as an electronic warfare specialist, I didn't see it being all that bad. Of course the AF is the most laxed branch. My typical day was a normal 8 hour shift, 5 days a week, rest of the day was my time. Of course once in a while you would have to play war, but that just meant 12 hour days instead of 8. As long as you didn't do anything stupid, you could coast through without problems.

KK

 

[bigshooter]

I was going to join the marines to get my act together. It was just going to be the reserves, but I wanted to do something different. I also looked into the army, and although it turned out I was medically disqualified (my back is really screwed up now, so I'm glad I wasn't in) I did a lot of research. If you want to go into some type of electronics field, join the navy or air force, although army and marines have them too. It's just navy and air force have an easier boot camp. Enlist for your 4 years if you want, you can get training and full benefits, and allegedly they'll let you switch to reserves after two years. if you don't know where you're going in life, like it sounds, you should do it. It may keep you from turning into a lazy bastard like me.

 

[AndrewR]

the only money that you get extra other than what you make per month is your signing bonus.

And signing bonuses can be as high as $50,000 if you happen to have certain language skills. You can also receive hefty enlistment bonuses for agreeing to go to language school and successfully completing the course -- where else can you get paid for learning Arabic?

Anyway, there are also many opportunities for earning additional pay -- sea pay for the Navy and Marines, flight pay for all services (more likely for the Air Force, especially as a linguist or an aircraft crew member like a loadmaster), hazardous duty pay, jump pay, tax free pay for combat zones, and the list goes on. Nevertheless, as has been mentioned, don't expect to become rich being enlisted in the military. Officers have nothing to complain about for pay, but the enlisted corps generally is underpaid.

Plus, once you are in the service, you can work toward your degree through programs like the Community College of the Air Force (CCAF). I suspect that the other services have their equivalents, but someone else will have to tell you about them. As I understand it, you can basically earn a degree for free. Also, in many cases, your training for your job (MOS for the Army, AFSC for the Air Force) counts as college credit, which puts you that much closer to a B.A./B.S.

If you do decide to see a recruiter, make sure you have all of his/her assurances and promises IN WRITING before accepting an enlistment. Don't expect that when he says, "Oh, you'll almost certainly have X job" that you'll actually receive that job especially now when deployments are heating up and critical shortages are all that more critical.

 

[tm37]

OK sone good info here for you-

1. Listen to cheif Solmer he knows what he is talking about, is smart and unbaised. If you do join you should be luck to work for someone like him.

2. Talk to the recruter, Yes they are going to tell you what you want to hear but if you ask questions they CAN'T Lie.
i.e. how the GI bill works

3. If you want to get into avianic the navy is the way to go. You will need to enlist for four years. Near most bases there is a school to get your A&p and FAA certs (you will need these to work on comercial airplanses) If you inlist and Start as soon as you get to the fleet, you should beable to get the hours required to be a Journeyman Electrian when you get out. Meaning MORE MONEY. (you may have to extend for a year or two no real big deal.

4. Have the recruiter give you the Rates that you qualify for after taking the ASAB, THen post here what these people do.

I was an intermedate level Aviation Electronics Mate so I fixed the peices to the airplane. The Orginaizational level people would determain what part was bad, and send it to me.

5. Getting your military education DOES NOT REPLACE COLLEGE! I learned this the hard way. WHile my six months of training is FAR SUPERIOR to the 2 year tech college for electronics technitions, I have found many HR directors see that six months and think it isn't as good.

6. IF you join learn all you can while in. The Navy offers MANY oppertunities for higher learning, take them.

7. decide what you want out of the military BEFORE YOU JOIN.

 

[burnedout]

<< but you *will* get a decent amount of college >>

Dude... the only money that you get extra other than what you make per month is your signing bonus. That crap about $50,000 for college is so full of loopholes and deception to get you in. That money comes out of your paycheck, alotted towards an education -as if you can't put that money into a savings account for later on your own. Now, don't get me wrong -I'm one of the biggest supporters of military that you'll ever meet. But their lying to people upon signing about things such as what job they'll get and college money is so *arg!*

The college money depends upon your perspective. To me, it was a moderate investment which later became an outstanding investment.

Background: Originally enlisted in 1980 after a lackluster freshman year. At the time, the VEAP program was the only educational incentive for enlistees. Veterans Educational Assistance Program was put in place between both GI Bills; the non-contributory GI Bill and the $100-per-month GI Bill. Under the old system, I contributed $50.00 per month for 54 months totalling $2,700. Because I had a 94 on the ASVAB, I received a $6,000 kicker to the original $8,100 base benefit for a total of $14,100.

So I decided WTF?!? After a number of years, I stuck it out with a goal of going for 20 years. Deutschland had awesome beer, babes and culture. I wasn't dead from liver disease, war, internal politics or partying yet. Why not stick it out? So I did. One day in 1997, a Master Sergeant was going around asking all of us old timers if we wanted to convert. Hell yes! I jumped on that the very next day. Received back $1,500 from my original contribution and was in the new GI Bill. The new GI Bill entitles every participant to $600 per month for 36 months. Of course I jumped on it. There was $7,000 extra above my original contract.

Here's the math on why the GI Bill is such an outstanding investment:

Contribute $100 per month for 12 months = $1,200. Total payout for the basic GI Bill is now $21,600 or $600 per month for 36 academic months, or 4 years of college with summers off.

1800% total return on the investment.

The return is greatest for those who stay in between 2-6 years and then take advantage of the GI Bill after they finish the service. For an average enlistment of four years, that equates to about 106% interest per year, compounded annually (2.06x^y4). There is no other investment, except for the front end of a Ponzi scheme, or having success in the stock market which can give those kinds of results in such a short time. Now if one stays in for 20 years, the annual percentage rate of return greatly decreases to about 15.5% compounded annually or 1.155x^y20. Still, for the career 20 year person, that's not a bad deal.

There are a few stipulations and drawbacks: For a young trooper, the $100 per month deduction can be a bit difficult during the first year of service. One has 10 years after they finish their respective term of service to use the benefit. Must be for a VA approved school. Nowadays, nearly every school, even correspondance courses, are VA approved. Even MCSE exams are VA approved. You must typically pay for tuition costs up front. The checks come directly to you, or direct deposit. However, if one only attends class half-time (6 semester hours) then the payout decreases to $300 per month. Also, VA only pays for a total of 48 months of education. VA will pay for summer classes. I'm fairly certain of the stipulations because 1.) We had a 4 hour exit briefing with the VA rep when I retired and, 2.) I contacted the VA educational rep for this region last year and we had about a one hour discussion. He looked up my "account" in the database and indicated the remaining amount and terms.

Haven't taken advantage of all of my benefit yet. Saving it for a Masters program.

 

[GigaCluster]

<< Disaplin >>


I think you should continue your education.

 

[AndrewR]

One thing I neglected to mention. If you are really interested in computers, then give the Air Force a good look. Currently, DoD has given USAF the lead in Information Operations, which covers the use of computers in offensive and defensive roles. While the Navy and the Army have a division each within their overall organizations charged with information warfare (NIWA and LIWA, respectively), I am not familiar with numerous units specializing in IO (correct me if I'm wrong on that, anyone). The Air Force, on the other hand, has numerous dedicated units for Information Operations -- a friend of mine is going to an IO Squadron here in Texas in April. Another friend is going to an IOS in Germany, and a third is going to an IOS in Japan. Yes, they do have "hacker units", but all that stuff is "black ops" -- higher classification than mine and definitely higher than unclassified.

It's an interesting field and one of the fastest growing areas in the Air Force right now. It's not my cup of tea, but you might want to inquire about the possiblities related to IO if computers are your intent.