Military Recruiters must await "Opt-In"

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: jackschmittusa
Deptacon

Are your oral communication skills as poor as your written ones? This is the result of a college education? You hope to hold a managerial position with such attenuated skills? You fly off the handle and resort to name calling when talking to those with differing opinions? Good luck in the real world.

i type fast, for that my words get twisted, yeah and some liberal opinions drive me through the roof, ...hehehe but not all of them...this is just a forum, not a freakin presidential address....whats the prob? you the oratory moderator or something?

you want me to submit a draft of all my post to you for proof reading first....?

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: piasabird
I dont think students should be forced to go and listen to some recruiter. I imagine the military recruiter shows up at a scheduled assembly and then the students are forced to listen to the recruiter, without no one else giving an opposing view point. I think this is totally wrong.

However, I think if the recruiter wanted to put up a poster or show up on career day or something like that, then that would be all right. I dont even see anything wrong if the recruiter wants to show up one day during the week and announce he is there to talk to anyone who is considering the armed forces. Just do not force students to watch or listen to them if they dont want to.

One thing I dont agree with is giving a list of all the students or their phone numbers. I know this is going on in some instances.

i agree, this is prolly the best, and most common way its done....like I said, most recruiters i have dealt with just deal with walkin's at the station...no calling around, bugging everyone

 

[kage69]

type fasdt, for that my words get twisted, yeah and some liberal opinions drive me through the roof, ...hehehe but not al lof them...this is just a forum, not a freakin presidential address....whats the prob? you the oratory moderator or something?

This is a forum, one frequented by adults debating adult topics. Chiming in like a 3rd grader isn't going to get you extra points. You should proof-read before posting, and there is always the Edit ability of this forum. Is this really such an unreasonable expectation? I know it's a big scary world here in the intarweb, but we're all pullin for ya!

Also, might want to lay off the allusions to the presidency and examples of err, oratorical eloquence. Not sure if you've noticed, but let's just say our current pres has a bit of a problem articulating himself...

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: kage69

type fasdt, for that my words get twisted, yeah and some liberal opinions drive me through the roof, ...hehehe but not al lof them...this is just a forum, not a freakin presidential address....whats the prob? you the oratory moderator or something?

This is a forum, one frequented by adults debating adult topics. Chiming in like a 3rd grader isn't going to get you extra points. You should proof-read before posting, and there is always the Edit ability of this forum. Is this really such an unreasonable expectation? I know it's a big scary world here in the intarweb, but we're all pullin for ya!

Also, might want to lay off the allusions to the presidency and examples of err, oratorical eloquence. Not sure if you've noticed, but let's just say our current pres has a bit of a problem articulating himself...

1 st point, i just used edit and fixed before you posted...

2nd point, bush couldnt give a speech without saying uhhh and tripping over his words if his life depended on it....its just not gonna happen..... i remember how it bad it was though when he first got elected......ohhh good that was horrible, thank god its not that bad anymor


Also, ill make it a point to proof read here...so

A. the liberal grammer nazi's dont get me
B. i dont like like a dumbass...

LOL

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Liberals support 13 year olds having abortions without parental notification, yet they want to pass legislation that would prevent military recruiters from contacting students unless their parents "opt-in".

Typical nonsense and hypocrisy from the left.

Link

The USA is one of the few first world countries that actively solicits children for military service. Making children (people under the age of 18, or possibly 21) into soldiers ("child soldiers") is actually a violation of international law.

no its not, its completly voulntary,

It is almost universally recognized that children under the age of 18 are not fully capable of giving informed consent due to their immaturity in decision making. Governments actively recruiting children into the military is a moral outrage.

what did I JUST SAY, they need parnetal CONSENT under 18 to sign up....

Is a legal minor allowed to have sex -- with parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to vote -- without parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to drink alcohol -- with parental consent?

Whether or not the parent gives consent is beside the point. What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: BBond

There you go again, playing the liberal card to divide us, as though we're all either totally conservative or totally liberal.

Ever heard of the military industrial complex? Ever heard of corporate welfare? Pepsi and several other major soft drink and snack companies have already infiltrated America's schools. I read stories of shcools, strapped for cash in today's Bush led starve the beast (except for certain connected special interests) mentality have signed contracts with those companies for exclusive rights to sell their products in vending machines in public schools. Perhaps you remember the outcry when students in public schools were being forced to watch commercials -- talk about a captive audience.

And to compare Army recruiters with politicians pitching their views is absurd. Learning about how a bill becomes law or ideas on voting is entirely removed from having a highly trained high pressure military salesman pitching a commitment to kids who can barely understand the scope of what they are being sold.

LOL - There I go again? Do you have some knowledge of my posting history, or are you lumping me into the 'conservative' camp with that pejorative 'you?' I've made it known on many occasions what my political leanings are.

What are you talking about? I've already said that private corporations interferring with public schools in any way, including advertising, is wrong and should not be tolerated. It was a previous poster than likened the rights of these private institutions to the those of the US military.

I love the "OMG! Think of the children!" mentality you seem to want to grandstand. I think it has been pointed out several times that a minor needs parental permission in order to sign up for the military. Otherwise, most HS graduates are already 18 or almost there - we're not talking about snot-nosed grade schoolers here. Somehow, these "kids" can be expected to graduate school in a few months, leave home, get a job, understand personal finances, marital relations, have children of their own, etc - basically become full-fledged adult members of society - but they are somehow too fragile to understand what enlisting would mean for them? Give me a break. Sounds like someone is playing the 'poor victim' card again.

 

[Deptacon]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Liberals support 13 year olds having abortions without parental notification, yet they want to pass legislation that would prevent military recruiters from contacting students unless their parents "opt-in".

Typical nonsense and hypocrisy from the left.

Link

The USA is one of the few first world countries that actively solicits children for military service. Making children (people under the age of 18, or possibly 21) into soldiers ("child soldiers") is actually a violation of international law.

no its not, its completly voulntary,

It is almost universally recognized that children under the age of 18 are not fully capable of giving informed consent due to their immaturity in decision making. Governments actively recruiting children into the military is a moral outrage.

what did I JUST SAY, they need parnetal CONSENT under 18 to sign up....

Is a legal minor allowed to have sex -- with parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to vote -- without parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to drink alcohol -- with parental consent?

Whether or not the parent gives consent is beside the point. What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

oh please...go hug a tree....

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Is a legal minor allowed to have sex -- with parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to vote -- without parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to drink alcohol -- with parental consent?

Whether or not the parent gives consent is beside the point. What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

1) yes
2) no
3) yes

(Good) parents know their children better than you or I or the government knows them. Not all 'children' mature at the same rate - and some, never at all. Please remember, we are talking about 16-17+ year olds, not toddlers and babies. I'd wager than some of these 'kids' are 10x more mature than a good portion of the know-it-all posters in here. If they and their parents have decided and agreed that a military career is best for them, or for their country, then good for them! If they decide that enlistment isn't for them, then good for them as well!

Just because you have reservations about it, doesn't mean it's not a good idea. You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay? No one is shipping 14-year-olds off to Iraq. Why not stow the outrage for something a bit more appropriate?

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
It was a previous poster than likened the rights of these private institutions to the those of the US military.

I likened the agenda of corporations with the agenda of the US military. In both cases, you have an organisation pushing something that in all likelihood is not in the best interests of the child. In both situations, you have the children as a captive audience -- unable to simply walk away, because they are required by law to remain in the school environment. The comparison is reasonable.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Is a legal minor allowed to have sex -- with parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to vote -- without parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to drink alcohol -- with parental consent?

Whether or not the parent gives consent is beside the point. What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

1) yes
2) no
3) yes

(Good) parents know their children better than you or I or the government knows them. Not all 'children' mature at the same rate - and some, never at all. Please remember, we are talking about 16-17+ year olds, not toddlers and babies. I'd wager than some of these 'kids' are 10x more mature than a good portion of the know-it-all posters in here. If they and their parents have decided and agreed that a military career is best for them, or for their country, then good for them! If they decide that enlistment isn't for them, then good for them as well!

Just because you have reservations about it, doesn't mean it's not a good idea. You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay? No one is shipping 14-year-olds off to Iraq. Why not stow the outrage for something a bit more appropriate?

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous. They're full of hormones and pumped up on military inspired video games. They think they're invincible. Only, as many families know all too well due to Bush's unnecessary invasion, they aren't.

If the military wants to recruit these kids the kids should be aware of what they're in for. Not some fantasy described by a recruiter. And definitely not in public schools. If an 18 year old is interested in joining the military and as you believe they are mature then they are quite capable of driving themselves down to the recruiting office if they so choose. To have trained high pressure military recruiters hound kids day after day isn't fair or right.

 

[Beowulf]

I have to seriously wonder though if the US is having a hard time recruiting my brother just got to SOI(School of Infantry) and now has to wait 5 weeks in forming.Basically forming is just waiting till some company has space to take a recruit in and start their training at SOI and supposedly there is a backlog of 500+ Marines.

Now the Army maybe different but as I told my brother be the best you can be and thats the Marines.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Beowulf
I have to seriously wonder though if the US is having a hard time recruiting my brother just got to SOI(School of Infantry) and now has to wait 5 weeks in forming.Basically forming is just waiting till some company has space to take a recruit in and start their training at SOI and supposedly there a backlog of 500+ Marines.

Marines are below their recruitment goal for the first time in many years but they're still expected to make the yearly goal.

Ditto the Army.

Air Force and Navy are hitting their recruitment numbers.

Reserves and Guard are still in a world of trouble.

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay?

Yes, and the first step in doing that would be to limit military recruiters' access to children (without them first seeking parental consent to contact those children) - which is what this thread is about.

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Is a legal minor allowed to have sex -- with parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to vote -- without parental consent?
Is a legal minor allowed to drink alcohol -- with parental consent?

Whether or not the parent gives consent is beside the point. What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

1) yes
2) no
3) yes

(Good) parents know their children better than you or I or the government knows them. Not all 'children' mature at the same rate - and some, never at all. Please remember, we are talking about 16-17+ year olds, not toddlers and babies. I'd wager than some of these 'kids' are 10x more mature than a good portion of the know-it-all posters in here. If they and their parents have decided and agreed that a military career is best for them, or for their country, then good for them! If they decide that enlistment isn't for them, then good for them as well!

Just because you have reservations about it, doesn't mean it's not a good idea. You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay? No one is shipping 14-year-olds off to Iraq. Why not stow the outrage for something a bit more appropriate?

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous. They're full of hormones and pumped up on military inspired video games. They think they're invincible. Only, as many families know all too well due to Bush's unnecessary invasion, they aren't.

If the military wants to recruit these kids the kids should be aware of what they're in for. Not some fantasy described by a recruiter. And definitely not in public schools. If an 18 year old is interested in joining the military and as you believe they are mature then they are quite capable of driving themselves down to the recruiting office if they so choose. To have trained high pressure military recruiters hound kids day after day isn't fair or right.

I've also read that recruiters are now offering large "bonuses" (worth tens of thousands of dollars) as a way of recruiting more cannon fodder for Iraq.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: BBond

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous.

The laws and courts say they are mature enough. The military says they are mature enough. The individuals say they are mature enough. The parents say they are mature enough. History has shown that they are mature enough. But you don't care - you don't think they are mature enough! :roll:

Got ego?

 

[JoLLyRoGer]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: tss4

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: Riprorin
Liberals support 13 year olds having abortions without parental notification, yet they want to pass legislation that would prevent military recruiters from contacting students unless their parents "opt-in".

Typical nonsense and hypocrisy from the left.

Link

The USA is one of the few first world countries that actively solicits children for military service. Making children (people under the age of 18, or possibly 21) into soldiers ("child soldiers") is actually a violation of international law.

no its not, its completly voulntary, and you can only join under 18 if you will be 18 when your intal entry training is over...i wished i joined so youg, i would be pulling retirement at age 38, and still be working in the civilian world....double paychecks....

really?? this is off topic, but that's insanely young to get retirement. What % of your pay do you get at the age for retirement?

75% for the REST OF YOUR LIFE

20 years of active duty service.... age old us military tradition....

Ummmm... NO, try 50% for 20 years service and an extra 2.5% for every year served above 20 (assuming you don't hit high year tenure before then) you need 30 years to garner a 75% retirement.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay?

Yes, and the first step in doing that would be to limit military recruiters' access to children (without them first seeking parental consent to contact those children) - which is what this thread is about.

If that's what this thread is about, then we've gotten off topic, as I was responding to this:

Originally posted by: aidanjm
What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

Threads and discussions are dynamic, you see. A topic is posted and the discussion begins there, branching off to related topics as necessary. I know a favorite tactic of some is to throw something inflamatory out there, then berate others for being "off topic" when they call you on it. But thankfully, you don't get to dictate policy here.

 

[ahurtt]

Originally posted by: Deptacon

Originally posted by: BBond

Originally posted by: Deptacon


well, im getting paid "really, really, good money" to go over there, and i can underatnd why they pay so much becuase of the condtion over there, but i understand fully what to company is doing over there from my interviews and talking with comany officals, pretty much supply logistal and security jobs for the military so they dont have to use personael of thier won to do those jobs.....

of course they are profiting, since when does a compnay exist not to make a profit....unless its in a communist country, but thats what you reallt want right?

BS

"If you think this war will bring any financial(oil) gain to the USA, you have a few screws loose."

Is there financial gain in Iraq?

Yep.

I hope you actually have to do the work Halliburton bills us for.

im gonna.... 14-16 hrs a day, 7 days a week, for 1 yr.... Logistical Section Manager 175,000 bucks for one yr.... not taxed

Well, good luck buddy. Hope you're around to collect it. Wether you realize it or not, people who are against the war are not necessarily against YOU or YOUR ARMY. Quite contrary, they care a lot about you and don't want you to throw away your life for a "war" they see as purely capitalistic / imperialist / [insert gripe here]. You shouldn't act like such a dick to people who are so concerned for your personal safety. If there were somebody I really hated and wanted dead, I'd send them to Iraq. People attack what's going on over there not because of anything against the troops. It's precisely the opposite. People want their husbands, wives, sons, and daughters safe at home with them. Not over there risking throwing everything away for what? That retirement pay at age 38 sounds really sweet, yes. Just remember you gotta be around to collect it. I feel you'd be much more useful here at home helping root out the terrorists we know are already inside our borders. And believe it or not, we want you around.

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay?

Yes, and the first step in doing that would be to limit military recruiters' access to children (without them first seeking parental consent to contact those children) - which is what this thread is about.

If that's what this thread is about, then we've gotten off topic, as I was responding to this:

It would be nice if you actually responded to my point, which is that my right to raise my childen** the way I see fit is not being respected by these over eager military recruiters.

I do not want my children exposed to military recruiters, when they are at school, without my knowledge or permission.

That is consistent with your suggestion (quoted, above) that I raise my kids the way I see fit, and let others do the same.

I am glad you agree with me that it is utterly inappropriate for these military recruiters to be contacting children without first seeking the parents' permission. Similarly I will refrain from contacting your children, and trying to recruit them into the "homosexual lifestyle".

(**I am speaking hypothetically, I don't have children.)

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: aidanjm
What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

Threads and discussions are dynamic, you see. A topic is posted and the discussion begins there, branching off to related topics as necessary. I know a favorite tactic of some is to throw something inflamatory out there, then berate others for being "off topic" when they call you on it. But thankfully, you don't get to dictate policy here.

I do not see how you can (reasonably) construe my comment as criticizing you for being off-topic. FWIW, you strike me as exceedingly emotionally hypersensitive - seeing insults where there are none.

 

[aidanjm]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: BBond

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous.

The laws and courts say they are mature enough. The military says they are mature enough. The individuals say they are mature enough. The parents say they are mature enough. History has shown that they are mature enough. But you don't care - you don't think they are mature enough! :roll:

Got ego?

The morality of a position cannot be determined or assessed simply by it's popularity. :roll:

Got simplistic moral reasoning?

 

[slurmsmackenzie]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger
You raise your kids how you see fit and let others raise theirs, mmkay?

Yes, and the first step in doing that would be to limit military recruiters' access to children (without them first seeking parental consent to contact those children) - which is what this thread is about.

If that's what this thread is about, then we've gotten off topic, as I was responding to this:

It would be nice if you actually responded to my point, which is that my right to raise my childen the way I see fit is not being respected by these over eager military recruiters.

I do not want my children exposed to military recruiters, when they are at school, without my knowledge or permission.

That is consistent with your suggestion (quoted, above) that I raise my kids the way I see fit, and let others do the same.

I am glad you agree with me that it is utterly inappropriate for these military recruiters to be contacting children without first seeking the parents' permission. Similarly I will refrain from contacting your children, and trying to recruit them into the "homosexual lifestyle". :roll:

Originally posted by: aidanjm
What is at stake is whether a CHILD -- someone under the age of 18 -- is able to make an informed, voluntary decision to join and commit themselves to the military. I don't believe that is the case. I don't accept that a legal minor can give an informed consent to join the military. I'd say a parent who gives consent for their child to join the military is engaging in a despicable form of child abuse.

i think it's rediculous to assume a rationality to an 18 that would otherwise be lacking in someone 6mos - 1yr younger. military is a career option. so just as college recruits have the right to address school children on GOV'T property, then of course the military has that same option.

to lose your child to it's onslaught would be a loss anyways. if you instill "values" (whichever you see fit, for values is a general term), then you needn't worry about military personnell and homosexuals trying to recruit your children. to the contrary, if you feel your child weak to the threat of persuasion without supervision then it's really a question of when rather than who.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

It would be nice if you actually responded to my point, which is that my right to raise my childen (speaking hypothetically, I don't have children) the way I see fit is not being respected by these over eager military recruiters.

I do not want my children exposed to military recruiters, when they are at school, without my knowledge or permission.

May I ask this. Would you be as vehemently opposed to say, a NASA representative coming to talk to the schools, telling the students about all the wonderful, exciting opportunites of working for them?

Now, I would support a measure that allowed students to opt out of attending the recruiter's presentation, to be replaced with study hall or something. But as a federally-funded entity, I see no problem with the promotion of another federal entity in that forum. We pay taxes to our goverment for many reasons. One of them is for nationalized education. Another is for space research. Another still, is for an all-volunteer army to protect our nation and fight for our best interests. Personally, I don't see the outrage over bleed-through for these programs.

That is consistent with your suggestion (quoted, above) that I raise my kids the way I see fit, and let others do the same.

Ok, but what if I, as a parent, decide that I didn't want my child to be taught trigonometry? Should I demand that it not be offered to any student there, as my child is too immature and may be seduced by the wiles of advanced mathematics? At what point do you draw the line?

I am glad you agree with me that it is utterly inappropriate for these military recruiters to be contacting children without first seeking the parents' permission. Similarly I will refrain from contacting your children, and trying to recruit them into the "homosexual lifestyle". :roll:

Wait, in the same post as you accuse me of seeing insults where they aren't there and of being 'hypersensitive," you say this? How the hell did homosexuality get involved in this discussion?

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: aidanjm

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: BBond

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous.

The laws and courts say they are mature enough. The military says they are mature enough. The individuals say they are mature enough. The parents say they are mature enough. History has shown that they are mature enough. But you don't care - you don't think they are mature enough! :roll:

Got ego?

The morality of a position cannot be determined or assessed simply by it's popularity. :roll:

Got simplistic moral reasoning?

Then please tell me who does get to 'assess the morality' of a position? Seriously.

Apparently, the government, laws, military, individuals involved, parents of individual involved, historical norms, and popular opinion are not enough.

So who gets the final say?

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: cKGunslinger

Originally posted by: BBond

They are shipping 17 and 18 year olds off to Iraq though. And I don't care what you say. Kids that age aren't mature. That's just ridiculous.

The laws and courts say they are mature enough. The military says they are mature enough. The individuals say they are mature enough. The parents say they are mature enough. History has shown that they are mature enough. But you don't care - you don't think they are mature enough! :roll:

Got ego?

You have kids, cK? After you raise them for seventeen or eighteen years, right after they make it all the way through HIGH SCHOOL are you going to drive them down to the recruiter and sign them up to go fight in some lie induced nightmare of a war started by a draft dodger whose own kids will NEVER serve?

Let me know how that goes. If it goes. Somehow I think it won't happen but you seem to be all about allowing professional military recruiters access to KIDS who don't know their a$$ from their elbow and by the time they find out they'll likely have one or the other -- or both -- blown off. Thanks to some recruiter who tells them they can be an Army of one and have access to some really awesome equipment that'll make all their video games pale in comparison.

 

[cKGunslinger]

Originally posted by: BBond

You have kids, cK? After you raise them for seventeen or eighteen years, right after they make it all the way through HIGH SCHOOL are you going to drive them down to the recruiter and sign them up to go fight in some lie induced nightmare of a war started by a draft dodger whose own kids will NEVER serve?

Let me know how that goes. If it goes. Somehow I think it won't happen but you seem to be all about allowing professional military recruiters access to KIDS who don't know their a$$ from their elbow and by the time they find out they'll likely have one or the other -- or both -- blown off. Thanks to some recruiter who tells them they can be an Army of one and have access to some really awesome equipment that'll make all their video games pale in comparison.

I do have kids, thank you. And if they want to join the military and they are 18+ or I my wife and I deem that they are mature enough at 17 or whatever to make that decision, then that's their choice. I'm certainly not going to force them to do so and have never indicated that I would, so I'm not sure what you are arguing about.

But if they, at 17-18 years old, want to sign up because they honestly think it's like one big video game and there is little to no risk, then I will have failed as a parent.

My kids aren't being raised to be unthinking morons. I'm sorry you have such low expectations of everyone else's children.