Microsoft Warns Windows 7 Has A Serious Problem

bigi

Platinum Member
Aug 8, 2001
2,484
153
106
I did disable Win7 updates months ago after seeing how forcefully they push Win10.
 

Beer4Me

Senior member
Mar 16, 2011
564
20
76
Part of me wants to believe that MS is saying/doing this purposely to help drive Windows 10 adoption.
 

Jeff7

Lifer
Jan 4, 2001
41,599
19
81
Part of me wants to believe that MS is saying/doing this purposely to help drive Windows 10 adoption.
Code:
Text string "Windows 10" detected.
Automatically beginning installation of Windows 10.
Despite acknowledging the problems, Microsoft knew they would occur in advance and it has no plans to do anything about it.
o_O


On the plus side, Microsoft did update the support document for KB3133977 with a warning which states: “After you install update 3133977 on a Windows 7 x64-based system that includes an Asus-based main board, the system does not start”.

But Microsoft also uses the document an opportunity to promote upgrades to Windows 10:
'Note: The Secure Boot feature is supported in Windows 10. To learn more about the security advantages of this feature and about the upgrade path from Windows 7 to Windows 10, go to www.microsoft.com/windows'
Microsoft's KB3133977 support page now advises users to install Windows 10 to fix their problems.
Oh, well, they slapped a warning label on it. Very nice.

"Gee, what a shame. Why haven't you installed Windows 10 yet? Do it soon. EEPROM can be erased, you know. Install Windows 10."
 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,339
10,044
126
Can we get a better, less alarmist title? Like "recent Win7 update causes Asus mobos not to boot OS?

The problem appears to be Asus, not Win7.

Edit: I'm not really sure who's to blame, here.
 
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taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
Can we get a better, less alarmist title? Like "recent Win7 update causes Asus mobos not to boot OS?

The problem appears to be Asus, not Win7.

Edit: I'm not really sure who's to blame, here.

blame microsoft, they are the ones refusing to fix this in order to drive win 10 sales
 

nerp

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 2005
9,866
105
106
ASUS Secure boot implementation in BIOS is not entirely Microsoft's fault.
 

tortillasoup

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2011
1,977
3
81
OP, please quote the article, as Forbes bites since they block adblockers.

Actually what I do when I go to forbes sites, I disable ad block then as the page is loading, re-enable it. I also sometimes stop the page from fully loading because they sometimes have scripts that load that do funky things.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
17,705
9,566
136
OP, please quote the article, as Forbes bites since they block adblockers.

article said:
Microsoft Warns Windows 7 Has A Serious Problem

Earlier this year Microsoft warned users that Windows 7 has serious problems. I dismissed its claims as a desperate attempt to shift copies of Windows 10 (and I still do), but now Microsoft has warned of a new serious Windows 7 problem that is very real – even though it makes no sense whatsoever…

In short: Microsoft has made a seemingly small yet completely bizarre tweak to Windows Update on Windows 7 and confirmed it is crippling many users’ PCs.

The tweak? It switched the status of Windows 7 update KB3133977 from ‘Optional’ to ‘Recommended’. The bizarre part? Despite acknowledging the problems, Microsoft knew they would occur in advance and it has no plans to do anything about it.

Ok, let’s put some meat on these bones.

PCs That Suddenly Won’t Start

It all centres around Asus motherboards.

Now 27 years old, Asus is one of the largest PC component makers and supplies motherboards to many of the world’s biggest PC makers. Recently it enabled Secure Boot in UEFI on all its motherboards. This wasn’t a problem for older PCs because Windows 7 didn’t support Secure Boot, that is until KB3133977 came along in March and enabled it.

Initially the fallout was small. Asus confirmed the problem, Microsoft confirmed the problem. But the best news was KB3133977 was an optional Windows 7 update so it had to be manually installed to take effect. The solution was simple: just steer clear of KB3133977 (aka do nothing) and you’d be fine.

Then last month – for some bizarre reason – Microsoft made KB3133977 a ‘Recommended’ update. The result was every user running Windows 7 and default Windows Update settings (the vast majority) would find the update now installed automatically.

And then everyone with an Asus motherboard was hit.

Read more – Windows 10 ‘Anniversary Update’ Has Great Secret Features

A Global Problem

As InfoWorld’s Windows expert Woody Leonhard notes “I’m now seeing problems reported from all over the globe about Windows 7 machines that suddenly won’t boot”. Affected machines simply show a red box which says:

Screenshot-2016-05-05-at-01.59.41.png


All of which does nothing to pinpoint the problem or solve it for those without a second secured boot device. In short: you’d be screwed.

The Good News And Staying Safe

The good news is Asus has now issued a workaround to get PCs booting up again. Furthermore Asus must take some of the blame for not reacting faster when KB3133977 presented a potential landmine and issuing new updates to its motherboards.

How do you know if you have an Asus motherboard in your Windows 7 PC? Go to: All Programs > Accessories > System Tools and select System Information. This will list your PC’s components, including the motherboard.

One downside: some major PC makers like Dell and HP rebrand the motherboard as the computer’s model number. In which case you should do a web search on your model or call the manufacturer directly.

The Bad News And What Comes Next

As for the bad news? It’s Microsoft’s reaction.

On the plus side, Microsoft did update the support document for KB3133977 with a warning which states: “After you install update 3133977 on a Windows 7 x64-based system that includes an Asus-based main board, the system does not start”.

But Microsoft also uses the document an opportunity to promote upgrades to Windows 10:

Screenshot-2016-05-05-at-02.40.20-1200x204.png


Microsoft has also done nothing to modify KB3133977 or release a new patch so users with Asus motherboards don’t run into this problem in the first place. Furthermore, at the time of publishing, KB3133977 remains a ‘Recommended’ in Windows Update for Windows 7.

Needless to say, conspiracy theorists will have a ball seeing it as yet another new way Microsoft can push users to Windows 10. Especially with upgrade rates slowing in April. This in itself is remarkable given the increasing number of heavy handed and devious ways Microsoft has been pushing Windows 10 onto Windows 7 and Windows 8 users.

Regardless, the message is clear: life is going to become increasingly uncomfortable for Windows 7 users from now on. Whether they like it or not…

The headline is inaccurate IMO: MS admitted nothing.

This is also a dupe thread:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2472300&highlight=
 

zentan

Member
Jan 23, 2015
177
5
36
Yeah,it's a misleading title. The only OEM affected is Asus because they tried to tweak around and include something that wasn't supported. Don't see how all the blame is on MS here.
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
17,705
9,566
136
Yeah,it's a misleading title. The only OEM affected is Asus because they tried to tweak around and include something that wasn't supported. Don't see how all the blame is on MS here.

+1

It's pretty obvious that MS messed with the boot loader in order to cause a problem like this, and doing that without an extremely good reason (which doesn't apply to the vast majority of PCs out there) is foolhardy*. Yet on the other hand, Asus were seemingly trying to force a square block through a round hole (trying to implement some kind of secure-boot feature with an OS that doesn't support it), and just because it worked when they tested it doesn't necessarily mean that it will always work; it's not inconceivable that an actually important security update might have to alter the initial boot stages of the OS.

* - another example was a while back when MS threw in an "important" update for Win7 that was to help facilitate the upgrade to 10. It messed with the bootloader, and Norton detected something messing with the bootloader, so it reacted to it.
 

nerp

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 2005
9,866
105
106
Yeah,it's a misleading title. The only OEM affected is Asus because they tried to tweak around and include something that wasn't supported. Don't see how all the blame is on MS here.

MS has been blamed for everything, including by users who inject their computers with viruses and malware while searching for porn. Can't stop downloading porn and warez, but let's blame MS.

Duh.
 

Nashemon

Senior member
Jun 14, 2012
889
86
91
Yeah,it's a misleading title. The only OEM affected is Asus because they tried to tweak around and include something that wasn't supported. Don't see how all the blame is on MS here.
He posted it in the Motherboard board, so TC is aware that the issue isn't Microsoft's. Just another click-bait title that helps no one.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
MS has been blamed for everything, including by users who inject their computers with viruses and malware while searching for porn. Can't stop downloading porn and warez, but let's blame MS.

Duh.

Both companies were well aware of the issue and then MS decided it would be a good idea to make this optional update auto install and break systems.
Why would they make this change? Sure asus is fail, but MS saw an opportunity to promote windows 10 and they took it.
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,339
10,044
126
Is there a mitigation for this issue, should you get the update installed, in Win7 64-bit, and you have an Asus motherboard? Because I just realized, this ITX rig I'm on right now has an Asus ITX board in it. So I guess I can't update Windows 7 any more?
 
Aug 11, 2008
10,451
642
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Seems to me there is plenty of blame for both MS and Asus.

What can be done if this happens? Is the computer toast, or can it be recovered? My grandson has an Asus gaming laptop I bought for him for graduation a year ago that came with Win 7. I think he updated to Win 10 though.

Actually, MS just took over his computer one day and started the update. I hope he let it finish.
 

WilliamM2

Platinum Member
Jun 14, 2012
2,371
479
136
Is there a mitigation for this issue, should you get the update installed, in Win7 64-bit, and you have an Asus motherboard? Because I just realized, this ITX rig I'm on right now has an Asus ITX board in it. So I guess I can't update Windows 7 any more?

Seems to me there is plenty of blame for both MS and Asus.

What can be done if this happens? Is the computer toast, or can it be recovered? My grandson has an Asus gaming laptop I bought for him for graduation a year ago that came with Win 7. I think he updated to Win 10 though.

Actually, MS just took over his computer one day and started the update. I hope he let it finish.

The solution is simple, and there is a link to it in the OP.

https://www.asus.com/support/faq/1016356/

My Asus motherboard manual actually says to change this bios option in the instructions for installing Windows 7. And they were written before this "bug" was discovered. Z170 Pro Gaming.
 

Mushkins

Golden Member
Feb 11, 2013
1,631
0
0
blame microsoft, they are the ones refusing to fix this in order to drive win 10 sales

And what, exactly, do you propose Microsoft does to fix a problem with ASUS motherboards that they did not design, they do not support, and they do not sell?

It's up to ASUS to release a BIOS update or software patch to reconcile this, Microsoft is not responsible for maintaining third party hardware compatibility.
 

philipma1957

Golden Member
Jan 8, 2012
1,714
0
76
And what, exactly, do you propose Microsoft does to fix a problem with ASUS motherboards that they did not design, they do not support, and they do not sell?

It's up to ASUS to release a BIOS update or software patch to reconcile this, Microsoft is not responsible for maintaining third party hardware compatibility.



by your logic in that sentence( I bolded it) Microsoft is entitled to disable every motherboard from every company with a patch from any and all of their os.

My guess is they would see endless class action lawsuits if they did this.

As it is they would see many lawsuits for this, but Asus bailed them out with a work around. While you may disagree with me I don't think windows 7 or 8 or 10 is entitled to deliberately crash mobos with patches.

The key is to prove this is a deliberate attempt to kill your mobo after the fact, since there is a work around MS will get off the hook.

To OP thanks for this as I was about to send an Asus mobo to a client without the fix in the first post. I will do the fix.