Micro stutter?

[Jules]

Hey guys, Im having a issue with my computer. Any game i play seems to have micro stutter even though its above 40fps. Its like when i turn around in a FPS it seems like theres a very little stutter but its pissing me off already. This is on a 4850. Anyone have this issue? Maybe its the lack of power? Specs in sig.

 

[chizow]

If its a single-GPU configuration its probably just traditional stuttering due to texture thrashing as a result of lack of VRAM. Your vid card doesn't have enough onboard memory to store all the textures and buffer data locally which forces swapping from system RAM. Problem will be worst at higher resolutions, with AA enabled and with Triple Buffering, as they all increase VRAM requirements.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: chizow
If its a single-GPU configuration its probably just traditional stuttering due to texture thrashing as a result of lack of VRAM. Your vid card doesn't have enough onboard memory to store all the textures and buffer data locally which forces swapping from system RAM. Problem will be worst at higher resolutions, with AA enabled and with Triple Buffering, as they all increase VRAM requirements.

Even when my FPS never goes below 40? I also used a 8800GT in the past with the same settings for TF2 and i never had that issue.

 

[MTDEW]

Although it may not be whats wrong in your particular case, chizow is correct, which is why i always suggest a card with more than 512mb video mem nowadays when people on here ask what to get.

So you're saying your FPS doesnt "dip" when it stutters?

 

[chizow]

Originally posted by: Jules
Even when my FPS never goes below 40? I also used a 8800GT in the past with the same settings for TF2 and i never had that issue.

Ya I'd verify what MTDEW said, use FRAPs or something to save to log, often the dip happens so quickly that you don't see how low it gets or it returns to normal by the time you look over to your FPS counter. Its also why frame rate differences between parts with higher and lower VRAM are often not that much but clearly misleading as the drops in FPS are going to be much more noticeable in actual gameplay than say, a 1-3% difference in average FPS in a 60s time demo.

As for why its happening on your 4850 and not your 8800GT, again, are you enabling AA vs. no AA on your 8800GT? That was typically the only reason cited for upgrading from 8800GT to 4850GT, but at the same time, enabling AA is going to expose any frame buffer limitations sooner.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: MTDEW
Although it may not be whats wrong in your particular case, chizow is correct, which is why i always suggest a card with more than 512mb video mem nowadays when people on here ask what to get.

So you're saying your FPS doesnt "dip" when it stutters?

Nope it doesn't dip. Its like its lagging for some odd reason. In fallout 3 and WoW when im walking straight it feels like its hiccuping but its hard to tell.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: chizow

Originally posted by: Jules
Even when my FPS never goes below 40? I also used a 8800GT in the past with the same settings for TF2 and i never had that issue.

Ya I'd verify what MTDEW said, use FRAPs or something to save to log, often the dip happens so quickly that you don't see how low it gets or it returns to normal by the time you look over to your FPS counter. Its also why frame rate differences between parts with higher and lower VRAM are often not that much but clearly misleading as the drops in FPS are going to be much more noticeable in actual gameplay than say, a 1-3% difference in average FPS in a 60s time demo.

As for why its happening on your 4850 and not your 8800GT, again, are you enabling AA vs. no AA on your 8800GT? That was typically the only reason cited for upgrading from 8800GT to 4850GT, but at the same time, enabling AA is going to expose any frame buffer limitations sooner.

Already using fraps. Same settings. Have not had the card since early 08.

 

[MTDEW]

I dont play WOW, but i can definately tell you Fallout 3 will stutter when loading textures as you walk around. (its the price you pay for the large draw distance)

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: MTDEW
I dont play WOW, but i can definately tell you Fallout 3 will stutter when loading textures as you walk around. (its the price you pay for the large draw distance)

Still haven't made it outside yet.

 

[MTDEW]

Your hard drive light isnt blinking at all when it happens?
And you're saying the FPS dont dip when it happens? Thats odd

 

[MTDEW]

Just a thought, since you're saying the FPS dont dip when it happens, its not screen tearing as a result of not using v-sync is it?
Try turning on V-sync and see if that fixes what you're noticing.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: MTDEW
Just a thought, since you're saying the FPS dont dip when it happens, its not screen tearing as a result of not using v-sync is it?
Try turning on V-sync and see if that fixes what you're noticing.

Yep V-Sync is on.

 

[chizow]

Yeah not sure what to tell you, sounds like normal texture thrashing but you can verify its not microstutter by measuring frame times. Microstutter will result in erratic frame time differences without significant drops in FPS and is typically not as noticeable as traditional stuttering. So you may see 38, 38, 42, 43 FPS in 4 consecutive seconds, but once you break down the frame times they'll be all over the place with microstuttering, like 5ms followed by 46ms instead of maybe 26ms (1000/38). With single-GPU you'll see very close to 1000/38, 1000/38, 1000/42, 1000/43 for all the corresponding frame times in that respective second.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: chizow
Yeah not sure what to tell you, sounds like normal texture thrashing but you can verify its not microstutter by measuring frame times. Microstutter will result in erratic frame time differences without significant drops in FPS and is typically not as noticeable as traditional stuttering. So you may see 38, 38, 42, 43 FPS in 4 consecutive seconds, but once you break down the frame times they'll be all over the place with microstuttering, like 5ms followed by 46ms instead of maybe 26ms (1000/38). With single-GPU you'll see very close to 1000/38, 1000/38, 1000/42, 1000/43 for all the corresponding frame times in that respective second.

Never had that issue with my 8800GT so i doubt its a VRAM issue since im using the same settings.

 

[CP5670]

Nope it doesn't dip. Its like its lagging for some odd reason. In fallout 3 and WoW when im walking straight it feels like its hiccuping but its hard to tell.

Does it happen in other games? Fallout 3 has its own microstutter problem and will do that on any card. There is a config file setting to fix it in that game, at the cost of a variable game speed and some minor glitches.

 

[LordGestle]

What resolution and game settings are you running?

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: CP5670

Nope it doesn't dip. Its like its lagging for some odd reason. In fallout 3 and WoW when im walking straight it feels like its hiccuping but its hard to tell.

Does it happen in other games? Fallout 3 has its own microstutter problem and will do that on any card. There is a config file setting to fix it in that game, at the cost of a variable game speed and some minor glitches.

Really? I did not know that. Anymore info? Thanks.


-Lee

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: LordGestle
What resolution and game settings are you running?

1680x1050




BTW i just came back from Microcenter and scored me a q9400 for 179. Good upgrade from a e5200?

 

[taltamir]

microstutter can be caused by a multi gpu setting, but it can also be caused by other factors. I had showen a case where lack of CPU was causing it in mass effect.
Micro stutter is exactly that, a drop in framerate that is very short lived.
Use fraps and have it record all data to a csv file, then you can make formulas that gives you the time in ms it takes to render each frame, then you can look for cases when it suddenly spikes...
note that min fps is still the average of all of frames in that SECOND. so min fps might not accurately indicate microstutter.

 

[Jules]

Originally posted by: taltamir
microstutter can be caused by a multi gpu setting, but it can also be caused by other factors. I had showen a case where lack of CPU was causing it in mass effect.
Micro stutter is exactly that, a drop in framerate that is very short lived.
Use fraps and have it record all data to a csv file, then you can make formulas that gives you the time in ms it takes to render each frame, then you can look for cases when it suddenly spikes...
note that min fps is still the average of all of frames in that SECOND. so min fps might not accurately indicate microstutter.

Just picked up a q9400 didn't seem to have those issues

 

[CP5670]

Originally posted by: Jules

Originally posted by: CP5670

Nope it doesn't dip. Its like its lagging for some odd reason. In fallout 3 and WoW when im walking straight it feels like its hiccuping but its hard to tell.

Does it happen in other games? Fallout 3 has its own microstutter problem and will do that on any card. There is a config file setting to fix it in that game, at the cost of a variable game speed and some minor glitches.

Really? I did not know that. Anymore info? Thanks.


-Lee

See this thread:
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1360932

Note that the "fix" has a couple of side effects, like making the game speed change with the framerate and messing up the lipsyncing. However, I think it's much better than the alternative. I find the microstutter makes this game intolerable at anything below 70fps or so.

 

[Pelu]

micro stuttering the new visual effect of the 21 century...

even my 4870x2 have those micros...