Michael Scheuer Backs Up Ron Paul

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.
 

boredhokie

Senior member
May 7, 2005
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Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

Well Cletus, it's helpful to understand their motivations in order to fight them, unless you think killing more of an organization based on idealists and guerillas is a good idea?

Cletus, we helped create Al Quaeda and the blow back that Ron Paul mentioned was our doing.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
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Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

You're the terrorist, Jaskalas. Many of the middle easterners are defending themselves from terrorists like you.

Some are terrorists themselves, with the religious fanaticism, but they're no worse than you.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,425
7,485
136
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

You're the terrorist, Jaskalas. Many of the middle easterners are defending themselves from terrorists like you.

Some are terrorists themselves, with the religious fanaticism, but they're no worse than you.

That's why you guys loved Ron Paul in the debate, he's saying exactly that but in a more subtle way. Yet you in your furor do not feel the need to hide your absolute hatred for Americans ? the common link between you and those who have sworn death to us.
 

daniel49

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2005
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yep Paul sounded like an absolute nutjob in that last debate, Guilliani's response gave him an upward tick in my book, and I am glad he didn't let Paul get away with that.
Maybe he had been watching Rosie earlier in the day?:roll:
 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
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Originally posted by: daniel49
yep Paul sounded like an absolute nutjob in that last debate, Guilliani's response gave him an upward tick in my book, and I am glad he didn't let Paul get away with that.
Maybe he had been watching Rosie earlier in the day?:roll:

Giuliani's handlers have been yearning to use his soundbite. Tools of the PNAC persuasion would have their fear-filled supporters believing that security can be found just on the other side of a $trillion per year DOD with free reign to 'fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here.'

The truth is that US foreign policy (both soft and hard power) has consequences. Some predictable, others not. Some positive, others not. But only the ill-informed and uninformed are inclined to believe that US foreign policy outcomes are always predictive and always positive. The last thing we need is another President that lacks the intelligence, common sense, and perspective to lead this great nation.

It would be horrible if he followed up Bush the Disaster with Giuliani the Tool.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
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Paul *IS* a nutjob, but his perceptions about 9/11 and the causes of hatred for America follow the principle that even a blind squirrel finds a few acorns... he's right about that.
 

ThunderDawg

Member
Jan 7, 2003
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Originally posted by: BaliBabyDocIt would be horrible if he followed up Bush the Disaster with Giuliani the Tool.

First of all, Guiliani couldn't pass muster in a national campaign.
And second, of course, our next pres will be a DEM.
 

GrGr

Diamond Member
Sep 25, 2003
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Violating the Constitution With an Illegal War

by Rep. Ron Paul, MD

Ron Paul in the US House of Representatives, October 3, 2002

The last time Congress declared war was on December 11, 1941, against Germany in response to its formal declaration of war against the United States. This was accomplished with wording that took less than one-third of a page, without any nitpicking arguments over precise language, yet it was a clear declaration of who the enemy was and what had to be done. And in three-and-a-half years, this was accomplished. A similar resolve came from the declaration of war against Japan three days earlier. Likewise, a clear-cut victory was achieved against Japan.

Many Americans have been forced into war since that time on numerous occasions, with no congressional declaration of war and with essentially no victories. Today?s world political condition is as chaotic as ever. We?re still in Korea and we?re still fighting the Persian Gulf War that started in 1990.

The process by which we?ve entered wars over the past 57 years, and the inconclusive results of each war since that time, are obviously related to Congress? abdication of its responsibility regarding war, given to it by Article I Section 8 of the Constitution.

Congress has either ignored its responsibility entirely over these years, or transferred the war power to the executive branch by a near majority vote of its Members, without consideration of it by the states as an amendment required by the Constitution.

Congress is about to circumvent the Constitution and avoid the tough decision of whether war should be declared by transferring this monumental decision-making power regarding war to the President. Once again, the process is being abused. Odds are, since a clear-cut decision and commitment by the people through their representatives are not being made, the results will be as murky as before. We will be required to follow the confusing dictates of the UN, since that is where the ultimate authority to invade Iraq is coming from ? rather than from the American people and the U.S. Constitution.

Controversial language is being hotly debated in an effort to satisfy political constituencies and for Congress to avoid responsibility of whether to go to war. So far the proposed resolution never mentions war, only empowering the President to use force at his will to bring about peace. Rather strange language indeed!

A declaration of war limits the presidential powers, narrows the focus, and implies a precise end point to the conflict. A declaration of war makes Congress assume the responsibilities directed by the Constitution for this very important decision, rather than assume that if the major decision is left to the President and a poor result occurs, it will be his fault, not that of Congress. Hiding behind the transfer of the war power to the executive through the War Powers Resolution of 1973 will hardly suffice.

However, the modern way we go to war is even more complex and deceptive. We must also write language that satisfies the UN and all our allies. Congress gladly transfers the legislative prerogatives to declare war to the President, and the legislative and the executive branch both acquiesce in transferring our sovereign rights to the UN, an un-elected international government. No wonder the language of the resolution grows in length and incorporates justification for starting this war by citing UN Resolutions.

In order to get more of what we want from the United Nations, we rejoined UNESCO, which Ronald Reagan had bravely gotten us out of, and promised millions of dollars of U.S. taxpayer support to run this international agency started by Sir Julian Huxley. In addition, we read of promises by our administration that once we control Iraqi oil, it will be available for allies like France and Russia, who have been reluctant to join our efforts.

What a difference from the days when a declaration of war was clean and precise and accomplished by a responsible Congress and an informed people!

A great irony of all this is that the United Nations Charter doesn?t permit declaring war, especially against a nation that has been in a state of peace for 12 years. The UN can only declare peace. Remember, it wasn?t a war in Korea; it was only a police action to bring about peace. But at least in Korea and Vietnam there was fighting going on, so it was a bit easier to stretch the language than it is today regarding Iraq. Since Iraq doesn?t even have an Air Force or a Navy, is incapable of waging a war, and remains defenseless against the overwhelming powers of the United States and the British, it?s difficult to claim that we?re going into Iraq to restore peace.

History will eventually show that if we launch this attack the real victims will be the innocent Iraqi civilians who despise Saddam Hussein and are terrified of the coming bombs that will destroy their cities.

The greatest beneficiaries of the attack may well be Osama bin Ladin and the al Qaeda. Some in the media have already suggested that the al Qaeda may be encouraging the whole event. Unintended consequences will occur ? what will come from this attack is still entirely unknown.

It?s a well-known fact that the al Qaeda are not allies of Saddam Hussein and despise the secularization and partial westernization of Iraqi culture. They would welcome the chaos that?s about to come. This will give them a chance to influence post-Saddam Hussein Iraq. The attack, many believe, will confirm to the Arab world that indeed the Christian West has once again attacked the Muslim East, providing radical fundamentalists a tremendous boost for recruitment.

An up or down vote on declaring war against Iraq would not pass the Congress, and the President has no intention of asking for it. This is unfortunate, because if the process were carried out in a constitutional fashion, the American people and the U.S. Congress would vote "No" on assuming responsibility for this war.

Transferring authority to wage war, calling it permission to use force to fight for peace in order to satisfy the UN Charter, which replaces the Article I, Section 8 war power provision, is about as close to 1984 "newspeak" that we will ever get in the real world.

Not only is it sad that we have gone so far astray from our Constitution, but it?s also dangerous for world peace and threatens our liberties here at home.

So many nutjobs in US politics.....

This one at least is quite accurate about the fiasco in Iraq and it's consequences.

 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
0
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Originally posted by: ThunderDawg
Originally posted by: BaliBabyDocIt would be horrible if he followed up Bush the Disaster with Giuliani the Tool.

First of all, Guiliani couldn't pass muster in a national campaign.
And second, of course, our next pres will be a DEM.

Whoa now. I certainly agree that Giulaini is NOT qualified to be President. But I think its foolish to say ANY Democrat is either more qualified or more electable than Giuliani. Bush was demonstrably unqualified by 2004 and the Dems STILL managed to lose.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
348
126
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

You're the terrorist, Jaskalas. Many of the middle easterners are defending themselves from terrorists like you.

Some are terrorists themselves, with the religious fanaticism, but they're no worse than you.

That's why you guys loved Ron Paul in the debate, he's saying exactly that but in a more subtle way. Yet you in your furor do not feel the need to hide your absolute hatred for Americans ? the common link between you and those who have sworn death to us.

You add "deluded liar" to terrorist in that comment, since I LOVE Americans, and you are the hate-filled terrorist calling for killing people.

But I understand how your delusional hate needs lies like that the people you are hating "hate Americans" for you to sustain the delusion.

But it's too bad reality is so far from you, so you can't notice inconsistencies such as my strong support for a war like stopping a real threat like Hitler with 'hating Americans'.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,425
7,485
136
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

You're the terrorist, Jaskalas. Many of the middle easterners are defending themselves from terrorists like you.

Some are terrorists themselves, with the religious fanaticism, but they're no worse than you.

That's why you guys loved Ron Paul in the debate, he's saying exactly that but in a more subtle way. Yet you in your furor do not feel the need to hide your absolute hatred for Americans ? the common link between you and those who have sworn death to us.

You add "deluded liar" to terrorist in that comment, since I LOVE Americans, and you are the hate-filled terrorist calling for killing people.

But I understand how your delusional hate needs lies like that the people you are hating "hate Americans" for you to sustain the delusion.

But it's too bad reality is so far from you, so you can't notice inconsistencies such as my strong support for a war like stopping a real threat like Hitler with 'hating Americans'.

You're saying Americans like me are the ones that need to be dealt with, apparently more than Al Qeada. I don't have to tell anyone you hate fellow Americans, your words explain themselves. Or am I somehow not American anymore, you?d like to demonize further?
 

boredhokie

Senior member
May 7, 2005
625
0
0
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Al Qeada?s word on why it wants to kill us does not change our need to kill them first.

You're the terrorist, Jaskalas. Many of the middle easterners are defending themselves from terrorists like you.

Some are terrorists themselves, with the religious fanaticism, but they're no worse than you.

That's why you guys loved Ron Paul in the debate, he's saying exactly that but in a more subtle way. Yet you in your furor do not feel the need to hide your absolute hatred for Americans ? the common link between you and those who have sworn death to us.

You add "deluded liar" to terrorist in that comment, since I LOVE Americans, and you are the hate-filled terrorist calling for killing people.

But I understand how your delusional hate needs lies like that the people you are hating "hate Americans" for you to sustain the delusion.

But it's too bad reality is so far from you, so you can't notice inconsistencies such as my strong support for a war like stopping a real threat like Hitler with 'hating Americans'.

You're saying Americans like me are the ones that need to be dealt with, apparently more than Al Qeada. I don't have to tell anyone you hate fellow Americans, your words explain themselves. Or am I somehow not American anymore, you?d like to demonize further?

You're nothing at all. I believe in state's rights more than the marketing message of your "amurica". Willfully pig-ignorant country folks like you make the states and country look bad - sort of how the extremists over in sandville make their countries look. You don't understand the parallel?

HL Menken said that only theives and cowards hide behind the flag and patriotism - it's easy to see why with sheep like you running around.