Metro Explosion in St. Petersburg

[Triloby]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europ...ng&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=news_central

So far, 10 dead and about more than 30 injured.

 

[theeedude]

Putin's approval dropped too far?

 

[kage69]

Putin changing the topic after all the corruption protests, or Saudi backed group sending Russia an FU for Syrian involvement?

I'd say the odds are equal.

 

[Blue_Max]

Putin's approval dropped too far?

Nice try.

I think the prime suspect had... other motives.

 

[brycejones]

False flag!

 

[Jaskalas]

Putin's approval dropped too far?

False flags are usually Alex Jones material.

 

[bshole]

ISIS doesn't get it. Terrorism isn't gonna work on Russia. It is like a free gift to Putin. He loves having an enemy he can engage militarily. In addition, there is a chance he would openly oppress all Muslims in Russia if he gets annoyed enough. It seems improbably right now that he would go full genocide but you can never tell with authoritarian types.

 

[Jaskalas]

there is a chance he would openly oppress all Muslims in Russia if he gets annoyed enough.

That's probably the goal of terrorists right there.
They're under some delusion that such conflict turns in their favor sometime down the road.

 

[Triloby]

ISIS doesn't get it. Terrorism isn't gonna work on Russia. It is like a free gift to Putin. He loves having an enemy he can engage militarily. In addition, there is a chance he would openly oppress all Muslims in Russia if he gets annoyed enough. It seems improbably right now that he would go full genocide but you can never tell with authoritarian types.

Right now, it looks like a tossup between ISIS and Chechen rebels regarding the attack. Some are saying it's the latter, although some say that ISIS has Chechen rebels working within their ranks.

Either way, Putin doesn't give two shits about the differences between ISIS and Chechnya.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

That's probably the goal of terrorists right there.
They're under some delusion that such conflict turns in their favor sometime down the road.

Has any terrorist actually stated this outright? I know this is a popular thing to say but it seems like a meme to me. Bin Laden orchestrated 9/11 because of our support for Israel, our bombing in Sudan, and our sanctions in Iraq, which killed hundreds of thousands of Muslims collectively. Chechens commit terrorism against Russia because they want to exist as an independent nation. The right- and left-wing forms of the idea, "Terrorists hate our freedoms" and "Terrorists win when we kill them", are both jokes. People resort to political violence when they feel oppressed or victimized, often by much larger practitioners of political violence like ourselves.

 

[Jaskalas]

there is a chance he would openly oppress all Muslims in Russia if he gets annoyed enough.

People resort to political violence when they feel oppressed or victimized...

And those two quotes are different, how?
They're not, they are the same thing and I already agreed with it in my previous post.

 

[cytg111]

ISIS doesn't get it. Terrorism isn't gonna work on Russia. It is like a free gift to Putin. He loves having an enemy he can engage militarily. In addition, there is a chance he would openly oppress all Muslims in Russia if he gets annoyed enough. It seems improbably right now that he would go full genocide but you can never tell with authoritarian types.

This is my concern as well. First off that shit would spread like wildfire to the rest of the world.. "war on muslims" and would serve as another notch up on the geopolitical ladder for russia/putin. Muslims to become the jews of 1935.. Please god no.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

And those two quotes are different, how?

bshole's quote concerns fear/speculation that Putin could use this as an opportunity to discriminate against Muslims, mine is a general comment on the underlying motives of political terrorism. They're not mutually exclusive statements, but they're also not inherently connected. fwiw I do disagree that Putin is that dumb, and wouldn't be surprised if ISIS has little/nothing to do with this bombing. Unlike someone like Trump, Putin speaks positively of Russian Muslims, knowing that Russia has a large Muslim minority and that most of them are Tatars that live peacefully, in order to unite his subjects against the common enemy in Chechnya.

Not sure what that has to do with the bulk of my post in disagreement with yours, though.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Has any terrorist actually stated this outright? I know this is a popular thing to say but it seems like a meme to me. Bin Laden orchestrated 9/11 because of our support for Israel, our bombing in Sudan, and our sanctions in Iraq, which killed hundreds of thousands of Muslims collectively. Chechens commit terrorism against Russia because they want to exist as an independent nation. The right- and left-wing forms of the idea, "Terrorists hate our freedoms" and "Terrorists win when we kill them", are both jokes. People resort to political violence when they feel oppressed or victimized, often by much larger practitioners of political violence like ourselves.

I'm sure they have different motives depending on whose doing the terrorizing and to whom. ISIS as far as I know is trying to provoke backlash in order to bring about a holy war/Armageddon. Others I'm sure attack civilians because it's easier and to terrorize that population while drawing attention to their cause. Plenty others I'm sure drank the religious Kool Aid and think god wants them to kill the infidels.

 

[UglyCasanova]

This is my concern as well. First off that shit would spread like wildfire to the rest of the world.. "war on muslims" and would serve as another notch up on the geopolitical ladder for russia/putin. Muslims to become the jews of 1935.. Please god no.

I'm sure rightly or wrongly plenty of Jews would disagree with the comparison. They weren't terrorizing Germans to provoke the holocaust. I'm certainly not advocating for any genocide so don't take me wrong, but we invaded Afghanistan because the Taliban was harbouring terrorist that meant to kill us (and we invaded Iraq out of a desire for power). I get what you're saying but from a Jewish perspective I'd imagine they'd disagree.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Nice try.

I think the prime suspect had... other motives.

He looks like Abraham Lincoln with his hat cut in half.

 

[Jaskalas]

Not sure what that has to do with the bulk of my post in disagreement with yours, though.

Your reply to my post surely relates to my own and its meaning. Bshole said maybe Putin will "oppress" Muslims. I say they're probably looking for that sort of confrontation. In your combative reply... is a full circle back to explaining oppressed terrorists. You sort of defeat your objection to my post by illustrating my own meaning.

Plenty of Islamic terrorists have said they want a holy war. You think they don't want more recruits?
You have I appear to have both agreed how that recruitment would occur. Case closed? Much ado about nothing?

 

[Chaotic42]

RIP. My thoughts are with the families and victims. I'm no huge fan of Russia, but stuff like this is always tragic and no one deserves it.

 

[Victorian Gray]

FYI:

"Some Russian media released a photograph of a man they said was one of the suspects, with a long black beard and wearing a black skullcap and all-black outfit. Later, agencies reported that the man had gone to the police after his image was published, and had nothing to do with the blast."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...rocked-by-explosion-sennaya-ploshchad-station

 

[Orignal Earl]

Nice try.

I think the prime suspect had... other motives.

What motives do you believe he had?

 

[Victorian Gray]

What motives do you think he had?

You used the word "think" in a post directed to Blue_Max. You silly person.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

I'm sure they have different motives depending on whose doing the terrorizing and to whom. ISIS as far as I know is trying to provoke backlash in order to bring about a holy war/Armageddon. Others I'm sure attack civilians because it's easier and to terrorize that population while drawing attention to their cause. Plenty others I'm sure drank the religious Kool Aid and think god wants them to kill the infidels.

Fair enough, religious martyrdom would be an example where people would want to be killed by their enemies in order to further a cause. Most of ISIS isn't composed of suicidal martyrs though, they're soldiers fighting a war.

Your reply to my post surely relates to my own and its meaning. Bshole said maybe Putin will "oppress" Muslims. I say they're probably looking for that sort of confrontation. In your combative reply... is a full circle back to explaining oppressed terrorists. You sort of defeat your objection to my post by illustrating my own meaning.

Plenty of Islamic terrorists have said they want a holy war. You think they don't want more recruits?
You have I appear to have both agreed how that recruitment would occur. Case closed? Much ado about nothing?

If these were Chechens, they're probably not looking for a holy war. If they're anti-Assad forces, ISIS or otherwise, why would they want to be bombed even harder by Putin? From what I can tell, many Russian Muslims recruited by ISIS are Chechens to begin with, and likely products of political convenience. Sure, they'll take whatever victimization of innocents they can get, but that isn't their goal, it's a perk at most. What they want is national recognition.

 

[Orignal Earl]

You used the word "think" in a post directed to Blue_Max. You silly person.

Fixed it

 

[cytg111]

I'm sure rightly or wrongly plenty of Jews would disagree with the comparison. They weren't terrorizing Germans to provoke the holocaust. I'm certainly not advocating for any genocide so don't take me wrong, but we invaded Afghanistan because the Taliban was harbouring terrorist that meant to kill us (and we invaded Iraq out of a desire for power). I get what you're saying but from a Jewish perspective I'd imagine they'd disagree.

Right. I was not considering the present jews at all in that comparison, only the only truly evil that was the holocaust.
In my mind, if the powers that be decided that this upcoming coldwar v2.0 is not worth it, this could be the common outher enemy that pulls west and east together, and as much as I'd like to have russian brothers there is a line that cant, must not, be crossed.

 

[theeedude]

False flags are usually Alex Jones material.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Russian_apartment_bombings

The position of Russian authorities on the Ryazan incident changed significantly over time. Initially, police, FSB and federal government officials treated the disarmed bomb as a real threat and praised citizen vigilance. After the people who planted the bomb were identified as FSB operatives, the official version changed to "security training", causing confusion and distrust especially among the Ryazan police and FSB officers involved in the initial phase of the investigation.

Putin has done massive false flag terrorist attacks on his own people before to shore up political support.