Meghan McCain on abortion: "Republicans don't like to discuss or deal with things they think are wrong or immoral."

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
I'm not a fan of Meghan McCain, but I applaud her for bringing up a delicate topic that really needs to be raised if the Republican Party is going to mount a recovery in many of the urbanized regions of America.

I like her primary but somewhat understated message in this opinion piece: Educate, give your opinion, but at the end of the day after you've supplied your children with as much information as you can give them, respect that the choices they make are theirs. Both the political left and right sorely need to follow that advice.

The GOP Doesn't Understand Sex

Let me get something straight: Bristol Palin, as an 18-year-old adult, is free to make her own choices and decide how she wants her life to unfold. But for whatever reasons, the American public and media remain overly engrossed in our politicians? sex lives and, as in this case, those of their families.

There?s an especially unhealthy attitude among conservatives. Daughters of Republican politicians aren?t expected to have sex, let alone enjoy it?as if there were some strange chastity belt automatically attached to us female offspring. God forbid anyone talk realistically about life experiences and natural, sexual instincts. Nope, the answer is always abstinence.

This is something I know about firsthand. During my father?s 2000 presidential campaign, a reporter asked how he would feel if I became pregnant and wanted an abortion. He answered that it would be my choice, sending shockwaves throughout the party (because for the GOP there is only one answer, and obviously Senator McCain?s daughter shouldn?t be engaging in sex ever).

Here was a father, delicately navigating a question about his teenage daughter and being true to the kind of father he had always been, and the Republican Party was outraged. It didn?t matter that my parents raised me to know that, regardless of the mistakes I might make, they would allow me the dignity and courage to make my own choices.

That?s the kind of trust my parents have always placed in their children?yet the GOP still needed to get involved and have a say in what I did with my body.

Here?s what I?ve never understood about the party: its resistance to discussing better access to birth control. As a Republican, I am pro-life. But using birth control and having an abortion are not the same at all. Actually, the best way to prevent abortions is to educate people about birth control and make it widely and easily accessible.

True, abstinence is the only way to fully prevent pregnancy and sexually transmitted diseases. Still, the problem with abstinence-only education is that it does not make teenagers and young adults more knowledgeable about all the issues they face if or when they have sex?physically and emotionally.

The key, honestly, is communication between parents and children. At the end of the day, the worst thing parents can do is raise children who are not prepared for the situations they may encounter, especially when they?re not planned. (For anyone who remembers their teen years, you know what I mean.) Unfortunately, Republicans typically don?t like to discuss or deal with things they think are wrong or immoral. And that?s a huge mistake.

If we can?t discuss birth control in addition to abstinence, and in a nonjudgmental way, kids will continue to make bad choices for lack of having access to informed, safe options. Not everyone shares the same beliefs, and more importantly, people don?t always react the same way to their circumstances. Which is why it is so important to encourage honest, open communication about the realities of sex within the party at large, and more specifically, between parents and their children.
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
A Republican with common sense... who'd a thunk it. But let's see if she keeps this level headed rationality should she ever run for office...
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

And I say we go one step further and give them a full course on the psychology of sex. I took a 200 level class in college that dealt with the psychology of sex, stds, and yes different positions.

After a month of learning about all the shit one can catch from banging random people. Free internet pr0n never looked so good!
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

And I say we go one step further and give them a full course on the psychology of sex. I took a 200 level class in college that dealt with the psychology of sex, stds, and yes different positions.

After a month of learning about all the shit one can catch from banging random people. Free internet pr0n never looked so good!

Sounds good to me.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
76
At least someone in the (R) party is publicly stating abstinence only sex-ed doesn't work. :thumbsup:
 
Dec 30, 2004
12,553
2
76
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.
 

MotF Bane

No Lifer
Dec 22, 2006
60,801
10
0
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

Are you calling Meghan McCain a liberal, or are you just making a completely irrelevant comment on liberals as a whole? Not that either answer is going to be an intelligent choice.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
11
81
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.
 

DealMonkey

Lifer
Nov 25, 2001
13,136
1
0
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

No one's "in favor of abortion." Unless you're the abortee.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
76
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

<== Liberal

Pro choice
Pro death penalty
Pro gun rights

Way to generalize. :roll:
 

CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
14
76
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

While being for the death penalty and against abortion isn't?
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

Are you retarded? Your statement works for conservatives too.

Actually, now that i think about it, here's how stupid you really are

1) Liberals don't 'favor' abortion, they favor choice

2) There's no debating that an inmate on death row is a human being, but there is a debate on whether a fetus is.
 

CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
14
76
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.

And people wonder why teenage pregnancy has such high rates. Teenagers figuring out sex on their own is not a problem, is figuring out how to not get pregnant or catch an STD from it is the problem. Not every parent is going to teach their children facts about pregnancy or STD's, therefore it is in societies interest that someone does, and more importantly, teach them facts about it, not the garbage that the abstinence only people teach.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.

There is little to no shame or self control anymore.

There was a time when people had a sense of shame in getting pregnant or getting a girl pregnant and so took precautions like birth control and somehow knew where to get it without all this lack of education that somehow is the cause of all these pregnancies in today's Internet age

Today you get pregnant you are some sort of hero to be on the cover of every magazine and do the talk show rounds.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
11
81
Originally posted by: CitizenKain
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.

And people wonder why teenage pregnancy has such high rates. Teenagers figuring out sex on their own is not a problem, is figuring out how to not get pregnant or catch an STD from it is the problem. Not every parent is going to teach their children facts about pregnancy or STD's, therefore it is in societies interest that someone does, and more importantly, teach them facts about it, not the garbage that the abstinence only people teach.

You make such a compelling case for govt. re-education camps. :roll:

Forcing YOUR values on MY kids is not your right, anymore than I may do the same to YOUR kids.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
11
81
Originally posted by: 1prophet
There is little to no shame or self control anymore.

There was a time when people had a sense of shame in getting pregnant or getting a girl pregnant and so took precautions like birth control and somehow knew where to get it without all this lack of education that somehow is the cause of all these pregnancies in today's Internet age

Today you get pregnant you are some sort of hero to be on the cover of every magazine and do the talk show rounds.

Which is why sex ed isn't really changing much - many kids know the facts, and choose to ignore them, much like smokers, who know what they do causes cancer, and continue to smoke anyway. We'd like to believe we're all rational actors, but we're not.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
106
She makes sense here. Too bad if she were running for office as an R, she would probably get booted out of the party. There seems to be no more room for moderates in the party anymore...
 

Deeko

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
30,213
12
81
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

Don't even try to pull that card, boy. Republicans are just as hypocritical on the subject of human life, just the opposite stances.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: MovingTarget
She makes sense here. Too bad if she were running for office as an R, she would probably get booted out of the party. There seems to be no more room for moderates in the party anymore...

Didn't the de facto head of the party, El Rushbo, demand that she, her father and Colin Powell leave the Party?
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
11
81
Originally posted by: Deeko
Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Against death penalty but in favor of abortion. Liberals are self-contradictory in the most confusing manner.

Don't even try to pull that card, boy. Republicans are just as hypocritical on the subject of human life, just the opposite stances.

I would hardly consider an unborn child and a convicted killer morally equivalent actors. For the record, I support the killing of neither.
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.

And our low teen pregnancy and STD rates prove that the status quo is great.... no wait...
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
Originally posted by: 1prophet
Originally posted by: Mursilis
Originally posted by: Genx87
I agree with what she is saying about birth control and abstinence only education. It is time the party drops the abstinence only education. They need to be taught in tandom.

Actually, they don't need to be taught at all, at least not in public school. Since this is a highly charged topic, let parents pass on to their children whatever values they consider primary. If you want to teach your kids abstinence-only, you should be free to do so. And if you want to give your teenager a Planned Parenthood gift card for their 13th birthday, you should also be free to do that.

I went to public schools my whole life, from K through 4 different colleges/universities, and (shocking!), I never actually had a course on sex ed. In biology, we got the standard 'sperm enters egg to create zygote' stuff true for all mammals, and in health we got a brief discussion of puberty and menstruation, but almost no actual sex talk. Most teenagers were pretty much able to figure out sex on their own, and this was pre-internet! Schools in some locations are barely accomplishing teaching reading, writing, and math - let them focus on not graduating functional illiterates before they worry about sex ed.

There is little to no shame or self control anymore.

There was a time when people had a sense of shame in getting pregnant or getting a girl pregnant and so took precautions like birth control and somehow knew where to get it without all this lack of education that somehow is the cause of all these pregnancies in today's Internet age

Today you get pregnant you are some sort of hero to be on the cover of every magazine and do the talk show rounds.

Not really. People just got married younger and there were more forced marriages to save face.
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
Originally posted by: Mursilis

Forcing YOUR values on MY kids is not your right, anymore than I may do the same to YOUR kids.

So ignorance of sexual matters is a value, let alone one to be proud of?