Meaning of "SATA 4 and SATA 5 do not support IDE mode"?

BernardP

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Jan 10, 2006
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I just installed an Asus M3N78-VM GeForce 8200 motherboard in the course of a system upgrade. Everything is running well.

There are 5 SATA ports on the mobo, 3 of which (SATA 1, SATA 2, SATA3) are already being used by 3 hard drives (non-RAID)

There are 2 open SATA ports left and they are black instead of red (SATA 4, SATA 5). The motherboard manual says: "Due to chipset limitation, SATA 4 and SATA 5 do not support IDE mode, only support AHCI+RAID mode"

Does this mean that I can't use SATA 4 or SATA 5 to connect a SATA optical drive?
Does this mean that I can only use SATA 4 and SATA 5 if I configure my system for RAID?
Why do they say AHCI+RAID instead of RAID?

I still have an IDE DVD burner, and it's connected to the one IDE connector on the mobo. So for now, I'm good. Just wondering if I have the possibility of adding a SATA optical drive. I'm not interested in RAID.

 

VirtualLarry

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Aug 25, 2001
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That's a curious limitation. Thanks for the warning. I think I'll avoid GeForce 8200-based mobos based on that.
 

Blazer

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sata 4 & 5 are AHCI ports [Advanced Host Controller Interface]

they can be used for any sata connection, either HD or Cd/Dvd in the AHCI mode, you would not be able to configure the ports to IDE mode in the bios page, so in general if you wanted to use the controller for an OS installation you would have to choose AHCI Sata1, Sata2 or raid, other than that they can be used.
 

BernardP

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Originally posted by: blazer
sata 4 & 5 are AHCI ports [Advanced Host Controller Interface]

they can be used for any sata connection, either HD or Cd/Dvd in the AHCI mode, you would not be able to configure the ports to IDE mode in the bios page, so in general if you wanted to use the controller for an OS installation you would have to choose AHCI Sata1, Sata2 or raid, other than that they can be used.

OK Thanks blazer. Glad to know I can use them to connect an optical drive or HD drive.

I searched about this IDE Mode thing and I understand that IDE Mode is a slower legacy configuration the SATA ports will revert to if no SATA driver is installed...Right?

In my situation, there should be no problem or limitation, as I have SATA drivers installed. They are included with XP SP1 onwards.

It seems to me the explanation in the motherboard manual could have been more to the point for the uninitiated.
 

VirtualLarry

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Originally posted by: BernardP
In my situation, there should be no problem or limitation, as I have SATA drivers installed. They are included with XP SP1 onwards.
No, XP does not include any SATA AHCI drivers.

 

BernardP

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Jan 10, 2006
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Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
No, XP does not include any SATA AHCI drivers.

Mmm...

The mobo manual says: Install XP SP1 before using SATA connectors

I assumed this means that SATA drivers are part of SP1. What's the functional difference between SATA and SATA AHCI ?

 

VirtualLarry

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Originally posted by: BernardP
Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
No, XP does not include any SATA AHCI drivers.

Mmm...

The mobo manual says: Install XP SP1 before using SATA connectors

I assumed this means that SATA drivers are part of SP1. What's the functional difference between SATA and SATA AHCI ?

XP SP1 includes 48-bit LBA support for HDs larger than 128GB. Also required for most SATA HDs.

AHCI requires specific driver support, which means that you have to press F6 when prompted when installing XP, and then supply vendor drivers on a floppy disk (hopefully you have one connected). Otherwise, you can "slipstream" drivers onto the install CD if you don't have a floppy disk. (Using nLite, etc.)

AHCI supports hot-plugging, and NCQ. If you just need to use the HD with XP, don't bother with AHCI, just set the BIOS to "IDE" mode, and install XP normally. But it looks like you cannot use port 4 or 5 on that mobo without installing the AHCI drivers.
 

BernardP

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Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
AHCI requires specific driver support, which means that you have to press F6 when prompted when installing XP, and then supply vendor drivers on a floppy disk (hopefully you have one connected). Otherwise, you can "slipstream" drivers onto the install CD if you don't have a floppy disk. (Using nLite, etc.)

AHCI supports hot-plugging, and NCQ. If you just need to use the HD with XP, don't bother with AHCI, just set the BIOS to "IDE" mode, and install XP normally. But it looks like you cannot use port 4 or 5 on that mobo without installing the AHCI drivers.

It seems I'm back to square one. I'm not going to reinstall at this point and I don't have a floppy reader. Looking into the BIOS, all I see under Storage Configurations is a choice between SATA Mode, RAID Mode and AHCI Mode. I have SATA Mode selected. I don't see an option to select IDE Mode, there or anywhere else.

Should I understand that I'm already in IDE mode if I did'nt go through the RAID/AHCI ritual when installing Windows?

Is there a way to install AHCI drivers without going through a complete reinstall? Strange that two of the SATA ports would be unusable because I didn't install an optional driver.
 

VirtualLarry

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Originally posted by: BernardP
It seems I'm back to square one. I'm not going to reinstall at this point and I don't have a floppy reader. Looking into the BIOS, all I see under Storage Configurations is a choice between SATA Mode, RAID Mode and AHCI Mode. I have SATA Mode selected. I don't see an option to select IDE Mode, there or anywhere else.
Usually, the selection is "IDE", "AHCI", or "RAID". So in your case I'm going to guess that "SATA Mode" is the same as IDE emulation mode. No extra drivers needed.

Originally posted by: BernardP
Should I understand that I'm already in IDE mode if I did'nt go through the RAID/AHCI ritual when installing Windows?

Is there a way to install AHCI drivers without going through a complete reinstall? Strange that two of the SATA ports would be unusable because I didn't install an optional driver.
Yes, you're already in IDE mode, most likely. There's no harm in trying to install the AHCI drivers from inside Windows. After installing them, you might even be able to switch the BIOS setting to AHCI if you like.
 

BernardP

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Suddently, it hit me...Why not try it?

I unplugged the secondary HD from SATA 2 and plugged it into SATA 4. The result: The system doesn't see the hard drive. Having not installed RAID/AHCI drivers during the WinXP install, I have only 3 working SATA ports.

This suits my needs now, but maybe I'll find this constraining in the future.

Looking in the motherboard manual, I see that RAID/AHCI drivers have to be added in the course of Win XP installation. However, for Vista, they can be added after the O/S install.

This has been very useful to me VirtualLarry. I will keep a record of this information in case I need to access more than 3 SATA ports in the future.

Thanks
 

BernardP

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One more question if I may :eek:

I have added a third SATA HD and my 3 SATA connectors are now occupied. There is also an E-SATA port on the board. Am I right to think that I could use this E-SATA port to connect an internal optical drive? It would be possible to re-route the SATA cable inside the case from the outside connector and connect it to the drive.

It doesn't seem there is functional diffetence between SATA and E-SATA.
 

GeezerMan

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Jan 28, 2005
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Originally posted by: BernardP
One more question if I may :eek:

I have added a third SATA HD and my 3 SATA connectors are now occupied. There is also an E-SATA port on the board. Am I right to think that I could use this E-SATA port to connect an internal optical drive? It would be possible to re-route the SATA cable inside the case from the outside connector and connect it to the drive.

It doesn't seem there is functional diffetence between SATA and E-SATA.

An eSATA port is not the same as a SATA port. You would have to use something like a eSATA bracket that has a eSATA cable on one end and a standard SATA cable on the other. It will operate like a regular SATA port.
 

RoadKill256

Junior Member
Dec 11, 2008
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You may still be able to add the drivers to XP without having to reinstall. I have done this in the past with Lenovo laptops with the drivers they supplied.

When their drivers are extracted, it contains a sub folder called 'PREPARE'. In there is an 'install.cmd'. After running that you reboot into the BIOS and then change the SATA mode to 'AHCI' and boot into Windows. It boots into Windows without the Blue screen you would normally receive if AHCI is enabled with the drivers installed.

Then it detects and you are able to manually install the driver as you normally would.

I wasn't able to locate the driver for your sata drive and I couldn't check this out for you, hopefully this helps.

Here is the link from Lenovo with the instructions so no one thinks I'm crazy.

---
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?sitestyle=lenovo&lndocid=MIGR-70477

Note: If you do not have a diskette drive, you can install Intel Matrix Storage Manager Driver by the following alternative procedure:

If you do not have a diskette drive, you can install Intel Matrix Storage Manager Driver by the following alternative procedure:

1. Start the BIOS Setup Utility menu.
2. Select Config.
3. Select Serial ATA (SATA).
4. Select Compatibility.
5. Install Windows XP and Service Pack 2.
6. Download Intel Matrix Storage Manager Driver from the Web site and extract the driver to C:\DRIVERS\WIN\IMSM.
7. Run Intel Matrix Storage Manager Driver. To do this, go to C:\DRIVERS\WIN\IMSM\PREPARE, and double-click install.cmd.
8. Turn the computer off and then on again.
9. Start the BIOS Setup Utility menu.
10. Select Config.
11. Select Serial ATA (SATA).
12. Select AHCI.
13. Start Windows XP. The Welcome to the Found New Hardware Wizard appears.
14. Click No, not this time and click Next.
15. Select Install from a list or specific location(Advanced), then click Next.
16. Select Search for the best driver in these locations. Then select Include this location in the search:, specify the path, C:\DRIVERS\WIN\IMSM, and click Next. The Completing the Found New Hardware Wizard appears.
17. Click Finish.
18. When the System Settings Change window appears, click Yes. The computer restarts.
 

RoadKill256

Junior Member
Dec 11, 2008
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You're welcome. I hope it works out. I have a friend who is going through the same issues. She is attempting this as well.
 

VirtualLarry

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Aug 25, 2001
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RoadKill256, interesting info. Sadly, it doesn't help if the BIOS is configured only to allow AHCI mode. In that case, you have to slipstream the install CD (or if you happen to have one of the few USB floppies that works for the F6 driver install).
 

shuntu

Junior Member
Feb 21, 2009
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sorry for bringing up an older post.
Im having an issue similar to BernadP with the M3N78-VM mainboard; different setup; 4 HDDs
I installed winXP in SATAmode rather than AHCI mode (not sure if this matters)
I read on other forums of ways to fix this via registry if you have ICH7DH/ICH8R/ICH9R controller

in BIOS I only see, Sata1-3 and E-sata in SATAMODE, when i change storage config to AHCI mode, and reboot, i see all HDD's & ports correctly in AHCI config, now, when i try to boot OS, i see windows logo appear, then bsod
I also tried booting in safe mode, and still experienced a BSOD
I believe I need to install the XP drivers for AHCI module, and cannot find them via MFG website (asus)

extra info: OS HDD is 250GB (sata1), it is older and doesn't suport NCQ, 2 other slave drives, are working great and are newer [750+1000GB](sata2&3) and a 500gb(sata4, the black connector)

looking for some insight and direction on how to resolve my issue; getting my 4th HDD to work.

thanks for reading & your time.
take care
 

kilnsea

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Jun 24, 2002
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^that's what prety much happened to me with my ECS board, 8200 chipset. I originally pointed roadkill to this thread, because the problem was so similar. His suggestions didn't work. What DID work was replacing the board with a NON-8200 chipset, in my case an Asrock. This deserves a good bumping because it seems to be an ongoing issue with the 8200 chipset boards. GL!
 

shuntu

Junior Member
Feb 21, 2009
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I see
thanks for the quick response, I want to try to avoid swapping boards immediately, but if there are no other fixes, I will. (If formatting OS with AHCI enabled, instead of SATAMODE enable will fix this, I don't mind doing so, because this is a new rig I've assembled.

has anyone have anymore insight to share?

thanks again

Shaun
 

Madwand1

Diamond Member
Jan 23, 2006
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The basic problem is that the drivers cannot be installed in the OS if the AHCI controller is not enabled in the BIOS, and that the OS cannot be booted if the drivers are not installed and the AHCI controller is enabled.

WARNING

Mucking around with the OS as follows is inherently risky, and you could mess up your setup and lose data if you do the wrong things / take risky steps / just get unlucky. I suggest making a full backup of your OS drive to a new drive, disconnecting every drive, installing the backup as your only drive, and going on from there.

/WARNING

A workaround is to use a second controller. Now this can be just as tricky with respect to running under that controller & installing drivers. If the controller is supported as an basic SATA/IDE controller, then great, you might be able to avoid its driver installations. Otherwise, you have to install the controller, boot into the OS as-is and install the drivers for the new controller. Reboot and confirm that everything's fine. Then shutdown, and reconnect the OS drive to the new controller. Reboot and confirm that everything's fine. Then shutdown again, and enable AHCI mode in the BIOS.

Reboot, and this time install the nVIDIA SATA driver. First, you need to find the drivers. nVIDIA's not making this easy these days. Your motherboard vendor should have supplied the drivers. Navigate to the folder and run the appropriate setup if you can find one, and install it. Alternatively, select update driver from the unknown device driver popup / Device Manager, and browse to the appropriate folder.

If that works, you should see an nVIDIA SATA device with all the ports available. Shutdown, reconnect the OS drive to that controller, and reboot.

If for some reason you didn't take the advice and disconnect all the other drives, you might need to adjust the drive ordering / boot ordering in the BIOS during these steps.

Which controller? You might be able to get by with a IDE to SATA adapter on the existing IDE controller. Alternatively an add-on PCIe or PCI SATA controller. The simpler the better. I've done this just now with a Silicon Image 3112-based controller after installing its "RAID" drivers under the OS.