Mazda3 people, rec tires and other stuff for me...

[phucheneh]

2011 Mazda3i Sport...Grand...SV...Touring...or something. I can never remember how they were breaking down the models the year I bought my car. It's the highest trim level of the base engine, 5spd sedan. If that makes sense.

I really like the way this little car performs. Went out of factory warranty last month. I'm at about 30k and I've got MAYBE 4/32", probably less, left on my front tires. Little better on the rear.

I'll probably go ahead and replace the fronts soon, and then do the rears when it's time for a rotation. But anyhow, I basically just want to know what options I have for a tire with a reasonable life expectancy that is geared toward handling. The shop I work for normally carries Goodyear, but I can probably get whatever I want through local warehouses or Tirerack. Right now I'm at ~30k miles on the OEM 205/55/16 Bridgestone Turanzas. As much as I wanna call them junk...they work. They're gripping enough. With IIRC 280 treadwear, they should be, dammit.

I would've just gone for treadlife, but I'd really like to keep the car handling as good as it can while keeping a decent all-around all-season...sooo...recs?

I'm thinking maybe Eagle F1 and call it a day. Prob get the best price on them.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...WR6F1AAS&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

Beyond that, I want to make some MINOR handling and general 'driving pleasure' upgrades at some point. No aftermarket springs. No dampers, either. Just some stuff for stiffening, balance, reinforcement, ect. Things that won't drastically alter the car.

The first three likely things: A minor upgrade to the rear sway bar. A new torque mount for the engine (mine might already be ripped...shit design). Not for or from trying to drag launch or anything...just would like to stiffen it up a bit, and along with that, some shifter parts to take out some of the slack that has developed there. From there, I really can't come up with much that will enhance my driving experience...thoughts?

 

[996GT2]

These have gotten pretty rave reviews on forums and by several magazines/online sites. 45k mile treadwear warranty.

http://www.michelinman.com/tire-sel...formance-sport/pilot-sport-a-s-3/tire-details



Forum review of the A/S 3. Said to be basically like an all-season tire with performance like the Pilot Sport 2. The only caveat is that they are not good in heavy snow, but then again, not many high performance all-seasons are.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=926581

Pilot Sport A/S 3
I downgraded to the A/S 3 because it basically performance the same as the old PS2, Pole Position S-04, etc... so it's really the equivalent of a "pre-PSS" Max Performance tire in many ways...

But it's also quieter, less harsh on bumps, has much longer treadlife, and can handle heavy rain and even light snow (though NOT heavy snow)

The snow issue is the trick with this tire... basically is a little bit sketchily advertised as an all-season. In the A/S 3 reviews on the web, you'll notice that Michelin didn't show any results on snow.

This seems like the no-brainer tire for anyone who wants great (but not peak) performance while balancing other qualities, as long as snow performance is not really needed.

I was initially worried whether the A/S 3 could handle the torque of 1st gear (stock) -- it can, with no slip.

The other benefit I noticed with the A/S 3 is that you get less feedback from lousy road surfaces... feedback is great on perfect roads, but if you live in a city with broken/bumpy/uneven roads, it's really nice not to get all that info back, IMHO!

 

[phucheneh]

I am a Michelin fan but you don't tend to hear much about their offerings from the performance crowd anymore. I hadn't even looked to see what they had available.

The AS3's in my size are about $115-120 on Tirerack. Not bad. Actually on the lower end of Michelin's line, which seems odd. That's the H-rated...also a Y available, which I guess is just the same tread cap stuck on a stiffer sidewall? Seems like they might be a good bet. I'll have to pay close to Tirerack price, though. I'd go with Goodyear, but they really don't have anything stunning. The F1 looks like the direct competitor with the AS3.

 

[MiataNC]

1. Stiffer sway bars front and back. - This will tighten up the cornering without compromising the overall ride.
http://www.good-win-racing.com/Mazda-Performance-Parts/Mazda3/Suspension.html

2. Shifter bushings - This will tighten up the feel and precision of the shifter.
http://www.corksport.com/corksport-mazdaspeed-3-shifter-bushing-set.html

3. Find a "Track Day" at a local track, and have the time of your life.

 

[toronado97]

Everyone on the Mazda3 forums seems to like the Continental DWS line of tires. Here's a link to them on tirerack. I put you down as a 2011 Mazda 3i Touring which I believe is the correct model of your car.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...autoModel=Mazda3 4-Door&autoModClar=i Touring

 

[996GT2]

I am a Michelin fan but you don't tend to hear much about their offerings from the performance crowd anymore. I hadn't even looked to see what they had available.

The AS3's in my size are about $115-120 on Tirerack. Not bad. Actually on the lower end of Michelin's line, which seems odd. That's the H-rated...also a Y available, which I guess is just the same tread cap stuck on a stiffer sidewall? Seems like they might be a good bet. I'll have to pay close to Tirerack price, though. I'd go with Goodyear, but they really don't have anything stunning. The F1 looks like the direct competitor with the AS3.

Really? The PSS is one of the most popular high performance summer tires these days. It's pretty much the new benchmark among non R compound performance tires.

 

[phucheneh]

1. Stiffer sway bars front and back. - This will tighten up the cornering without compromising the overall ride.
http://www.good-win-racing.com/Mazda-Performance-Parts/Mazda3/Suspension.html

2. Shifter bushings - This will tighten up the feel and precision of the shifter.
http://www.corksport.com/corksport-mazdaspeed-3-shifter-bushing-set.html

3. Find a "Track Day" at a local track, and have the time of your life.

I definitely want to do the shifter bushings. Was hoping someone had done the lower torque mount on their car and could rec the best solution there, but I may just have to dig in to the Mazda forums. I know there is a urethane 'filler' piece that reinforces the stock mount (if mine's broken, I can probably get a new OEM one for free). There is also a redesigned mount that just offers a big solid disc of urethane. This seems like it might make vibration a little severe. I'd rather not mess with the other (load bearing) mounts unless I have to. I don't abuse the car off the line, just hard cornering and occasionally some high-revving at speed.

I've fallen into the the 'ooh let's change everything' trap before, and for a daily driver, I've learned to try and avoid that. Hence no lowering, nothing that will make it super stiff. No 'short throw' shifters or anything that might make the car more prone to being harmed or even just fatigue me more. You get the picture.

So I'm hesitating to do much with the suspension. I was thinking rear bar only, probably running at the weakest setting. Just to get the car a little flatter with a little more turn-in. Maybe bushings and links at the front, but I don't think I want a heavier front bar. I dunno...on the fence there.

What does the Mazda crowd think of chassis stiffening or anything like that? I know that there is already a beefy 'strut brace' integrated into the car on the front. Dunno about the rear. More curious about the undercar braces. Does that stuff really do anything, or it just overkill on an econocar? A good driving econocar...but meh, I know what it is, and what not to try and make it.

 

[toronado97]

Miata has all my links already, dang. Phuch I'd go with some Koni Yellow springs and a Corksport sway bar to start off with. Probably set you back about 700 bucks but you should notice an immediate improvement in cornering stability and stance in general.

Edit: Oh yeah, and the Continental DWS I linked above as well, unless you live somewhere that gets absolutely no snow and not much rain, in which case I'd definitely spring for a more performance tire, but I like the utility of an all-weather tire.

 

[SearchMaster]

The F1 summers came stock on my Focus ST, I very well might replace them with those A/S F1s. I like the F1s but they just don't do well in the colder temps.

The aforementioned AS3's would be my other possibility. They've gotten good reviews on the ST forums. I don't need winter tires, just good performers that work well in 20-30 degree temps.

 

[JCH13]

I'm in the same boat as you with my MS3. It's my DD, and I don't want to compromise what comfort is there, but I do want to make it more fun to drive.

As for tires... you'll notice a big difference going to summer dedicated tires over all-seasons. I don't have much experience with all-seasons because I use summer/winter tires in each season.

2011 Mazda3i Sport...Grand...SV...Touring...or something. I can never remember how they were breaking down the models the year I bought my car. It's the highest trim level of the base engine, 5spd sedan. If that makes sense.

I really like the way this little car performs. Went out of factory warranty last month. I'm at about 30k and I've got MAYBE 4/32", probably less, left on my front tires. Little better on the rear.

I'll probably go ahead and replace the fronts soon, and then do the rears when it's time for a rotation. But anyhow, I basically just want to know what options I have for a tire with a reasonable life expectancy that is geared toward handling. The shop I work for normally carries Goodyear, but I can probably get whatever I want through local warehouses or Tirerack. Right now I'm at ~30k miles on the OEM 205/55/16 Bridgestone Turanzas. As much as I wanna call them junk...they work. They're gripping enough. With IIRC 280 treadwear, they should be, dammit.

I would've just gone for treadlife, but I'd really like to keep the car handling as good as it can while keeping a decent all-around all-season...sooo...recs?

I'm thinking maybe Eagle F1 and call it a day. Prob get the best price on them.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...WR6F1AAS&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

Beyond that, I want to make some MINOR handling and general 'driving pleasure' upgrades at some point. No aftermarket springs. No dampers, either. Just some stuff for stiffening, balance, reinforcement, ect. Things that won't drastically alter the car.

The first three likely things: A minor upgrade to the rear sway bar. A new torque mount for the engine (mine might already be ripped...shit design). Not for or from trying to drag launch or anything...just would like to stiffen it up a bit, and along with that, some shifter parts to take out some of the slack that has developed there. From there, I really can't come up with much that will enhance my driving experience...thoughts?

Thoughts:

Koni FSD dampers are the tits. And tits are awesome. They improved both comfort AND handling on my MS3, plus a lifetime warranty and cheaper than OEM shocks. At 30k yours are likely close to dead (hooray Mazda OEM shocks!) I know mine were.

I know you don't really want to do springs, but I've heard that using MazdaSpeed3 springs on a MZ3 have pretty good results with a very minor drop.

I have made a couple short-throw-shifter plates for my MS3, and settled on one that a I like combined with a lighter shift weight. Made shifting a lot more fun. Also did shifter bushings too, but they didn't help as much as the STS and shift weight. I also took a section (~1in) out of the shift lever itself and angled it slightly rearward to put it right where I wanted it. All of this made shifting a lot more fun and precise. Never missed a 2-3 shift since (a noticeable but not serious issue if you drive your MS3 hard).

I definitely want to do the shifter bushings. Was hoping someone had done the lower torque mount on their car and could rec the best solution there, but I may just have to dig in to the Mazda forums. I know there is a urethane 'filler' piece that reinforces the stock mount (if mine's broken, I can probably get a new OEM one for free). There is also a redesigned mount that just offers a big solid disc of urethane. This seems like it might make vibration a little severe. I'd rather not mess with the other (load bearing) mounts unless I have to. I don't abuse the car off the line, just hard cornering and occasionally some high-revving at speed.

I've fallen into the the 'ooh let's change everything' trap before, and for a daily driver, I've learned to try and avoid that. Hence no lowering, nothing that will make it super stiff. No 'short throw' shifters or anything that might make the car more prone to being harmed or even just fatigue me more. You get the picture.

So I'm hesitating to do much with the suspension. I was thinking rear bar only, probably running at the weakest setting. Just to get the car a little flatter with a little more turn-in. Maybe bushings and links at the front, but I don't think I want a heavier front bar. I dunno...on the fence there.

What does the Mazda crowd think of chassis stiffening or anything like that? I know that there is already a beefy 'strut brace' integrated into the car on the front. Dunno about the rear. More curious about the undercar braces. Does that stuff really do anything, or it just overkill on an econocar? A good driving econocar...but meh, I know what it is, and what not to try and make it.

I did the TRZ lower engine mount. A bit more vibes, but rock solid and keeps my intercooler from smashing into the back-side of my hood. I felt it helped with shifting feel too since it keeps the engine much more stationary.

I would vote rear bar only too, if for the only reason that it's supposed to be a zillion times easier to install.

I have little experience with chassis stiffening, but many reviews say that they help a lot. Check our Corksport, they are well-regarded in this area.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

If you gotta use all season Conti DWS is very good. Koni yellows and a rear bar would really elevate an already good handling car into nearly track ready without ruining the ride.

 

[JCH13]

If you gotta use all season Conti DWS is very good. Koni yellows and a rear bar would really elevate an already good handling car into nearly track ready without ruining the ride.

Why would you use the Koni Yellow vs an FSD?

OP: it's Koni's annual spring sale... never a better time to buy...

 

[phucheneh]

JCH, you're a douche.

Complete Kit
2100 4037
Retail Price: $1,114.00
KONI online Price:$835.50
KONI Sale Price: $626.63 per kit

That is really tempting and I hate you for it.

How long does the sale price last?

 

[JCH13]

JCH, you're a douche.



That is really tempting and I hate you for it.

How long does the sale price last?

:awe:

End of may.

Go on TireRack and look up the FSD kit. For my 2009 MS3, which is probably the same chassis as yours, is like $580 or something like that for all four struts/shocks. The Koni Yellows will run a few bucks cheaper than that too.

Also found the drawings and models I made for my short-throw shifter project... If you wanted a custom one I'm sure I could work something out.

 

[phucheneh]

The MS3 kit is different- I remember looking these things up when you put them on your car. They did not yet offer a kit for the NA 2.0/2.5 cars. Surely the fitment is the same, but I'm thinking the difference is in the ride height...just shorter pistons, maybe? Maybe some all-around tweaks to the valving to complement the stiffer springs.

The FSD kit for my car specifically states 'stock ride height only.' I'm guessing they recommend yellows with aftermarket springs.

I'd really like to avoid aftermarket springs, to include upgrading to MS3's. It is possible that my bias against spring mods is colored by crappy kits that were more a victim of their cheap dampers than actually having springs that were too stiff...but regardless, I'd like to keep all my ride height.

Oh, and as far as summer tires- unfortunately, counter-intuitive as it may seem, summer tires are a really bad idea in Tennessee. While it's somewhere between 'comfortable' and 'hot as ungodly hell' for most of the year, we do have a winter which means definite driving in ~25-35* temps. Sometimes a lot lower...we had some single digit highs this winter. So we're in that awkward area where no sane person would bother with snow tires, but not having all-seasons is a bad idea.

 

[phucheneh]

I'm interested in seeing your shifter, also. I dunno that I would actually mod mine for any reason other than to decrease slop (and even then, it's quite tight for a FWD shifter)...but if it's not much trouble, I'm curious to see what you did.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

Why would you use the Koni Yellow vs an FSD?
.

I don't think the FSD's are adjustable. The yellows are. I have no knowledge or experience with the FSD's so can't really comment beyond that. The yellows I've used on a couple cars and can say from my, and others experience that they are outstanding for both street and autocross.

 

[JCH13]

You're right, the MS3 has a different damper shaft length, or spring perch, or something like that. I'd strongly encourage an upgrade to the MS3 springs, MazdaSpeed did a really good job designing the MS3 suspension upgrades IMO. Way better than your average lowering spring kit. Don't rule it out on prejudice, however well-earned the prejudice is (and I've had some really shitty aftermarket springs before).

Maybe go summers and all-seasons? In Colorado, where snow is a possibility at least 10 months a year, my parents use all-seasons and winters.

If you just want one set of tires, which is perfectly reasonable, I'd look at these two groups of tires. Real hard to argue with quantifiable tests from TireRack, and I've never been disappointed when following TR test results.

Value-Priced Ultra High Performance All-Season Tires

Top-End All-Season Tires

 

[phucheneh]

$591 for the FSD's at TireRack...DAMMIT that's a good deal. As a comparison, KYB GR-2's...what I would consider a good high-value shock, but only as a stock replacement, NOT an upgrade...are about $350. The lifetime warranty on the Konis really cements them in as a 'you'd be dumb to buy anything else' decision.

So...order a set of FSD's before the end of May...Corksport rear sway bar at some point...new torque mount...that should be quite a noticeable difference without any real downside other than a little more engine vibration. And I've already noticed an increase from when the car was new, leading me to suspect that replacing that crappy worn-out mount will probably not make it much worse.

edit: Those tire links...meh, to me, they're just saying 'all these things are about even.' The top 3 contenders for tires were already the Eagle F1's, the AS3's, and the Potenza RE970's. Not a Conti fan but I'll add the ExtremeContacts to my list.

The 'value' tires...meh. Not much value, IMO. It figures that entry-level Goodyears and Bridgestones would be on-par with higher-end Hankooks. Frankly, I don't want either. Even if they perform on a skidpad or in a slalom and seem to be behave well when new...you're more likely to get a 'bad' (lots of runout and/or imbalance) tire out of the gate, and then they tend to be more prone to developing problems as time goes on. With the Michelins, I have confidence that they won't get louder or less sticky as they wear.

Not to mention more serious issues like tread separation...unsurprisingly, when I see tires really go tits up for no discernible reason, they are always 'off-brand' (if Korean tires can still be considered such) or low-end, value-priced tires from someone like Goodyear or Bridgestone. I gotta think that it just comes down to different manufacturing processes or quality control...I wonder if the low-end Goodyears are made overseas somewhere. Wouldn't be surprised. OTOH, I'm heavily leaning towards Michelin because of the remarkable lack of issues I've seen with their tires over the years. 99% of cars needing Michelins replaced, need them because the tread is worn. Worn evenly, at that. Less screwy wear patterns, not a single slipped belt that I can recall, ect.

 

[JCH13]

Yuuup. Same conclusion I arrived at.

Would be worth asking CorkSport if this mount insert would fit a normal 3. Less-expensive option that a lot of people swear by, and you don't need a super-serious RMM like a modded MS3 does.

 

[Kelvrick]

Really? The PSS is one of the most popular high performance summer tires these days. It's pretty much the new benchmark among non R compound performance tires.

Agreed. I think they're what a lot of performance summers are compared to.

I liked my continental DWS's on my daily drivers. Handled decently and handled water and some snow during my trips to Lake Tahoe. They are also very popular high performance all seasons on the subaru forums as well.

They squeal a lot when pushed though, especially when I took them to the track. I personally felt like my next pair of Hankook Ventus V4's did a better job. That really surprised me since they got ranked way below the DWS on the tirerack survey of UHP a/s.

 

[phucheneh]

Yuuup. Same conclusion I arrived at.

Would be worth asking CorkSport if this mount insert would fit a normal 3. Less-expensive option that a lot of people swear by, and you don't need a super-serious RMM like a modded MS3 does.

Nope, doesn't fit. But this one does. I think I mentioned it in the first post. I'll probably give it a try if they're popular- I thought most people just bought the solid urethane mounts.

RMM = rear motor mount? Isn't that what we're talking about?

edit: oh wait, I misinterpreted...you meant that insert would be good, albeit less capable of handling the power of the turbo cars. I was reading it as 'this torque mount doesn't require a special rear motor mount.' These cars only have two load bearing mounts, right? 'Front' (pass side) and 'trans' (driver side)?

The stock torque mount (what I've always called a mount that doesn't carry weight) is awful. I know a guy with a '12 or '13 base 3, identical to my car, who took his to the dealer multiple times at <10k miles because his driveway is on a hill, and when he reverses up it, the engine side of the bracket hits the damn front subframe. Dealer said they've had multiple similar complaints and no solution to offer.

 

[JCH13]

Nope, doesn't fit. But this one does. I think I mentioned it in the first post. I'll probably give it a try if they're popular- I thought most people just bought the solid urethane mounts.

RMM = rear motor mount? Isn't that what we're talking about?

Bingo.

 

[npaladin-2000]

Regarding tires, the two best all-season options are the ContiExtremeContact DWS and the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S-3. The Contis are fantastic in snow, but a little bit squirmy when it comes to dry handling, due to the loose tread pattern. The Michelins are more like a summer tire that's got some winter functionality added in, but they're only good enough in snow to get you home from wherever you were going to be stuck. Don't go looking for trouble in them, if it's snowing, stay home. I've owned both, this has been my experience.

If you need to drive in snow, get the Contis. If you don't need to, get the Michelins.

 

[996GT2]

Regarding tires, the two best all-season options are the ContiExtremeContact DWS and the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S-3. The Contis are fantastic in snow, but a little bit squirmy when it comes to dry handling, due to the loose tread pattern. The Michelins are more like a summer tire that's got some winter functionality added in, but they're only good enough in snow to get you home from wherever you were going to be stuck. Don't go looking for trouble in them, if it's snowing, stay home. I've owned both, this has been my experience.

If you need to drive in snow, get the Contis. If you don't need to, get the Michelins.

How about noise? Is the Conti DWS quieter than the AS3? I'm going to be changing over to a set of the DWS or AS3 later this year, looking for opinions on treadwear, noise, etc.