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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
7,287
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I don't really see anyone criticizing Trump for his performance in the stock market, although many have correctly worked to point out that Trump's results are a continuance of a trend that started under Obama's presidency. Ultimately it's impossible to know the impact a President has on the economy in the near or long term, as there are so many contributors to it, and there is very large controversy regarding how even to measure it.

That said, I do think that Trump's administration deserves credit for contributing to our current economic strength. I think also that most of what he has done will cost us more in the future in impending corrections, in environmental damage, in capacity to prevent fraud, in income inequality, in regressive social attitude, etc.

But mostly Trump is bad for everything unrelated to economic performance.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
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I find it funny that people like Spidey continually demand that Trump be feted for continuing a trend in employment that preceded him by several years.

Congratulations?
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
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I find it funny that people like Spidey continually demand that Trump be feted for continuing a trend in employment that preceded him by several years.

Congratulations?

I think Obama doesn't get enough credit for turning around a bad situation he was handed from GWB. Obama played his part in making things better. But, if you think "2% growth is the new norm" Obama is responsible for this, you're mistaken, but you are mistaken about a lot in general, so that's not a surprise.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
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I think Obama doesn't get enough credit for turning around a bad situation he was handed from GWB. Obama played his part in making things better. But, if you think "2% growth is the new norm" Obama is responsible for this, you're mistaken, but you are mistaken about a lot in general, so that's not a surprise.
Somewhere around 2-3% growth is the new norm, this isn't exactly news as it's talking about sustained growth, not a couple quarters here or there. Did you think it was special when Obama hit similar numbers multiple times? If you think Trump getting 4% growth in a quarter after engaging in massive fiscal stimulus on a level greater than Obama engaged in in response to the great recession is special you're an idiot.
 
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SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
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Somewhere around 2-3% growth is the new norm, this isn't exactly news as it's talking about sustained growth, not a couple quarters here or there. Did you think it was special when Obama hit similar numbers multiple times? If you think Trump getting 4% growth in a quarter after engaging in massive fiscal stimulus on a level greater than Obama engaged in in response to the great recession is special you're an idiot.

Deregulating, consumer confidence way up, workforce participation ticking up, better trade deals secured... all unique Trump victories leading to a better today and tomorrow for you and I. Keep fighting the good fight, though. :)
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
126
In other news, 90% of workers are still making less than they did in 2007 in terms of real dollars.

Glad to see wages are starting to increase faster than inflation under Trump. Most of the years between now and 2007 were not Trump's time in office. Things are trending in the right direction.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
18,981
136
In other news, 90% of workers are still making less than they did in 2007 in terms of real dollars.
Remember how under Obama people would see similar jobs numbers and then point to poor wage growth as a sign the economy was still bad? They were right!

Ironically, wage growth was better during the last two years of Obama than it's been under Trump.

 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
126
You keep grasping at straws to try and pretend things are going poorly under Trump. My wages are up. Those I know are doing better. Jobs are everywhere, there are more jobs than candidates. There is big growth in the white collar section. If you're not making more money today than you were in 2007, it is probably your own fault. I know it is popular with the left today to expect everything handed to you and not earned.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
18,981
136
Glad to see wages are starting to increase faster than inflation under Trump. Most of the years between now and 2007 were not Trump's time in office. Things are trending in the right direction.
lol, I bet you wish you had waited to post this lie until after my graph.
 
Jan 25, 2011
15,998
7,380
146
I think Obama doesn't get enough credit for turning around a bad situation he was handed from GWB. Obama played his part in making things better. But, if you think "2% growth is the new norm" Obama is responsible for this, you're mistaken, but you are mistaken about a lot in general, so that's not a surprise.
Trump average right now is 2.57% per quarter. Obama average for 10 quarters prior to Trump is 2.56%.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,874
4,204
126
Glad to see wages are starting to increase faster than inflation under Trump. Most of the years between now and 2007 were not Trump's time in office. Things are trending in the right direction.
If you are in the 10% and expecially the sub-1% things are going swimmingly.
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
126
lol, I bet you wish you had waited to post this lie until after my graph.

Not one bit, it is just your desperate attempts to pretend things are going swimmingly in America under Trump's leadership. In less than two years in office he hasn't been able to wipe out all the negative trends that have been decades in the making, only some. He has six more years and early returns are very, very good. My retirement savings are up some 5% in the last three months, tell me how that's bad now, maybe with a graph. :D
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
18,981
136
You keep grasping at straws to try and pretend things are going poorly under Trump. My wages are up. Those I know are doing better. Jobs are everywhere, there are more jobs than candidates. There is big growth in the white collar section. If you're not making more money today than you were in 2007, it is probably your own fault. I know it is popular with the left today to expect everything handed to you and not earned.
I'm simply showing you the facts. If you're too emotionally fragile to handle them and want to start ranting like this and blaming other people that's fine. It doesn't change reality.
 

nOOky

Golden Member
Aug 17, 2004
1,760
525
136
I'll give him credit for not screwing it up too badly yet, we'll see how the tariff wars go. I'm actually in favor of re-examining our trade policies, and trying to kill China's theft of our intellectual property. I'm almost positive the tax cut helped, however we did not need the tax cut, and it will make correcting things more difficult when things reverse (and they will) because we can't just keep cutting taxes when they are already so low.

Intangibles I see are that the relaxation of environmental regulations will not make our standard of living higher, things will only get worse. Real wage growth sux, people are not saving any extra money they are making, they are just buying more useless crap. Of course the rich and super rich are happy as clams, while on the horizon "entitlement" programs are already being targeted for cuts. I'm not sure about most of you, but I have been paying into SS my entire life. Hopefully they don't start messing with 401k's like there was talk of months ago, i.e. taking out taxes at inception instead of after for a short term boost.

If DJT gets a second term he will almost definitely have to deal with a normal cyclic economic downturn, and I wonder how his base will handle that. Must have been someone else's fault I suppose.
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
126
Didn't Trump claim similar number under Obama were fake? Trump claimed unemployment was 25-40% before he took over. Meh.
Under Obama workforce participation ticked down, under Trump it is ticking up and the measured unemployment is lower. I never once claimed Obama's numbers were fake. I think Obama did decently, I've expressed this numerous times on this forum, Trump is elevating things to the next level though.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
18,981
136
Not one bit, it is just your desperate attempts to pretend things are going swimmingly in America under Trump's leadership. In less than two years in office he hasn't been able to wipe out all the negative trends that have been decades in the making, only some. He has six more years and early returns are very, very good. My retirement savings are up some 5% in the last three months, tell me how that's bad now, maybe with a graph. :D
That's odd, just a few posts earlier you claimed he did wipe out that negative trend. It turns out it actually got worse under him. Oops.
 

SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
998
126
I'll give him credit for not screwing it up too badly yet, we'll see how the tariff wars go. I'm actually in favor of re-examining our trade policies, and trying to kill China's theft of our intellectual property. I'm almost positive the tax cut helped, however we did not need the tax cut, and it will make correcting things more difficult when things reverse (and they will) because we can't just keep cutting taxes when they are already so low.

Intangibles I see are that the relaxation of environmental regulations will not make our standard of living higher, things will only get worse. Real wage growth sux, people are not saving any extra money they are making, they are just buying more useless crap. Of course the rich and super rich are happy as clams, while on the horizon "entitlement" programs are already being targeted for cuts. I'm not sure about most of you, but I have been paying into SS my entire life. Hopefully they don't start messing with 401k's like there was talk of months ago, i.e. taking out taxes at inception instead of after for a short term boost.

If DJT gets a second term he will almost definitely have to deal with a normal cyclic economic downturn, and I wonder how his base will handle that. Must have been someone else's fault I suppose.
I think the tariffs are just Trump rocking the boat, and people shy away from making waves. I think this will end up well for America in the end, but there certainly is the possibility of it blowing up too. I hope Trump knows how to manage this situation, and so far so good, but it isn't over yet so too early to measure. But, China is hurting more than us from the tariffs, so hopefully they'll be negotiating a deal sooner than later. But despite the TDS stricken posters here that ignore reality and cling to talking points, it is a hard argument to make to say Trump is doing poorly when looking at the bottom line, how things are going under him.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
15,281
3,498
136
They must have upped his posting rates. This dribble is endless.
Must have been visualizing what's on his chin. I meant drivel.
 
Jan 25, 2011
15,998
7,380
146
Under Obama workforce participation ticked down, under Trump it is ticking up and the measured unemployment is lower. I never once claimed Obama's numbers were fake. I think Obama did decently, I've expressed this numerous times on this forum, Trump is elevating things to the next level though.
Labor participation in January of 2016 was 62.8. August of this year was 62.7. It hasn't really moved since 2014.



Next fallacy please.
 
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MooseNSquirrel

Platinum Member
Feb 26, 2009
2,561
286
126
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/03/us-markets-fresh-economic-data-in-focus.html

The sky is falling, the sky is falling! Looks like yet another record day. The Trump Derangement syndrome is strong here, now on to the comments claiming how bad things are under Trump. :)
Yep, the Obama economy keeps rolling despite an utterly incompetent administration with massive conflicts of interest running the federal government.

Theres a reason the world laughed at Trump, and why we do too!
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
70,181
18,981
136
Under Obama workforce participation ticked down, under Trump it is ticking up and the measured unemployment is lower. I never once claimed Obama's numbers were fake. I think Obama did decently, I've expressed this numerous times on this forum, Trump is elevating things to the next level though.
Labor force participation rate today is identical to what it was for the last two years under Obama.



It's not worse, it's just not any better. Any other stats you'd like to make up?
 
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