Manufacturing myths

[charrison]

linkage

It helps to keep in mind a few simple points. First, manufacturing is extremely cyclical. The manufacturing component of the U.S. industrial production index fell by 5.5 percent a year in 1974-75, then rose by 6.6 percent a year for the next four years. In 1980-82, manufacturing fell by 3.1 percent annually for three years, then rose by 4.8 percent a year for six years. Manufacturing then dropped 2 percent in 1991. What happened next?
While Mr. Uchitelle first began whining about manufacturing being "downsized," it actually grew by 5.3 percent a year from 1992 through 2000. Manufacturing then fell 4.1 percent in 2001 (the bottom of his "trend") but rose at a 6.1 percent pace during the first three quarters of last year. What has been unusual about U.S. manufacturing was not the inevitable recession in 2001 but the unusually long and strong expansion for the preceding eight years. About half of the unusually strong gains came from the manufacture of high-tech equipment, which is a lot more valuable than T-shirts.
The cyclical ups and downs of manufacturing are international, by the way, not national. Manufacturing started falling in August 2000 in Japan and Korea, followed by the United States a month later. When manufacturing falls, so do imports.

 

[Zebo]

It's all

's right Charrison. Yet another free trade cheap labor conservative asking you to ignore the 2 million manufacturing Jobs lost. "only 18% of our goods come from China" ..well that's 18% too much if there is one american unemployed if you ask me.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: Zebo
It's all

's right Charrison. Yet another free trade cheap labor conservative asking you to ignore the 2 million manufacturing Jobs lost. "only 18% of our goods come from China" ..well that's 18% too much if there is one american unemployed if you ask me.

Do you always attack people that have a different opinion. I thought this article had some insight to the current problems with manufacturing.

But since you ask, I beleive we should have a strong manufactering base. I think with the proper investment our workers can be the most productive in the world(as we are). However, I dont think our more skilled workers should be doing low skill jobs.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: Zebo
It's all

's right Charrison. Yet another free trade cheap labor conservative asking you to ignore the 2 million manufacturing Jobs lost. "only 18% of our goods come from China" ..well that's 18% too much if there is one american unemployed if you ask me.

Do you always attack people that have a different opinion. I thought this article had some insight to the current problems with manufacturing.

But since you ask, I beleive we should have a strong manufactering base. I think with the proper investment our workers can be the most productive in the world(as we are). However, I dont think our more skilled workers should be doing low skill jobs.

Sorry did'nt mean to attack but his article is BS IMO 2.7 million manufacturing Jobs have been lost in last 36 months. This is a fact. Hundreds of stories daily about plants moving to China, India and Mexico at our workers expense. Well... they keep the formen on long enough to train their replacements. But still we are hurting, money is flowing out of our enonomy, we can't compete with slave labor wages. I'm really tired of these stories and understand nothing can be done to help these displaced workers without governemnt interventionism of some sort.

 

[LunarRay]

Another 400b negative trade deficit. Guess were buying more imported food than last year..

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: Zebo
It's all

's right Charrison. Yet another free trade cheap labor conservative asking you to ignore the 2 million manufacturing Jobs lost. "only 18% of our goods come from China" ..well that's 18% too much if there is one american unemployed if you ask me.

Do you always attack people that have a different opinion. I thought this article had some insight to the current problems with manufacturing.

But since you ask, I beleive we should have a strong manufactering base. I think with the proper investment our workers can be the most productive in the world(as we are). However, I dont think our more skilled workers should be doing low skill jobs.

Sorry did'nt mean to attack but his article is BS IMO 2.7 million manufacturing Jobs have been lost in last 36 months. This is a fact. Hundreds of stories daily about plants moving to China, India and Mexico at our workers expense. Well... they keep the formen on long enough to train their replacements. But still we are hurting, money is flowing out of our enonomy, we can't compete with slave labor wages. I'm really tired of these stories and understand nothing can be done to help these displaced workers without governemnt interventionism of some sort.

There is no doubt that during this recession manufactoring has been contracting, but in the last couple of months(according to ISM reports) this sector is starting to expand again. I have no doubt jobs are being exported, but not at 100s of plants daily.

As the economy picks back up, this sector will continue to expand.

 

[Zebo]

I know the sky is'nt falling charrison, But if we are having so many displaced workers I don't think the gonverment should allow this job transfer that's going on. The governemnt is supposed to protect and promote its citizens well being..not allow maximum profit for multinationals... and put them on welfare.

As far as 100's daily I don't know if this is accurate. But Dmcowen had a post where in Georgia alone in one week 5 plants closed and moved overseas. I read about them daily at least.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Another 400b negative trade deficit. Guess were buying more imported food than last year..

Huh? Try 900 billion. It was 488 for just the first 6 months.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: Zebo
I know the sky is'nt falling charrison, But if we are having so many displaced workers I don't think the gonverment should allow this job transfer that's going on. The governemnt is supposed to protect and promote its citizens well being..not allow maximum profit for multinationals... and put them on welfare.

As far as 100's daily I don't know if this is accurate. But Dmcowen had a post where in Georgia alone in one week 5 plants closed and moved overseas. I read about them daily at least.

One that he listed as closing was hayes, but they may have found themselves in the buggy whip(modem) industry.

But I agree there is much our goverment could do to encourage companies to stay open here.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Another 400b negative trade deficit. Guess were buying more imported food than last year..

Huh? Try 900 billion. It was 488 for just the first 6 months.

Yes, indeed it is... read the last para too fast.. Guess we bought a few computaters too along with the eel and other sea critters we import from Japan..

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Another 400b negative trade deficit. Guess were buying more imported food than last year..

Huh? Try 900 billion. It was 488 for just the first 6 months.

Yes, indeed it is... read the last para too fast.. Guess we bought a few computaters too along with the eel and other sea critters we import from Japan..

Why do you keep mentioning food? Hungry That's one of the products we actually EXPORT in surplus. We are talking about, cameras, electronics, tools, washer machines and other consumer goods which we make nothing anymore.

Took me 2 solid weeks to find an american made range

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: LunarRay
Another 400b negative trade deficit. Guess were buying more imported food than last year..

Huh? Try 900 billion. It was 488 for just the first 6 months.

Yes, indeed it is... read the last para too fast.. Guess we bought a few computaters too along with the eel and other sea critters we import from Japan..

Why do you keep mentioning food? Hungry That's one of the products we actually EXPORT in surplus. We are talking about, cameras, electronics, tools, washer machines and other consumer goods which we make nothing anymore.

Took me 2 solid weeks to find an american made range

Yeah... I know.. You need looking at my face when I post.. No one would eat an eel would they? Yuk!
Which brand and model was that? I'm gonna have to do that too.. we just got a GE dishwasher (not me but, ) I don't think any are fully mfg in US... at least to my knowledge.

 

[Red Dawn]

No one would eat an eel would they? Yuk!

It tastes great

 

[Moonbeam]

LR knows that the Moonbeam house consumes an eel or two a week. But they swim in from Taiwan, not Japan. The sticky rice is California grown. We got Lampreys but I don't eat those. Used to play with dead ones, though, on the Russian river, examine them with scientific interest, that is. He's thinking about food cause I threatened to drive down and take him out for some delicious fetal octopus. He's not exactly hungry as wondering what his stomach's gonna do when them octopuses try to climb out.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: Zebo
It's all

's right Charrison. Yet another free trade cheap labor conservative asking you to ignore the 2 million manufacturing Jobs lost. "only 18% of our goods come from China" ..well that's 18% too much if there is one american unemployed if you ask me.

Didn't you say in another thread that you agree with Edward Crane, founder of the Cato Institute, "95%" of the time, Zebo? Well he's for free trade, so I guess this is one of those 5% times, eh?

 

[todesengel]

In a free market economy like ours, the government does not play a role in which jobs are available or which jobs are retained; the consumer determines that.

Do you buy shoes at Payless shoes or at Marshall Field's? If you pay $30.00 for a pair of shoes at Payless instead of buying a $230.00 pair of shoes at a high-end retailer, you probably put an American out of work.

 

[todesengel]

I also think that goods made in China have a greater presence than what has been represented. When I bought toys for my kids last Christmas, almost everything came from Red China. That was not my preference, but it was very difficult to find anything made in the USA, no matter what it was.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: todesengel
In a free market economy like ours, the government does not play a role in which jobs are available or which jobs are retained; the consumer determines that.

Do you buy shoes at Payless shoes or at Marshall Field's? If you pay $30.00 for a pair of shoes at Payless instead of buying a $230.00 pair of shoes at a high-end retailer, you probably put an American out of work.

If you're still wearing them after three months you most likely didn't cause an American to lose a job.

 

[todesengel]

I don't follow your point.

 

[Moonbeam]

He means that if you're wearing them after three months you'r probably in a casket and dead. Americans still do the burrying. At least I think. Of course he could mean that if you're hungry for octopus after two hours you probably ate Chinese. And octopus shoe leather don't last too long.

 

[Moonbeam]

When people make shoes even the cows hide.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: todesengel
I don't follow your point.

I mean that if you buy foreign made stuff it is not crafted it is junk as far as I'm concerned... so you must have bought American.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
He means that if you're wearing them after three months you'r probably in a casket and dead. Americans still do the burrying. At least I think. Of course he could mean that if you're hungry for octopus after two hours you probably ate Chinese. And octopus shoe leather don't last too long.

They did the 'Mash' they did the 'Moonster Mash'..
Ma... he's doing it again... make him stop... I'm hungry and now my stomach is upset.. again..
I understand that at the MoonCommune they eat what they catch but at Chez La Beauf we eat regular burgers not foreign made wiggley things.. eeks.. yuk!

 

[JellyBaby]

From all I'm reading the loss of American manufacturing jobs is due to specific reasons like unchecked immigration and the free trade policies of the last decade or so. It may also be cyclical but look at the big picture: in the 50s, 33% of all jobs were in manufacturing. Today it's 12%. One in 7 manfacturing jobs have been lost since 2001.

A peice I read today stated our textile industry has moved to Mexico, the Carribean and the far East. Since NAFTA, 700,000 textile positions have vanished abroad.

Now the IT field is bleeding jobs overseas. Can anyone explain to me why the government H-1 visa programs, designed to allow temporary foreign works to be hired during shortages, still exists? There is no shortage of IT worker looking for jobs, hasn't been for a long damn time.

What are the politicans doing? Sometime in 2004 they think they'll reduce the number of H-1 visa type programs. Um, why aren't you eliminating the unncessary programs? You should have done it already. Talk about being out of touch. Likewise, Bush is only making noises about changing government policies to help American workers.

Think we may be finally hearing that Giant Sucking Sound Perot talked about 10 years ago?

 

[LunarRay]

He hears the sound of voters getting their booths ready to vote him out.