Man Wins Fight With Vicious Pit Bull

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BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: LuNoTiCK You guys don't understand anything about Pitt Bulls.

Like the name pit bull?

Originally posted by: LuNoTiCKThey aren't as bad as the media would have you believe, and honestly real pitt bulls aren't really supposed to be over 50 pounds, but sometimes you would have an anomaly, but never 80 pounds.

http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%201982%20to%202006%20Clifton.pdf

Yeah, clearly pit bulls aren't more dangerous than the other breeds. In reality, in cases where the dogs breed could be confirmed, pit bulls, Rottweilers, and Presa Canarios are responsible for 74% of dog attacks from 1982 - present. These dogs were bread to be aggressive, why would we expect anything less?

Some other interesting statistics...

61% of bites happen at home or a familiar place
77% of the biting dogs belong to the victim's family or friends

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanpitbull.htm

The weight ranges from 22-110 pounds for the American Pit Bull Terrier. Most fall between 35-55 lbs.


Originally posted by: LuNoTiCKThese are mutts that were bred for size that are attacking. If you look at the history a dog that fights the Pitt Bull dog should never attack a person, and if it does, the dog will be killed, it's too dangerous when people have to be in the ring with the dog. Look at the history. Also oftentimes it's not even Pitt Bulls that are attacking, but it gets misreported as being an American Bulldog or something else.

So we breed a dog to fight and kill other dogs and then think it's safe to have these animals in our back yards when we know they have a history of attacking people? Something doesn't seem safe about this.

I don't understand why people feel the need to defend this species. It was basically *designed* to be aggressive and to fight to the death. This may have been ok hundreds of years ago but do we really need this in our neighborhoods today? I'm not saying that every pit bull is a bad dog, but clearly there is a tendancy here. Why can't you just own a less aggressive species of dog? Do you HAVE to have a pit bull as opposed to a border collie or chocolate lab?

Listen, I'm a huge fan of personal liberties but in this case we have a situation where it is clear that pitbulls (along with two other breeds) are responsible for a majority of dog attacks. There is no *need* for us to have pit bulls around and it's not a protected right. I think in this case, it'd be wise for people to just quit breeding them and get more docile dogs that were meant for urban types of environments. That's all.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: Electric Amish
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?

Perfect comparison. Nothing like comparing apples to kiwi fruit. :roll:

I don't believe in a bad breed, just bad owners. I own a Pit Bull and I've NEVER seen an aggressive action from her. I would rather this dude have strangled the owner instead of the dog.

There's no such thing as a bad dog, just poorly trained owners.

Yeah, that's the same crap that everyone always says. Ask the owners of a dog that mauled someone if the dog was aggressive. See what they say. The dog isn't aggressive until it is.

Pit bulls might not be bad dogs but they are certainly dogs with tendancies. And a dog with those tendancies are more likely to exhibit violent behavior. I posted the facts in my other post. Clearly, pit bulls are more violent than other dogs. I refuse to believe that it's entirely because of bad owners. And I would imagine that bad owners own many different breeds of dogs. Yet, pit bulls are statistically more violent.
 

ryan256

Platinum Member
Jul 22, 2005
2,525
0
71
Originally posted by: n7
WTF are goddamn pit bulls still allowed to exist :frown:

wow... ignorant generalization FTL! I have 2 friends with pit bulls. Both dogs are well trained and well behaved. Never bitten anyone and even respond to a sit command from me; a person the dogs see maybe once every 6 months.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: ryan256
Originally posted by: n7
WTF are goddamn pit bulls still allowed to exist :frown:

wow... ignorant generalization FTL! I have 2 friends with pit bulls. Both dogs are well trained and well behaved. Never bitten anyone and even respond to a sit command from me; a person the dogs see maybe once every 6 months.

And how long did the Grizzly Man spend in close proximity to dozens of grizzly bears before he was eaten? Maybe that means I should keep grizzly bears in my back yard. Would you be ok with that?
 

ryan256

Platinum Member
Jul 22, 2005
2,525
0
71
Originally posted by: BigDH01
And how long did the Grizzly Man spend in close proximity to dozens of grizzly bears before he was eaten? Maybe that means I should keep grizzly bears in my back yard. Would you be ok with that?

Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.
 

Brutuskend

Lifer
Apr 2, 2001
26,558
4
0
Originally posted by: funkbass81
Originally posted by: us3rnotfound
Originally posted by: funkbass81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: mobobuff
Originally posted by: compuwiz1
Friggin pits. Ban the damn things already, either that, or exhile the idiots who don't qualify to own such a dog.

I don't know, I've seen some pretty docile pitts, they shouldn't be banned... they're good dogs when raised well. It's a tricky situation. Breeding probably has a lot to do with it.
they're all time bombs.

funny its been ten years and mine hasnt gone off yet. should i fear for my family? :roll:


btw, this past week my aunt spent some quality time in the hospital getting 25 stitches in her face because a lhasa apso decided to take a chunk out of it. lhasa apso, all 8 pounds of him.

lol wtf? those little furry critters? :laugh:

exactly. listening some of the hand-wringers on this boars, no other dog bites :roll:

The dog I own right now is, I'm pretty sure, half pit and my last dog was a quarter pit and he was the BEST DOG EVER. I'm a firm believer that there are few bad dogs out there, but MANY BAD DOG OWNERS.

I also believe that it's the smaller dogs that bite the most. they just don't get reported as much since they usually do little damage while Pit Bulls can do massive damage. Still the last statistics I read on dog bites put German Shepherds at the top followed by Shepherd mixes and Chows.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
 

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,713
12
56
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: ryan256
Originally posted by: BigDH01
And how long did the Grizzly Man spend in close proximity to dozens of grizzly bears before he was eaten? Maybe that means I should keep grizzly bears in my back yard. Would you be ok with that?

Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.

Really?

According to this study, pit bulls caused 104 fatalities in the US (pure pitballs, not muts) since 1982.

You know how many Americans have been killed since 1900 both brown and black bears combined (including grizzly bears)?

Here

About 102. That's since 1900. That's brown and black bears. If anything, it would seem that bears are less dangerous. But maybe you're right, pit bulls don't accidently kill people, they do so on purpose, and they do it more often than bears who do it either by purpose or accident.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

He made a horrible comparison.

Alligators and Tigers aren't domesticated. Dogs are.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

He made a horrible comparison.

Alligators and Tigers aren't domesticated. Dogs are.

Well someone should tell pit bulls because they kill more people than alligators do.
 

Electric Amish

Elite Member
Oct 11, 1999
23,578
1
0
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: ryan256
Originally posted by: BigDH01
And how long did the Grizzly Man spend in close proximity to dozens of grizzly bears before he was eaten? Maybe that means I should keep grizzly bears in my back yard. Would you be ok with that?

Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.

Really?

According to this study, pit bulls caused 104 fatalities in the US (pure pitballs, not muts) since 1982.

You know how many Americans have been killed since 1900 both brown and black bears combined (including grizzly bears)?

Here

About 102. That's since 1900. That's brown and black bears. If anything, it would seem that bears are less dangerous. But maybe you're right, pit bulls don't accidently kill people, they do so on purpose, and they do it more often than bears who do it either by purpose or accident.

The statistics provide false conclusions when you consider the population proximity.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

He made a horrible comparison.

Alligators and Tigers aren't domesticated. Dogs are.

Well someone should tell pit bulls because they kill more people than alligators do.

Again, bad comparison.

If there were as many alligators as pit bulls, and they lived in homes with people like pit bulls do, I bet it wouldn't even be a close comparison.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: Electric Amish
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: ryan256
Originally posted by: BigDH01
And how long did the Grizzly Man spend in close proximity to dozens of grizzly bears before he was eaten? Maybe that means I should keep grizzly bears in my back yard. Would you be ok with that?

Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.

Really?

According to this study, pit bulls caused 104 fatalities in the US (pure pitballs, not muts) since 1982.

You know how many Americans have been killed since 1900 both brown and black bears combined (including grizzly bears)?

Here

About 102. That's since 1900. That's brown and black bears. If anything, it would seem that bears are less dangerous. But maybe you're right, pit bulls don't accidently kill people, they do so on purpose, and they do it more often than bears who do it either by purpose or accident.

The statistics provide false conclusions when you consider the population proximity.


That's why I provided statistics that date back to 1900 when humans and bears lived in much closer quarters. You must also remember that people today still live in somewhat close proximity to bears. I've seen many in my life and have even been within 20 ft of one before in the wild. He was just coming to the camp to search the garbage.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

He made a horrible comparison.

Alligators and Tigers aren't domesticated. Dogs are.

Well someone should tell pit bulls because they kill more people than alligators do.

Again, bad comparison.

If there were as many alligators as pit bulls, and they lived in homes with people like pit bulls do, I bet it wouldn't even be a close comparison.


You're right. We can only compare pit bulls to other dogs. When we do this we see that THERE IS A PROBLEM. Statistically, pit bulls do more damage than other dogs. You should read that study that I posted. Do you still believe it is entirely caused by bad owners?
 

Rock Hydra

Diamond Member
Dec 13, 2004
6,466
1
0
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

Not really. How can you compare an animal with centuries of domesticated traits to a wild one ? While I do agree, that Pitt Bulls can be quite vicious, I think you can raise them well to be decent. Just like people, raise them well, they turn out to be decent people, don't raise them well and they can grow up to be "wild animals", with some exceptions of course, same with Pitt Bulls.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: datalink7
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

A alligator or tiger isn't the world oldest domesticated animal.

A dog is.

oh burn.
geeee, ur smart. :confused:

he made a great comparison. he was speaking of *inborn* traits which apply to any animal.

He made a horrible comparison.

Alligators and Tigers aren't domesticated. Dogs are.

Well someone should tell pit bulls because they kill more people than alligators do.

Again, bad comparison.

If there were as many alligators as pit bulls, and they lived in homes with people like pit bulls do, I bet it wouldn't even be a close comparison.


You're right. We can only compare pit bulls to other dogs. When we do this we see that THERE IS A PROBLEM. Statistically, pit bulls do more damage than other dogs. You should read that study that I posted. Do you still believe it is entirely caused by bad owners?

Entirely caused by bad owners? I never claimed that. Certainly some dogs are more aggressive than others.

But it is the fault of bad owners and breeders. I've worked with over a hundred pit bulls in my life and I have yet to meet a bad one. I know they can be good dogs and be trained because I've done it. They just need responsible owners who know what kind of a dog they are getting and what kind of training is needed.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: Rock Hydra
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: Jeff7
Originally posted by: MBrown
Its not the dog. Its the owner + breeder.

So I could take an alligator egg, raise the baby from the time it hatched, and it'd be perfectly safe as a pet?
How about a tiger's kitten?
oh burn.

Not really. How can you compare an animal with centuries of domesticated traits to a wild one ? While I do agree, that Pitt Bulls can be quite vicious, I think you can raise them well. Just like people, raise them well, they turn out to be pretty decent people, don't raise them well and they grow up to be wild animals, and IMO people are worse than Pitt Bulls.


Don't forget that these centuries of domestication include breeding and training for dog fighting. Not exactly the domestic animal I'd want to own. They've been breed for aggressiveness.

I do agree that humans are worse, but you don't see me wanting to keep a Ted Bundy in my back yard. The fact is, pit bulls are more likely to be aggressive and to kill or maul a human. The stats bear this out.
 

ryan256

Platinum Member
Jul 22, 2005
2,525
0
71
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: ryan256
Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.

Really?

According to this study, pit bulls caused 104 fatalities in the US (pure pitballs, not muts) since 1982.

You know how many Americans have been killed since 1900 both brown and black bears combined (including grizzly bears)?

Here

About 102. That's since 1900. That's brown and black bears. If anything, it would seem that bears are less dangerous. But maybe you're right, pit bulls don't accidently kill people, they do so on purpose, and they do it more often than bears who do it either by purpose or accident.

And how common are pit bulls as opposed to bears? How often do people come on contact with pit bulls VS bears. How many non-zoo bears are kept in suburbs or inner cities?
Lets look at your figures:
For pit bulls- 104 deaths : 25 years = 4.16 deaths per year
For bears - 102 deaths : 107 years = 0.95 deaths per year

So the ratio of deaths caused by pit bulls VS bears is 4.36:1 per year. I'm willing to bet the contact rate of humans between pit bulls VS bears is somewhere around 1:100+ per year. An animal which has +100x more contact with humans causes 4.36x more deaths. Hmmm.......
 

RapidSnail

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2006
4,258
0
0
Originally posted by: brandonbull
Yeah beacuse you hear all the time about wild pugs attacking a small kid in the neighborhood.

ROFL!!! That just created the funniest mental image :D.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91

Originally posted by: datalink7
Entirely caused by bad owners? I never claimed that. Certainly some dogs are more aggressive than others.

But it is the fault of bad owners and breeders. I've worked with over a hundred pit bulls in my life and I have yet to meet a bad one. I know they can be good dogs and be trained because I've done it. They just need responsible owners who know what kind of a dog they are getting and what kind of training is needed.

And the dog's breed. There is no doubt there are bad owners of every dog breed. Yet, you don't see huge (relatively) bite and murder rates from these dogs. It's great that you've never met a bad pit bull, but maybe you should tell that to the families of the 104 pit bull fatality victims since 1982.

Listen, I know you love dogs and you love pit bulls. It's a shame it has to be like this but people aren't very responsible. And it's obvious that pit bulls can be very dangerous when they have irresponsible owners (and I'm sure responsible owners have also had their pit bulls attack others). As attacks increase, it won't be long until pit bulls are banned. They are simply naturally too aggressive for most to keep them. It's already starting to happen. You may like them but others see them as a hazard, and I agree. Like I said, I lived next to a pit bull and he was a dangerous dog, which my mom found out the hard way. He was a nice dog until one day he wasn't. And the dog had the strength and aggressiveness to take it all the way if it hadn't had been for the owner and the owner's son being there to pull the dog off.

I don't want another pit bull in my neighborhood and I certainly wouldn't want a pit bull in the neighborhood if I had kids. I'm sure I'm not alone on this and the laws will get more strict until pit bulls are gone. I'm sure you can learn to love another breed of dog.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Let me give out a quick example.

You get a Golden Retriever. Keep it locked in the garage all the time. Don't give it barely any attention except when you want to amuse yourself by throwing it a ball every now and again. When it annoys you, you kick it. Never take it for walks.

You'll probably get a scared, submissive dog.

You get a Pit Bull. Keep it locked in the garage all the time. Don't give it barely any attention except when you want to amuse yourself by throwing it a ball every now and again. When it annoys you, you kick it. Never take it for walks.

You'll probably get an aggressive dog.

Different dogs react differently to bad owners. But more aggressive breeds can be perfectly good dogs under good ownership. 99% of the time it is bad owners who are at fault for raising their dog wrongly.
 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,630
82
91
Originally posted by: ryan256
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: ryan256
Sorry.. a comparison between a potentially dangerous 90 pound animal and a potentially dangerous 400 pound animal is a bad comparison. A bear can inflict injury and kill even if its not meaning to.

Really?

According to this study, pit bulls caused 104 fatalities in the US (pure pitballs, not muts) since 1982.

You know how many Americans have been killed since 1900 both brown and black bears combined (including grizzly bears)?

Here

About 102. That's since 1900. That's brown and black bears. If anything, it would seem that bears are less dangerous. But maybe you're right, pit bulls don't accidently kill people, they do so on purpose, and they do it more often than bears who do it either by purpose or accident.

And how common are pit bulls as opposed to bears? How often do people come on contact with pit bulls VS bears. How many non-zoo bears are kept in suburbs or inner cities?
Lets look at your figures:
For pit bulls- 104 deaths : 25 years = 4.16 deaths per year
For bears - 102 deaths : 107 years = 0.95 deaths per year

So the ratio of deaths caused by pit bulls VS bears is 4.36:1 per year. I'm willing to bet the contact rate of humans between pit bulls VS bears is somewhere around 1:100+ per year. An animal which has +100x more contact with humans causes 4.36x more deaths. Hmmm.......

Like I said before, in 1900 there was a great deal more contact. For non-city dwellers there is contact up to this day. I've lived next door to a pit bull that bit my mother. I lived in Colorado and had a black bear come and go through the trash every night. I used to walk home late at night in Colorado. Number of pit bull attacks for me = 1. Number of bear attacks for me = 0.