Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger is out.

[Goosemaster]

Originally posted by: CorporateRecreation

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Spotlight - A Windows Longhorn feature stolen from WinFS. (Though this feature has been dropped due to utter worthlessness and the fact that it's a VERY not-good idea to base a secure filesystem on an SQL database running a slimmed down version of a server with security flaws in it's past)

Automator - AppleScript Reloaded.

Dashboard - Sounds nifty, but frankly, 90% of that stuff won't ever be used. Tile game is CLASSIC mac stuff. I remember Apple's little games from System 7. r0x. Dictionary, phone book, the games, world clock (does anyone even know how to read an analog clock these days?), translator, flight tracker, and unit converter look to be fairly useless. Those of us who use stuff like that on a regular basis already have ourselves trained to insta-google. Stickies are from System 7.

Expose - This is an extension of a Windows 95 feature that nobody ever used BECAUSE IT SUCKED. It still exists in XP, by the way. Right click on your taskbar and choose "Tile Windows Vertically" or, alternatively, Horizontally. The idea of having them automatically maximize is much better than the way MS implemented it, but it's still a total PITA, because even on MASSIVE screen resolutions, you still can't tell WTF is in each window unless you singletask. Also, most multitasking users only do one thing at any given moment. Personally, almost all my windows are maximized, and just stacked on top of each other. When I need to do something else, I change windows. Woot?

Fast User Switching - IIRC, this was introduced in 10.3. *cough*WinXP*cough*

Inkwell - Microsoft's hardware model requires this kind of thing be the domain of the drivers, and thus the hardware manufacturers, but MS successfully implemented this in the OS for their PocketPC's years ago.

Speech recognition - Pretty damned worthless, unless Apple came up with some kind of AMAZING breakthrough, it totally sucks.

Text to speech - CLASSIC mac. System 6 in SimpleText, System 8 full implementation on some systems. If I'm not mistaken, WinXP's accessability package includes this as well.

VoiceOver - combination WinXP accessability controls, remote administration (NT4! NT4! NT4!)

Reality distortion field in full effect. Virtually none of this is new, and even less of it is Apple in origin.

LMAO!!! I'm not even going to bother justifying this with a proper response.

 

[thirdlegstump]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Can someone PLEASE name a USEFUL feature that has been added to OSX, and *EXPLAIN WTF IT DOES*? I hear you lamers throwing around cute little feature names that are completely and totally generic and those of us who aren't "hip" enough have NFI what you're talking about.

It's supposed to be slightly faster than Panther so if you have a slower G4, it'll feel a bit snappier. I noticed quite a bit of difference when going from Jaguar to Panther so I'm hoping Tiger will be the same. My Macs are never fast enough so bring it on!

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: Goosemaster

Originally posted by: CorporateRecreation

Originally posted by: EyeMWing
Spotlight - A Windows Longhorn feature stolen from WinFS. (Though this feature has been dropped due to utter worthlessness and the fact that it's a VERY not-good idea to base a secure filesystem on an SQL database running a slimmed down version of a server with security flaws in it's past)

Automator - AppleScript Reloaded.

Dashboard - Sounds nifty, but frankly, 90% of that stuff won't ever be used. Tile game is CLASSIC mac stuff. I remember Apple's little games from System 7. r0x. Dictionary, phone book, the games, world clock (does anyone even know how to read an analog clock these days?), translator, flight tracker, and unit converter look to be fairly useless. Those of us who use stuff like that on a regular basis already have ourselves trained to insta-google. Stickies are from System 7.

Expose - This is an extension of a Windows 95 feature that nobody ever used BECAUSE IT SUCKED. It still exists in XP, by the way. Right click on your taskbar and choose "Tile Windows Vertically" or, alternatively, Horizontally. The idea of having them automatically maximize is much better than the way MS implemented it, but it's still a total PITA, because even on MASSIVE screen resolutions, you still can't tell WTF is in each window unless you singletask. Also, most multitasking users only do one thing at any given moment. Personally, almost all my windows are maximized, and just stacked on top of each other. When I need to do something else, I change windows. Woot?

Fast User Switching - IIRC, this was introduced in 10.3. *cough*WinXP*cough*

Inkwell - Microsoft's hardware model requires this kind of thing be the domain of the drivers, and thus the hardware manufacturers, but MS successfully implemented this in the OS for their PocketPC's years ago.

Speech recognition - Pretty damned worthless, unless Apple came up with some kind of AMAZING breakthrough, it totally sucks.

Text to speech - CLASSIC mac. System 6 in SimpleText, System 8 full implementation on some systems. If I'm not mistaken, WinXP's accessability package includes this as well.

VoiceOver - combination WinXP accessability controls, remote administration (NT4! NT4! NT4!)

Reality distortion field in full effect. Virtually none of this is new, and even less of it is Apple in origin.

LMAO!!! I'm not even going to bother justifying this with a proper response.

What? I read Apple's descriptions, thought back to random crap of the past, and posted it. Doublecheck anything I said, you'll find it to be true.

 

[hevnsnt]

EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: hevnsnt
EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

Being the former owner of *14* macs, most of them secondhand... It's cool at first. Nothing compared to the positive ownage that System 7.5 was over Win95 and 3.x. System 8 was okay. System 9 was a "WTF is the point of that" scenario. To this day, I'm not sure what OS9 had that 8 didn't. OSX... Well, about that time I took a serious look at the inventory and chose Win98SE as the superior platform. By OS10.2, I'd transitioned to 2k/XP. 10.4, X64, XP, 2k3 Enterprise, FreeBSD, Linux.

I now have exactly 2 macs in my inventory; my original, and a Centris 610 that I grabbed out of a dumpster this past weekend and am going to salvage the 68020 from. With Marathon now freeware and ported to Windows, there's no reason to maintain anything else. I still use other people's newer models daily, but have never, ever felt that it would be even remotely worth the price of entry to get back in.

Oh, and OSX is solid just like XP is solid. Thing is, XP is much easier for a moron to break than OSX is (though I *HAVE* seen an instance where it did happen, and it did happen to a hardcore mac-nazi who'd been with the company since the Apple ][e)

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: hevnsnt
EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

He isn't saying it's not...he's just saying that none of the "new" things in the latest version of X are astounding innovations.

And none of the mac zealots can say that he's wrong.

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: hevnsnt
EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

He isn't saying it's not...he's just saying that none of the "new" things in the latest version of X are astounding innovations.

And none of the mac zealots can say that he's wrong.

I get the feeling I need to boot some old crap up and take some screenshots. Of course, that'd be wasted effort anyway, since the zealots would do just like they did above and "not justify that with a response".

 

[Platypus]

lol, keep trying

 

[FreshPrince]

iChat looks sweet, I might get a macmini just to use iChat

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: CorporateRecreation
lol, keep trying

Trying what? What exactly was unsatisfactory with my above post? I went through Apple's own featurelist. Do you want PROOF?

Oh, and I was mistaken re: Expose and the Tile feature. This dates back to Windows 3.x, IF NOT 1 AND 2.

 

[Legendary]

Originally posted by: EyeMWing

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: hevnsnt
EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

He isn't saying it's not...he's just saying that none of the "new" things in the latest version of X are astounding innovations.

And none of the mac zealots can say that he's wrong.

I get the feeling I need to boot some old crap up and take some screenshots. Of course, that'd be wasted effort anyway, since the zealots would do just like they did above and "not justify that with a response".

From what little I know about OSX, I know for a fact that your comparison between Expose and the Tile Windows feature in Windows 3.1+ (edit: changed from 9x to 3.1) is completely off base. Expose are three one-button features that are actually useful. Apple explains it better than I do:
http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/expose/

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: Legendary

Originally posted by: EyeMWing

Originally posted by: jagec

Originally posted by: hevnsnt
EyeMWing: I would have agreed with you in the past...

But then I got my minimac. Damn I love the thing. This was my first mac ever, and hell I used to make fun of mac people, but OSX is a very SOLID OS.

He isn't saying it's not...he's just saying that none of the "new" things in the latest version of X are astounding innovations.

And none of the mac zealots can say that he's wrong.

I get the feeling I need to boot some old crap up and take some screenshots. Of course, that'd be wasted effort anyway, since the zealots would do just like they did above and "not justify that with a response".

From what little I know about OSX, I know for a fact that your comparison between Expose and the Tile Windows feature in Windows 3.1+ (edit: changed from 9x to 3.1) is completely off base. Expose are three one-button features that are actually useful. Apple explains it better than I do:
http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/expose/

Note my phrasing; it's an extension of. More appropriately, it's a combination of that feature, some taskbar features, alt-tab/ctrl-tab, and the show desktop button that sits on the quicklaunch by default, plus a little bit of Apple showy mojo and automatic maximization. Apple, thereby, saves you a doubleclick and makes it look pretty.

 

[thirdlegstump]

I still don't like Expose.

 

[imported_Lucifer]

I have grown attached to expose. I use it a lot.

 

[mobobuff]

Getting any work done on Macs with OSX(X) is a major pain in the ass. Unless of course you have 2 gigs of RAM, then they MIGHT run at about the speed of 512MB on a PC.

I've worked daily with InDesign, Photoshop, Illustrator, Safari, iPhoto and iMovie all across the OSX platform, and all of the functions could have been executed 5 times faster and with less complications (spinning pinwheel of death) when performed on a PC.

I actually decided to compare an OOTB eMac running Panther with 512MB and an old PC with 128MB running 2K. The PC loaded Photoshop 6.0 8 seconds faster than the eMac, came to a full boot+login 15 seconds faster, and came to a full shutdown 7 seconds faster. Oh, and IE loaded pages ~5 seconds faster than Safari

Also, if you need a search function with that many features... you have more serious issues on hand (like remembering where the hell you put your stuff, and some poor organization skills). If you had a list of every file on my computer, and just randomly listed them, I could tell you instantly where each file is located, complete directory listing and everything.

 

[Eug]

Of course, boot and load times are largely dependent on the hard drive, and are pretty much irrelevant to overall work time, unless you only ever run one app at a time (which I guess you'd have to with only 512 MB or less).

I usually recommend 2 GB or more RAM for a pro Photoshop, InDesign, Illustrator setup, whether it's Mac OS X or Windows.

Originally posted by: Eug

Originally posted by: Goosemaster
quartz xtreme says a 16MB card it'll probably work.....this is a nice marketing scheme...sell the minis..and then call them in for an upgrade. Very smart.

Quartz Extreme showed up in 10.2 Jaguar. The Mac mini supports this.

Quartz 2D Extreme showed up in 10.4 Tiger. The Mac mini does not support this.

However, like I said, the Mac mini will work fine with Tiger. Tiger on the mini will be as fast as with Panther, if not faster.

OTOH, Tiger will run faster than Panther on machines with shader 2 compliant GPUs.

ie: Re: Speeds:

iBook 10.4 >= 10.3
Mac mini 10.4 >= 10.3
Current iMac 10.4 > 10.3
Current PowerBook 10.4 > 10.3
Power Mac with X800 10.4 >> 10.3

It looks like I'm wrong. Quartz 2D Extreme is turned off by default in Tiger apparently. So, those X800 machines won't get as much GPU acceleration as they could, unless you actually install the developer tools and specifically turn Quartz 2D Extreme on. However, the machines with Shader 2.0 video cards still get GPU support for stuff like Core Image (which is a totally different thing).

 

[EyeMWing]

Originally posted by: mobobuff
Getting any work done on Macs with OSX(X) is a major pain in the ass. Unless of course you have 2 gigs of RAM, then they MIGHT run at about the speed of 512MB on a PC.

I've worked daily with InDesign, Photoshop, Illustrator, Safari, iPhoto and iMovie all across the OSX platform, and all of the functions could have been executed 5 times faster and with less complications (spinning pinwheel of death) when performed on a PC.

I actually decided to compare an OOTB eMac running Panther with 512MB and an old PC with 128MB running 2K. The PC loaded Photoshop 6.0 8 seconds faster than the eMac, came to a full boot+login 15 seconds faster, and came to a full shutdown 7 seconds faster. Oh, and IE loaded pages ~5 seconds faster than Safari

Also, if you need a search function with that many features... you have more serious issues on hand (like remembering where the hell you put your stuff, and some poor organization skills). If you had a list of every file on my computer, and just randomly listed them, I could tell you instantly where each file is located, complete directory listing and everything.

:beer: You said it like I never could. But be prepared for "OMG THE G5 IS SO MUCH FASTERRRRR!!!!!!!"

 

[JASANITY]

My Brother is on the internet stocking Tiger!
links:
http://apnews.myway.com/image/20050427/...S107_20050427201946.html?date=20050428
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/04/29/BUGO7CH2751.DTL

Also if you are intersted he is on TV too on a show called stirtv.com