Louisiana passes first antievolution "academic freedom" law

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torpid

Lifer
Sep 14, 2003
11,631
11
76
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

You conveniently edited out the first sentence in that paragraph. Here's the full relevant text:

The word theory has many distinct meanings in different fields of knowledge, depending on their methodologies and the context of discussion.

In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet, and the theories commonly used to describe and explain this behavior are Newton's theory of universal gravitation (see also gravitation), and the general theory of relativity.

In common usage,
the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements. True descriptions of reality are more reflectively understood as statements which would be true independently of what people think about them.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,226
5,803
126
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you knuckle-dragers seem to forget that.
God and the supporting religious thought are just theories.

I don't think they even approach that level.
 

bryanW1995

Lifer
May 22, 2007
11,144
32
91
Originally posted by: Citrix
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you people seem to forget that.

Sarcasm Detector 0/10

Darwin damn it. How many times have people made this stupid argument and been corrected about it? Enough times that such a statement is proof of idiocy.

fuck darwin. yes bacteria and lower forms of life have been proven to evolve but there are no FACTS to support that homo sapiens evolved from monkeys or from some primordial creature. that is why its a theory when you apply the evolution label to humans.

you're from louisiana, right?

 

seemingly random

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 2007
5,277
0
0
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: RESmonkey
Why do people still believe in creationism? I know we shouldn't hate on people's beliefs, but some people are just stupid as fuck.

This is a major problem with the world, lack of respect for another person's opinion. If someone takes an opposite opinion of what you believe they must be stupid and un-educated.

Oh I see that you don't like Bush, you're an idiot.

What was that, you don't support abortion? You're a flaming idiot.

I can't believe you like the Lakers over the Celtics, someone get a rope and let's find a tree.


Honestly if you're so close minded where you need to insult someone over a difference of opinion maybe you're the stupid one.
If you're trying to apply logic and equality, let's play fill in the blank:

fundies don't agree with abortion; fundies kill abortion clinic emplyees.

secularists don't agree with politicians trying legislate religious opinion; secularists ______.
 

Cerpin Taxt

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
11,940
542
126
Originally posted by: Cerpin Taxt
Originally posted by: Citrix
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you people seem to forget that.

Sarcasm Detector 0/10

Darwin damn it. How many times have people made this stupid argument and been corrected about it? Enough times that such a statement is proof of idiocy.

fuck darwin. yes bacteria and lower forms of life have been proven to evolve but there are no FACTS to support that homo sapiens evolved from monkeys or from some primordial creature. that is why its a theory when you apply the evolution label to humans.

Again, that is absolutely untrue. I invite you to visit www.talkorigins.org and search for Douglas Theobald's well documented web-essay entitled "29+ Evidences for Macroevolution: the Scientific Case for Common Descent."

As an object lesson, I would like the readers along to compare and contrast Citrix's claim that "there are no FACTS to support that homo sapiens evolved from monkeys or from some primordial creature" with the plethora of information readily available here:

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/

And once you have considered the relative validity of the claim that "no facts" exist, if you like you can join me in pointing and laughing at the villiage idiot. :laugh:

 

rbV5

Lifer
Dec 10, 2000
12,632
0
0
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Except for teaching "Science" (the context of the topic), competing "theories" require a scientific basis. How exactly is Creationism and ID a "theory" in this context?
 

So

Lifer
Jul 2, 2001
25,923
17
81
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Nice job not quoting the paragraph DIRECTLY ABOVE that one!

In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet, and the theories commonly used to describe and explain this behavior are Newton's theory of universal gravitation (see also gravitation), and the general theory of relativity.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Nice selective quote. From your link:

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,226
5,803
126
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

You've already been shown that this is wrong.
 

sdifox

No Lifer
Sep 30, 2005
96,908
16,174
126
Originally posted by: Citrix
No, No its not. if it were fact it would not be called a theory of evolution now would it?

According to the National Academy of Sciences,

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena.[1]



Source

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory


Ball is now in your court.
 

rbV5

Lifer
Dec 10, 2000
12,632
0
0
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: seemingly random
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you knuckle-dragers seem to forget that.
God and the supporting religious thought are just theories.

I don't think they even approach that level.

They are "beliefs" not "theories".
 

Juddog

Diamond Member
Dec 11, 2006
7,851
6
81
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Cool, thanks for showing us a link that directly proved you wrong. Self-ownage at it's finest.
 

bryanW1995

Lifer
May 22, 2007
11,144
32
91
Originally posted by: shocksyde
Originally posted by: Citrix

fuck darwin. yes bacteria and lower forms of life have been proven to evolve but there are no FACTS to support that homo sapiens evolved from monkeys or from some primordial creature. that is why its a theory when you apply the evolution label to humans.

Fuck Darwin? Now I really think you're intelligent.

I wanna play, too! FUCK EINSTEIN!!! FUCK HAWKING!!! WEEEEE!

einstein and darwin had a tremendous impact upon our understanding of the world around us. they've both probably had MORE of an impact after their deaths in fact. Don't include hawking in that exclusive company; he's a pretty good physicist who wrote a couple of books, but he'll never be a leader of the scientific community.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Juddog
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you people seem to forget that.

Do you understand the scientific definition of a theory?

Simply answering "no" back on page 3 would have saved everyone a lot of time :)
 

Arkitech

Diamond Member
Apr 13, 2000
8,356
3
76
Originally posted by: bryanW1995
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: RESmonkey
Why do people still believe in creationism? I know we shouldn't hate on people's beliefs, but some people are just stupid as fuck.

This is a major problem with the world, lack of respect for another person's opinion. If someone takes an opposite opinion of what you believe they must be stupid and un-educated.

Oh I see that you don't like Bush, you're an idiot.

What was that, you don't support abortion? You're a flaming idiot.

I can't believe you like the Lakers over the Celtics, someone get a rope and let's find a tree.


Honestly if you're so close minded where you need to insult someone over a difference of opinion maybe you're the stupid one.

ok, just because it has "theory" in front of it doesn't make evolution a guess. A "guess" is what christians, muslims, buddhists, hindus, etc etc have been doing for 1000's of years. At lease science has come up with a reasonable explanation backed by empirical evidence to explain how we got here.


This is the problems with these type of discussions, you can not apply the same rules on religion that you can on science. Science is a discipline based in observation and experimentation, religion is a practice of faith. Although the two are not mutually exclusive the approach is different. Billions of people on this planet have a spiritual inclination (likely some in your own families) and it's foolish to dismiss their beliefs as nothing more than antiquated superstitions. At the very least investigate something before you attempting to become the authority on what is'nt real or factual.
 

Cerpin Taxt

Lifer
Feb 23, 2005
11,940
542
126
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Holy shit, are you retarded? The very same wiki article goes on to say immediately below the paragraph you quoted:

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena
(emphasis added)

Just do yourself a favor and stop posting for a while. The best thing to do when you find yourself in a hole is to stop digging.


EDIT: :laugh: I guess I'm a little late to this particular dogpile....
 

pstylesss

Platinum Member
Mar 21, 2007
2,914
0
0
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: loup garou
Argh, those idiot legislators voted themselves a 3x pay raise, which Jindal says he won't veto (in opposition to his campaign promise to), then come up with this gem and he signs it into law? Fuck, recall all those assholes and Jindal, too. I thought that idiot would be an improvement over Blanco, so far isn't looking that way at all. :|

He had been an improvement up until this point. The legislature had Jindal over a barrel anyways with the pay raise. They effectively were going to blackmail him into not supporting any of his agenda if he doesn't sign it. From what I understand, the people of Louisiana are upset enough to where some legislators are beginning to wish they hadn't given themselves a pay raise. Whether or not that will affect Jindal's decision is the question.

He can let it go into law without his signature. Can he not?
 

So

Lifer
Jul 2, 2001
25,923
17
81
This is the most shameful example of willful ignorance I have ever encountered.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Cerpin Taxt
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Holy shit, are you retarded? The very same wiki article goes on to say immediately below the paragraph you quoted:

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena
(emphasis added)

Just do yourself a favor and stop posting for a while. The best thing to do when you find yourself in a hole is to stop digging.

Or KEEP digging until you come out on the other side! The earth is flat after all, how deep can it be?
 

Mani

Diamond Member
Aug 9, 2001
4,808
1
0
Originally posted by: Citrix
Evolution is a THEORY not a fact. you knuckle-dragers seem to forget that.

gravity is a theory as well. Guess we should be teaching it alongside "mysterious force of god" in schools.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,226
5,803
126
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: bryanW1995
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: RESmonkey
Why do people still believe in creationism? I know we shouldn't hate on people's beliefs, but some people are just stupid as fuck.

This is a major problem with the world, lack of respect for another person's opinion. If someone takes an opposite opinion of what you believe they must be stupid and un-educated.

Oh I see that you don't like Bush, you're an idiot.

What was that, you don't support abortion? You're a flaming idiot.

I can't believe you like the Lakers over the Celtics, someone get a rope and let's find a tree.


Honestly if you're so close minded where you need to insult someone over a difference of opinion maybe you're the stupid one.

ok, just because it has "theory" in front of it doesn't make evolution a guess. A "guess" is what christians, muslims, buddhists, hindus, etc etc have been doing for 1000's of years. At lease science has come up with a reasonable explanation backed by empirical evidence to explain how we got here.


This is the problems with these type of discussions, you can not apply the same rules on religion that you can on science. Science is a discipline based in observation and experimentation, religion is a practice of faith. Although the two are not mutually exclusive the approach is different. Billions of people on this planet have a spiritual inclination (likely some in your own families) and it's foolish to dismiss their beliefs as nothing more than antiquated superstitions. At the very least investigate something before you attempting to become the authority on what is'nt real or factual.

The vast majority would agree, but that's why Religious ideas on Origin have no place in the Science Class.
 

seemingly random

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 2007
5,277
0
0
I believe that evolution really did and continues to occur. There is just too much evidence for it. And the main reason is that it drives the fundies crazy - so it must have substance.
 

bryanW1995

Lifer
May 22, 2007
11,144
32
91
Originally posted by: torpid
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

You conveniently edited out the first sentence in that paragraph. Here's the full relevant text:

The word theory has many distinct meanings in different fields of knowledge, depending on their methodologies and the context of discussion.

In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet, and the theories commonly used to describe and explain this behavior are Newton's theory of universal gravitation (see also gravitation), and the general theory of relativity.

In common usage,
the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements. True descriptions of reality are more reflectively understood as statements which would be true independently of what people think about them.

wow. citrix, you should go into politics.
 

OutHouse

Lifer
Jun 5, 2000
36,410
616
126
Originally posted by: Cerpin Taxt
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

Holy shit, are you retarded? The very same wiki article goes on to say immediately below the paragraph you quoted:

Some scientific explanations are so well established that no new evidence is likely to alter them. The explanation becomes a scientific theory. In everyday language a theory means a hunch or speculation. Not so in science. In science, the word theory refers to a comprehensive explanation of an important feature of nature that is supported by many facts gathered over time. Theories also allow scientists to make predictions about as yet unobserved phenomena
(emphasis added)

Just do yourself a favor and stop posting for a while. The best thing to do when you find yourself in a hole is to stop digging.


EDIT: :laugh: I guess I'm a little late to this particular dogpile....

i dug no hole. then tell me why its called the THEORY of evolution instead of Evolution the Fact of it, learn it, live it love it....

again im talking about homo sapiens. not lower forms of life.

 

OutHouse

Lifer
Jun 5, 2000
36,410
616
126
Originally posted by: bryanW1995
Originally posted by: torpid
Originally posted by: Citrix
here just so that we all know what a theory is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements.

You conveniently edited out the first sentence in that paragraph. Here's the full relevant text:

The word theory has many distinct meanings in different fields of knowledge, depending on their methodologies and the context of discussion.

In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet, and the theories commonly used to describe and explain this behavior are Newton's theory of universal gravitation (see also gravitation), and the general theory of relativity.

In common usage,
the word theory is often used to signify a conjecture, an opinion, a speculation, or a hypothesis. In this usage, a theory is not necessarily based on facts; in other words, it is not required to be consistent with true descriptions of reality. This usage of theory leads to the common incorrect statements. True descriptions of reality are more reflectively understood as statements which would be true independently of what people think about them.

wow. citrix, you should go into politics.

well i was a self appointed campaign manager for Dave's run for the white house.