Looking for the best video card...

[hans030390]

The video card died in one of my family's computers. It's an older Sony Vaio (5 years)...300 watt PSU (17a on the 12v rail, seems pretty stable for a PSU), 2.8ghz P4, 2GB Ram, 120GB HDD, DVD-RW drive, etc.

We were previously running a 6800 vanilla (unlocked). It died, and they want to replace the video card. I understand that, given the age of the computer, it's more cost effective to just build a new one for $500 (there are still kids that play games on the computers in the house). However, they decided against that (despite my persuasive efforts and the kids ASKING for a new computer).

So, given the criteria, what's a good card to get? I'd prefer something new...and something that performs better than the 6800. I was looking into the Radeom 3650 and 4650. Some say the 4650 runs fine on a 300 watt PSU. Some say it doesn't. They're both within (or close to) my budget. However, I'm open for suggestions.

Update: Having driver issues...check post below.

 

[brblx]

4650 should stomp the 3650. it's not that far from the 4670, which is about on par with the 3850 (the fastest AGP card).

PSU should be fine, 4650 should ideally not consume more than about 5a (having a 55w tdp) under heavy load. not much if any more than a 6800.

 

[hans030390]

Originally posted by: brblx
4650 should stomp the 3650. it's not that far from the 4670, which is about on par with the 3850 (the fastest AGP card).

PSU should be fine, 4650 should ideally not consume more than about 5a (having a 55w tdp) under heavy load. not much if any more than a 6800.

Cool, sounds like it'd be the best card to get. Any more input from anyone else?

 

[cusideabelincoln]

4650 would be a solid choice, but in actuality it is a bit more slower than the HD4670 than the previous user suggests. The crippled memory bandwidth really hurts the card; it'll only be a bit faster than a 3650, in my estimation, and it's overall slower than the 9500GT (aka 8600GT, the closest Nvidia competitor to the Radeon HD3650). http://www.techpowerup.com/rev...D_4650_iSilence/6.html

 

[frozentundra123456]

I am running a 4650 on a 300 watt generic power supply without any problems. However, if you can find one at the price you want I would suggest getting the 4670 also. I got the 4650 on sale quite a bit cheaper than a 4670, but wish I had waited and got the 4670, as it went on sale eventually for the same price as I paid for the 4650. The 4670 has DDR3 memory while the 4650 has DDR2 memory, which makes it quite a bit slower.

However, I would disagree that the 9500GT is faster than the 4650. Most articles I have read indicate the 4650 is slightly faster than the 9500GT and the 4670 clearly trounces it.

There is also a low power, low profile 9600GT made by Galaxy which does not require an external power connector and might run on a 300 watt power supply. It should be clearly faster than any of these cards, but is more expensive.

 

[brblx]

9500gt vs 3650-
http://www.firingsquad.com/har..._performance/page7.asp

9400gt on up-
http://www.techpowerup.com/rev...hire/HD_4650_OC/6.html

i havn't seem any direct 4650/3650 benchmarks, but it would seem it's quite a bit slower than the 9500gt, which the 4650 beats in most games and at worst certainly isn't 'overall slower.' yeah, the gap between it and the 4670 is fairly significant, but it's not that far off from the 3850 (and there's no agp 4670).

 

[JonnyBlaze]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814131161

4670 agp right there

 

[brblx]

well, there's one. expensive, though. 3850 is 40 bucks cheaper for about the same card, 4670 really only shines when AA is introduced.

 

[Paratus]

Make sure it has SM3.0

 

[hans030390]

Originally posted by: Paratus
Make sure it has SM3.0

LOL. Oh to be 15 and retarded.

Originally posted by: brblx
well, there's one. expensive, though. 3850 is 40 bucks cheaper for about the same card, 4670 really only shines when AA is introduced.

3850 probably won't run on 300 watts though, right? Also, to anyone suggesting the 4670, my budget is around $70. It's not an option.

 

[kmmatney]

Where is everyone seeing the HD4650 or 9500GT with AGP? A quick check on NewEgg only shows 9 APG cards between $50 and $70, with the HD3650 looking like the best choice.


I'd go for the Sapphire model:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814102814

 

[brblx]

the 4650 is 12 dollars more...

 

[kmmatney]

Originally posted by: brblx
the 4650 is 12 dollars more...

Yeah, that looks like the best card - if the OP can spend the extra money:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814103080

 

[happy medium]

The guy has a pent 4 @ 2.8. Why are you suggesting a 4670 or 3850?.
A 3650 (65$) is all he needs with that cpu but for only 15$ more I go for the 4650 (80$).

A 4650 is much faster then a 3650. It has ddr3 memory and more then twice the stream proccessors @ 320 vs 120.

3650 for 65$

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814161237

4650 for 80$

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814103080

4650 vs 3650 vs 9500gt vs 8600gt review.

http://magicboxlive.blogspot.c...ati-hd-4650-vs-hd.html

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

This looks like the best card for the money. Make sure you download the drivers from the HIS website:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814161237

It seems to take a 4-pin floppy power connector.

 

[happy medium]

Originally posted by: cusideabelincoln
4650 would be a solid choice, but in actuality it is a bit more slower than the HD4670 than the previous user suggests. The crippled memory bandwidth really hurts the card; it'll only be a bit faster than a 3650, in my estimation, and it's overall slower than the 9500GT (aka 8600GT, the closest Nvidia competitor to the Radeon HD3650). http://www.techpowerup.com/rev...D_4650_iSilence/6.html

Thats a review of a 4650 silent with ddr2 memory and crippled to run slower.

I linked a ddr3 4650 at Newegg.

A 4650 with ddr3 will beat a 9500gt easily.

 

[happy medium]

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem
This looks like the best card for the money. Make sure you download the drivers from the HIS website:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16814161237

Yes thats the 3650 I linked but for 15$ more the 4650 beats it by 35/40% easily.

 

[WaitingForNehalem]

Well after rebate it becomes $25 and he's coming from a regular 6800 so it will be plenty fast for him. Plus his P4 will probably bottleneck both cards anyway.

 

[brblx]

25? that shows 55...

 

[happy medium]

Originally posted by: WaitingForNehalem
Well after rebate it becomes $25 and he's coming from a regular 6800 so it will be plenty fast for him. Plus his P4 will probably bottleneck both cards anyway.

Yea if he likes rebates I see your point. For me 10$ is not worth waiting 3/4 months. I usually forget about it.

And the bottlnecking point, look at my pent 4 rig. I know what you mean.

 

[hans030390]

Ok, so I ended up getting the Diamond 4650. Turns out the drivers you can download for Vista don't work. They don't find the video card. All they do is install Hydravision and such. Oh, and the drivers that come on the CD for Vista (and this card)...well, they forgot to put them on there. Apparently they work just fine for XP, though...

Any ideas? ATI's official drivers don't work either.

 

[happy medium]

4650 agp drivers for 32 bit vista here

http://www.dmmdownload.com/product_search.php

And 64 bit vista here

http://www.dmmdownload.com/product_search.php

Edit : these drivers don't work?

 

[hans030390]

The drivers downloaded from their website (specifically from the product page for my exact card) do not work.

 

[cusideabelincoln]

Originally posted by: happy medium

Originally posted by: cusideabelincoln
4650 would be a solid choice, but in actuality it is a bit more slower than the HD4670 than the previous user suggests. The crippled memory bandwidth really hurts the card; it'll only be a bit faster than a 3650, in my estimation, and it's overall slower than the 9500GT (aka 8600GT, the closest Nvidia competitor to the Radeon HD3650). http://www.techpowerup.com/rev...D_4650_iSilence/6.html

Thats a review of a 4650 <<<<silent with ddr2 memory and crippled to run slower.

I linked a ddr3 4650 at Newegg.

A 4650 with ddr3 will beat a 9500gt easily.

Actually, you're wrong (and right). The reference HD4650 comes with DDR2 memory and is meant to be crippled (hence naming it the HD4650), and as such this is why I said what I said: http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3405

The one you linked to as well as the one in the following review is more of an overclocked version.

Originally posted by: brblx
9500gt vs 3650-
http://www.firingsquad.com/har..._performance/page7.asp

9400gt on up-
http://www.techpowerup.com/rev...hire/HD_4650_OC/6.html

i havn't seem any direct 4650/3650 benchmarks, but it would seem it's quite a bit slower than the 9500gt, which the 4650 beats in most games and at worst certainly isn't 'overall slower.' yeah, the gap between it and the 4670 is fairly significant, but it's not that far off from the 3850 (and there's no agp 4670).

As such its performance will be closer to an HD4670 because its specifications is in fact really close to an HD4670. Although I have doubts if the listed memory speed of the card you linked it is effective or real. If it's effective, then it's basically an HD4650 with GDDR3 instead of DDR2. If it's "real", then it's only 25 MHz slower on the memory front to being labeled as an HD4670. So it's confusing when I look at the label and then I look at the specs.

You are right, though, that if that HD4650 has GDDR3 running at an effective speed of ~1900 MHz, then it will beat a 9500GT. It will basically be on the same level, performance-wise, as the HD3850.

And now I'll respond to brblx: That HD4650 is really closer to an HD4670 in performance because it strays away from the reference design. It is in fact more like an HD4670 than it is an HD4650. A "true" HD4650 has about half the memory bandwidth than the card used in your techpowerup review, which is why I used the review to the silent HD4650, even though it does have slightly lower clocks than the reference design.

Also when the HD2600XT/Pro and 8600GT were released, this is what I was basing my comment about them being close performers, although the 8600GT usually held the advantage in more games while the HD2600Pro/XT (the HD3650 performs right in between these two as it's just a die shrink) could win in a few games. That seems to be mostly what the firingsquad review shows as well: In some games the HD3650 can compete and in other games it falls behind.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: hans030390
The drivers downloaded from their website (specifically from the product page for my exact card) do not work.

Is the card being seen in device manager...if not then its either a dead card or your slot is dead.