Looking for advice on budget upgrade

[Tequila]

Greetings, all. I haven't posted to this forum in ages and I'm a bit behind the times in technology so I'm looking for some good suggestions. I want to upgrade my motherboard, cpu and video card without dishing out too many clams so I've been digging around for some ideas.

I currently have a crapload of PC100 and a few sticks of PC133 SDRAM so it would be nice to use those. My current system is a Abit BP-6 dual celeron 366 and GeForce2 MX200 that I split use for Linux and boot to Win2000 to play Counter-Strike. CS is uh rather laggy with a celeron 366 and MX200. I also want to play some of the newer games out there but can't go over $200 at this time.

Some ideas I've been throwing around:

System1 via Newegg.com
==================
Biostar M7VIG $64 specs
AMD Athlon XP 1600 $53.99
ATI Radeon 9000 $67

Total: $184.99

System 2 via Mwave.com
==================
Iwill KK266+R $80.85 specs
AMD Duron 1300 $43.63
ATI Radeon 9000 $76

Total: $200.48

My biggest concern is the perfomance of the KM266 and KT133 chipsets found on the Biostar and IWill respectively. I can't seem to find any performance reviews at all on the KM266. What I like about the Biostar is that I can later upgrade to PC2100 DDR and in the meantime use my PC133. The Iwill is limited to PC133/100 but has a nice 5.1 soundchip, jumperless design and raid.

What kind of perfomance can I expect here? Will the PC133/100 RAM be a big limitation? If I upgrade to PC2100 on the Biostar will the performance be on par with a more recent chipset like the KT333? Will PC2100 + KM266 be a waste on an Athlon XP 1600?

Thanks.

 

[o1die]

You can get away with using your sdram. The performance penalty is only about 10%. Those chipsets you're looking at are a little slower than the kt266a or kt333, but you may have trouble finding any reviews. I wouldn't rule them out for that reason.

 

[eplebnista]

Here is a link to a review of the MSI MS-6390 KM266 motherboard. The review is actually a round-up of integrated motherboards(a page index is at the bottom of the page). They used DDR in the tests though.

hth,
eplebnista

edit: IMO, the performance should be comparable between the various KM266 boards and BTW, TCWO.com has the M7VIG for ~$59+S&H.

M7VIG thread in HD

 

[Tequila]

Thanks for the link. Wow, TWCO has cheap prices. Ok, new option now

System 3 via TCWO
==============
Biostar M7VIG $49
AMD Duron 1300 $31
Radeon 9000 $75

Total: $155 or $178 with an Athlon 1600 XP

Anyone have experience ordering with these guys? I love Newegg's speedy and cheap Fedex delivery and I already have an account with them. But this is pretty tempting

 

[Tequila]

Oh, a quick question. Will my existing Socket 370 heatsink/fan combo work on the AMD socket A cpus? I still have a couple of Globalwins (good but loud hehe).

 

[eplebnista]

 

[Vette73]

To be honest, if you plan on keeping this system for a while I would get...

ECS KT333 board at newegg.com that has, sound, Lan, and Raid for $74
Ram 256mg DDR PC2100 from Pricewatch Vendor $46
Athlon XP 1600+ from Newegg.com $54
Good size heatsink and fan Newegg.com $12

This ends up being $186 shipped. This system should speed things up quite well, and support future CPU's at least up to Athlon XP 2600+ if not higher
As for your video card sell off you Sdram and put that in you video card fund, and put the card you have in your new board and just OVERCLOCK it. A friend of mine has a GF2mx and he overclocked it quite a bit and it made a big difference after he upgraded his CPU and Ram.

 

[Goi]

If you want to use the PC100/PC133 SDRAM as a stop gap measure and still leave room for further expansion, the only motherboard to get is the ECS K7S5A, rather than the Biostar, Iwill or any other motherboard the others have mentioned. The reason for this is simple, the ECS K7S5A is the only motherboard around that I know of that supports both SDR(single data rate, which is what you have now in the form of PC100/PC133) SDRAM and DDR(double data rate) SDRAM. You can pop in your PC100/PC133 SDRAM now and when you have the money in the future, upgrade to faster PC2100/PC2700 DDR-SDRAM.

As for the CPU, the Athlon XP 1600+ is pretty good, and even on the K7S5A you should be able to overclock it quite a bit by just playing around with the FSB speeds. The K7S5A with the latest oc BIOS supports 133, 138, 143,147, 150 and 166MHz FSBs. This should be sufficient for basic overclocking should you be so inclined. I wouldn't go for Durons though, even the newer Morgan cores, since they're quite a bit slower, and not all that much cheaper.

Graphics card wise, the Radeon 9000 isn't too bad, but consider getting a Radeon 8500LE instead. Its goes for about the same price, but is faster in games.

I hope you have at least 256B of PC133 SDRAM lying around though, you didn't mention how much that "crapload" was

A couple of things to note about your prices

The AMD Athlon XP 1600+ from newegg.com is OEM, and so you need to get a cooler for it.
The ATI Radeon 9000 isn't the Pro version, and is made by Atlantis rather than ATI. Nothing wrong with OEM versions, but I've never heard of Atlantis. Also the price is for bulk orders only. I don't think you can get that price if you only buy one.

Prices from newegg.com
AMD Athlon XP 1600+ OEM - $53.99
ECS K7S5A - $53.99
ATI Radeon 8500LE(built by ATI) 64MB - $90
Thermal Integration's Dr. Thermal TI-V77N - $18
Arctic Silver 3 Thermal Grease - $6

Total - $221.98 +S/H

Prices from mwave.com
AMD Athlon XP 1600+ OEM - $55.64
ECS K7S5A - $55.13
ATI Radeon 8500LE 64MB - $85
Coolermaster DP5-7H53F-OL - $13
Arctic Silver 3 Thermal Grease - $6
Total - $214.77 + S/H

Either would do, but with the newegg.com system you do get a noticably better Heatsink/Fan combo.
One last thing to take note of - make sure your PSU is up to the mark, things have changed since the Celeron 366MHz days, your PSU might not cut the mustard for an AMD Athlon XP system...if it doesn't you'll have to get a better, decent 300W unit at least.

 

[CaptnKirk]

The hot ticket for performance upgrade right now is the XP1600+ third item down for $ 53.99, they are AGOIA's and Free Freight.

Want to get a good price on motherboards ? Look at the REFURBISHED products, there are 4 boards from $ 49 to $ 69 that are super bargains, 2 each from Abit and Epox. THese boards have been re-tested, and about the only things missing might be an IDE cable, or a USB bracket. These returns are usually from people who bought it to put into a system that it wouldn't fit, like a DEll upgrade atempt, or they realized that they were over their heads in what they were trying to do. I've picked up 3 Abit KR7-133's this way, and in one case only there was a missing USB bracket, but I didn't even need it.

DDR Memory ? Get either SAMSUNG from NewEgg, or CRUCIAL. Both are Free Freight, Crucial gives a 10% direct order discount.

Just built one of these with a XP1600+, AROIA into an ABIT KX7-333 (Refurb) - no missing parts, and it posted up with PC3200 Samsung as an XP2100+, didn't unlock it.
CPU & Mobo cost was about $ 110 - keep watching the stock until you find what you want.

Get the Heatsink from HEATSINK FACTORY they have the most options, but you can get CASE FANS from NewEgg. The Y.S. Tech adjustable is a great choice fro the CPU to put onto an ALPHA PAL8045, but make sure to set it up to suck the air up from the heatsink, and don't forget to peel-off the white plastic covering the shroud mount.

 

[Buz2b]

I'd agree for the most part with the good "Captain" but I would add that another, IMHO slightly better source, would be SVC for the HS, HS fan and case fans. Prices are comparable +/- a bit here and there but shipping is less. Case fans would be much less, HS about the same but they offer lower priced options (for HS's) that are pretty good but the YS Tech fan is about .99 cents higher at SVC. Another bonus with SVC is their prices on rounded cables; about $5 less than most other sites. Anyway, just another option to compare when you are shopping around.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Buz -
GREAT call on the fans & heatsinks, HeatsinkFactory is a bit pricy on shipping, but sometimes they are the only stocker when you're trying to get a part.
HeatsinkFactory has the 3-pin harness for the Panaflo fans, but NewEggs link doesn't bring the 3-pin up anymore.

I may even get my next Y.S. Tech adjustable from SVC now.

 

[Dufrane]

I have placed two orders with TCWO and have nothing but good things to say about them. They are real reasonable on shipping.

 

[Buz2b]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
Buz -
GREAT call on the fans & heatsinks, HeatsinkFactory is a bit pricy on shipping, but sometimes they are the only stocker when you're trying to get a part.
HeatsinkFactory has the 3-pin harness for the Panaflo fans, but NewEggs link doesn't bring the 3-pin up anymore.

I may even get my next Y.S. Tech adjustable from SVC now.

I have bought two of those adjustable fans and they are terrific! Installed them both on each of my two nephews' recent system builds with an AX-7. I was able to crank down the rpm's easily and still maintain good temps. The control knob is an easy install. I actually installed it on the back side of the case-out of harms way. Now, I just need to get MYSELF an nice AX-7 & YS Tech fan setup.
BTW, I have bookmarked that HS Factory site for future referrence and do appreciate the link. You never know when they might come in handy, especially if SVC is out of stock!

 

[o1die]

If you live near a Fry's electronics, today you can get an msi pro-2 kt266a board with xp1700 retail boxed for only $99.95. Add to that a couple of 128 meg ddram pc2100 at $14.99 each. My location was also closing out the radeon 8500LE, but I got the last one 2 days ago.

 

[Goi]

Hmmn, maybe you guys didn't read him correct? He said he didn't wanna buy RAM since he has a crapload of PC100/PC133 SDRAM modules around. So, alot the recommended motherboards don't support SDRAM, only DDR-SDRAM. Only the K7S5A that I mentioned supported both. Personally I think that amount of money is better spent on a better video card. It will be hard to get a CPU, motherboard, 256MB PC2100 SDRAM and a decent video card for $200. Scrap the PC2100 SDRAM and it'll be easier.

 

[Buz2b]

Originally posted by: Goi
Hmmn, maybe you guys didn't read him correct? He said he didn't wanna buy RAM since he has a crapload of PC100/PC133 SDRAM modules around. So, alot the recommended motherboards don't support SDRAM, only DDR-SDRAM. Only the K7S5A that I mentioned supported both. Personally I think that amount of money is better spent on a better video card. It will be hard to get a CPU, motherboard, 256MB PC2100 SDRAM and a decent video card for $200. Scrap the PC2100 SDRAM and it'll be easier.

Actually, what he said was

it would be nice to use those.

Marlin1975 suggested a ?non SDRAM? board but for under the budget (if the prices hold true of course). This was done with the idea of selling off the SDRAM for a video card fund for later and overclocking his current one.

CaptnKirk suggested some refurb boards that would keep the budget intact also with the possible addition of DDR.

o1die did the same as Marlin1975 with another budget keeper that left some room for a video card purchase.

Your offerings did not make the budget though. Keep in mind that people are offering options that would give him a better performing system and still stay within the budget (plus or minus the video card). That?s called feedback and that?s what he came here for. The video card is important, I agree. Sometimes you can?t have your cake and eat it too though. The benefits of the better/faster system should overcome that for now though and as Marlin1975 said, he could sell off the ?crapload? of SDRAM and start a video card fund.

 

[Goi]

Fair enough...but selling used hardware is a hit and miss affair, you don't really know how much they'd fetch, or how long you'd take to sell them...but I'll admit that its still a viable, if not reliable option.

 

[Buz2b]

It's cool!

 

[Tequila]

Thanks for all the replies. Great info there. Well after some thinking I'm now looking at this setup:

Athlon XP 1600 $53.99
MSI K7T TURBO2 $80.00
See how the performance is on the existing GeForce MX200 and then decide on a video card.

I do a search for Biostar and don't come up with many posts which worries me. I like the idea of using a well known brand so that if I have problems there should be plenty of people out there to help me out thus I'm going with the MSI even though it's limited to SDR SDRAM. ECS doesn't give me a warm feeling either.

Two questions:

1. Will my old Socket 370 fans work with the Athlon? They are Globalwins that pump out some serious air but I don't know what the exact model they are.
2. I have a 250W Antec PSU but also a spare 300W Sparkle PSU. Should the Sparkle be good enough?

Oh and I have 256MB of PC133 SDRAM.

Thanks again. I'm going to think about it more so feel free to keep the advice coming

 

[gaidin123]

Originally posted by: Tequila
Thanks for all the replies. Great info there. Well after some thinking I'm now looking at this setup:
1. Will my old Socket 370 fans work with the Athlon? They are Globalwins that pump out some serious air but I don't know what the exact model they are.
2. I have a 250W Antec PSU but also a spare 300W Sparkle PSU. Should the Sparkle be good enough?

Thanks again. I'm going to think about it more so feel free to keep the advice coming

The 300W Sparkle should be fine for you. I am using the same brand power supply on an Athlon 1900+ with the Epox 8kha+ board with no problems whatsoever.

The heatsink fans may work depending on the model since Socket A and Socket 370 are very similar. However the heat dissipation of an Athlon XP chip versus your old Celeron 366 is going to be large. Without digging up old specs, I'd just recommend you spend the $10-15 more and either buy the retail CPU which will come with an approved heatsink/fan, or go buy yourself a new heatsink/fan combo specifically for higher end Athlons.

Gaidin

 

[Buz2b]

Go to SVC and pick out either the Golden Gate (basic model) for $8.99 or the GC68 for $5.99. You can use the same fans on the Golden gate (60mm) from your old HS and it would be the better of the two. Either one will do a good job on your CPU at minimal cost.
The Turbo2 board is a pretty nice board. I built one for my wife's system. Runs strong and steady, 24/7.