Looking for a "Pseudo" HTPC

[assassin24]

I am looking for a nettop/netbook/media player that I can use to hook up via HDMI to my Denon receiver and Samsung 61" DLP HDTV.

I have an older "HTPC" that I threw together with old parts running Windows XP but I have never been able to get it to hook up to the HDTV with decent results. It does not have an HDMI output on its video card.

Here is what I need it to do...

1. Play MP3s
2. Surf the Internet
3. View pictures
4. Watch the occasional AVI/WMV/etc video
5. Perhaps be able to watch DVDs (not Bluray) that I have ripped to a large external hard drive
6. Be able to hook up to CAT5 high speed internet that I have in every room in the house
7. Watch the occasional AVCHD home movie from my Canon Camcorder

I do NOT need it to do surround sound or play blurays. I already have a bluray player.

What do you guys recommend? I was considering the Dell Zino but am not sure if this is a good choice.

I really need some help here. Thanks.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Cheapest solution would be to get a new video card that has HDMI, for your existing HTPC.

Stay away from Atom-based builds since the CPU is a bit slow for some software decoding tasks. A mATX AM2+ dual-core build or possibly a slower core 2 would be much safer.

 

[assassin24]

Cheapest solution would be to get a new video card that has HDMI, for your existing HTPC.

I thought about going this route but the problem is that my HTPC and its parts are 6-7 years old. I could get a video card with HDMI but I am not even sure that I want to spend the $50 to do that. Should I just go ahead and upgrade?

 

[her209]

I thought about going this route but the problem is that my HTPC and its parts are 6-7 years old. I could get a video card with HDMI but I am not even sure that I want to spend the $50 to do that. Should I just go ahead and upgrade?

You'd probably end up getting one with a new mobo/cpu anyways. Just make sure its forward compatible with the new motherboards, i.e. PCIe. Plus, I don't know if the motherboards with HDMI onboard support carrying audio over the HDMI port.

 

[Decembermouse]

Build your own. You'll save money!!! Plus, you won't have to deal with crappy off-brand motherboard, RAM, hard drive, video card, PSU.

Go with a cheap 785G motherboard with Sideport if you can get a good deal, and an Athlon II X2. This system would be able to do even HD decoding.

 

[assassin24]

Build your own. You'll save money!!! Plus, you won't have to deal with crappy off-brand motherboard, RAM, hard drive, video card, PSU.

Go with a cheap 785G motherboard with Sideport if you can get a good deal, and an Athlon II X2. This system would be able to do even HD decoding.

Is there anything smaller than a micro motherboard? To be honest one of the major things I like about the Zino is how small it is. I have an Antec micro case right now and I can barely fit it on my AV rack.

Care to show me a few examples of cases or boards that might be smaller? Anything comparable to the Zino that I could build?

 

[Decembermouse]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-124-_-Product

Mini-ITX. This one's got a Radeon 3200 built in and you can use your choice of AM2+ CPU, memory, hard drive, etc. There are some cute Mini-ITX cases too.

 

[assassin24]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-124-_-Product

Mini-ITX. This one's got a Radeon 3200 built in and you can use your choice of AM2+ CPU, memory, hard drive, etc. There are some cute Mini-ITX cases too.

I guess the issue here is the price.

I can configure a Zino for about $300 total.

As I have very little (meaning absolutely no) experience in these small form factor PCs can you help me with a decent parts list?

 

[Decembermouse]

The cheapest way I could configure a Zino HD on Dell's site was $659... where do you see it for $300? If you get a Dell Zino (not the HD) it'll just have an Intel Atom and Intel graphics. I know you don't want to play Blu-Ray so in terms of HD decoding, the graphics wouldn't be a huge issue. However- are you using an HDTV? Surfing the web (assuming flash, java, interactive menus, and other occasional CPU-cycle or RAM-heavy content) and listening to MP3's is laggy enough when using an Atom computer on one of those tiny 1024x600 resolution, 10.1" screens, but making it do that while it's also running a screen at 1080p instead... I think it might be too much for the little guy.

 

[assassin24]

The cheapest way I could configure a Zino HD on Dell's site was $659... where do you see it for $300? If you get a Dell Zino (not the HD) it'll just have an Intel Atom and Intel graphics. I know you don't want to play Blu-Ray so in terms of HD decoding, the graphics wouldn't be a huge issue. However- are you using an HDTV? Surfing the web (assuming flash, java, interactive menus, and other occasional CPU-cycle or RAM-heavy content) and listening to MP3's is laggy enough when using an Atom computer on one of those tiny 1024x600 resolution, 10.1" screens, but making it do that while it's also running a screen at 1080p instead... I think it might be too much for the little guy.

Have you read this guy's blog? He seems to think that the Zino can do quite a bit...

http://blogs.amd.com/home/tag/zino-hd/

Am I wrong here? Will I be disappointed if I buy this thing?

 

[MerlinRML]

I've been watching the Dell Zino HD, with similar intentions as yourself. I read the AMD blog and was quite impressed. However, the hard part for me with the Zino HD is the 2.1 audio. Since I'm intending to use it as a media player connected to a home theater, it's a little bit of a letdown. However, the blogger seems to indicate that he was not limited to 2.1 audio. So I'm still waiting and watching.

The other interesting option that I came across today is the Zotac MAG HD-ND01 which is an Atom based solution. In this case, the optical drive is not included, so it would strictly be for streaming media, unless you have a USB Optical drive. Plus, I'm waiting for Flash 10.1 to sort itself out.

Both interesting, but I'm letting others cut their fingers on these before I purchase.

 

[assassin24]

However, the hard part for me with the Zino HD is the 2.1 audio. Since I'm intending to use it as a media player connected to a home theater, it's a little bit of a letdown.

Does the HDMI not pass through surround sound? I would find that hard to believe.

I like the looks of these little computers. I hear that there is an ASUS one coming out any time that is also very good albeit a little more expensive than the Zino.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/12/04/asus-eee-box-eb1501-gets-unboxed/

 

[Decembermouse]

That's an AMD blog by a paid AMD employee. Jay Taylor, a Senior Developer Relations Engineer. He's going to say good things about AMD products, whether they're true or not. Keep in mind that his good review is mostly based on an upgraded configuration, too. For HD Flash animation, he suggests upgrading to the 6850e processor, which would add $110 to the price. And for doing HD video, his positive feelings are based on a configuration with the Radeon 4330, which will cost you another $75. He's not really reviewing a $249 Zino HD...

But that's besides the point! We are talking about entirely different computers here. Did you read his blog and compare it to my post? I think the Zino HD is a great idea. The Zino is not. There are two different machines here. My above post talking about how the Zino will not serve you well as a media machine was referring to the one without the AMD processor/graphics. The Zino has an Intel Atom, and Intel graphics, which are obscenely slow. His blog was about the AMD-based Zino HD, which is a fantastic idea.

Yes assassin24, the Zino (Intel Atom-based) would disappoint you. The Zino HD, however, with its much improved processor and graphics chip, will not disappoint.


(edit) Ok, I found it for less than $659. For some reason this site:
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellst...code=ss&c=US&l=EN&dgc=SS&cid=27399&lid=627062
has them starting at $249, whereas this site:
http://configure.us.dell.com/dellst..._3=6GB82&m_8=640S&dgc=SS&cid=27399&lid=627062
has them for much more. Dell should fix that. I can't build a system that nice for $249, but for $749 I definitely could build one a lot nicer.

With that said, I would recommend not getting the pre-configured one for $249 though, as I'm not sure it'd be super quick with that single-core and only 2GB of memory. I'd definitely say go for the 3250e dual-core processor, and 4GB of memory. This brings it to $393, but with a 1.6GHz single-core and only 2GB of memory, which is basically the minimum specs to run 64-bit Windows 7 (which comes installed on Zino HD). For $393... ehhh, I'm not sure if I could build a better machine, I'll go check

This is fun!

(edit) Yeah, it's going to be tough to build off of Newegg or something for a price as low as Dell is charging. I'd go with the Dell Zino HD on this one, but make sure you don't get the base configuration!

Don't use their website to upgrade to 4GB of memory; it's overpriced. Get the 2GB and get some better, cheaper memory off of Newegg.

 

[assassin24]

For $393... ehhh, I'm not sure if I could build a better machine, I'll go check

This is fun!

Great post. Thanks! I didn't realize that there was a Zino_HD and a regular Zino. I'm learning a lot...

 

[assassin24]

So would this be an adequate build???

Price: $344

Software & Services
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64bit, English
AMD Dual Core Athlon™ X2 3250e (1MB L2, 1.5GHz)
No Productivity software pre-installed
1 Year Basic Service Plan
McAfee SecurityCenter, 30-Day Trial
No Monitor
2GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 800MHz- 2 DIMM
250GB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive
8X DVD+/-RW Drive
Integrated ATI Radeon HD3200 Graphics
Integrated 2.1 High Definition Audio
Dell USB Entry Keyboard
Dell USB Optical Mouse
Piano Black
My Accessories
Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year
Also Includes
Inspiron Zino HD
Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0 Multi-Language
Dell Remote Access, free basic service

And then add 4 GB of Ram from Newegg for about $80.

So that puts you at about $425. Too much?

 

[wiretap]

Zotac GF9300
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813500035

Intel e3200 Wolfdale
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819116265

Silverstone NT07 slim/silent cooler
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835220034

G.Skill 2GB DDR2-800
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231098

Western Digital 80GB SATA Drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136195

Apex MI-100 Mini-ITX case w/ 250w PSU
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811154093

Total: $377.09 shipped @ Newegg, minus $15 rebate

That will do everything you can throw at it that you listed, and it will be small and nearly silent. Also, if you wanted HD media, it will do it (HD DVD and Blu-ray and 1080p encodes). I've extensively tested that setup and built them for several customers. Those parts work great together.

 

[ZetaEpyon]

Is audio via HDMI mandatory? If not, have you tried just using a DVI to HDMI cable?

 

[assassin24]

Zotac GF9300
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813500035

Intel e3200 Wolfdale
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819116265

Silverstone NT07 slim/silent cooler
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835220034

G.Skill 2GB DDR2-800
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231098

Western Digital 80GB SATA Drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136195

Apex MI-100 Mini-ITX case w/ 250w PSU
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811154093

Total: $377.09 shipped @ Newegg, minus $15 rebate

That will do everything you can throw at it that you listed, and it will be small and nearly silent. Also, if you wanted HD media, it will do it (HD DVD and Blu-ray and 1080p encodes). I've extensively tested that setup and built them for several customers. Those parts work great together.

I like this. Perfect information.

So I would still need an operating system but otherwise that is very comparable in price to the Dell Zino HD. Agreed that this thing would beat it in performance easily.

A couple of questions...

1. How loud are these systems?
2. I have a couple of old IDE hard drives lying around. Can you even hook these things up anymore?

 

[wiretap]

The stuff I listed would be pretty darn quiet. The PSU in that case is almost silent, and the CPU cooler is whisper quiet, especially when setting it up with bios fan speed management. During normal use, it shouldn't be much over 1500rpm.

As for the IDE drives, the board I listed doesn't have IDE. Your best bet if you wanted to use them would be going with a motherboard that has IDE, or putting them in an external enclosure and using them via USB or something.

 

[assassin24]

The stuff I listed would be pretty darn quiet. The PSU in that case is almost silent, and the CPU cooler is whisper quiet, especially when setting it up with bios fan speed management. During normal use, it shouldn't be much over 1500rpm.

As for the IDE drives, the board I listed doesn't have IDE. Your best bet if you wanted to use them would be going with a motherboard that has IDE, or putting them in an external enclosure and using them via USB or something.

What do you think about this combo deal on newegg right now?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...t=Combo.304688

 

[assassin24]

What do you think about this combo deal on newegg right now?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...t=Combo.304688

Eh, nevermind. Just realized that is for an atom motherboard.

 

[wiretap]

The dual core Atom really isn't that bad. I've done a few builds with them. For normal desktop use and movie watching, they are fine. When you want to get into more complex things like MediaBrowser with a few hundred movies, it chokes trying to cache everything.

 

[assassin24]

Hey guys I found someone who is selling the following upgraded Zino HD for $400. Is this a good price? This is cheaper than I could build one...

AMD Athlon 6850e 1.8GHz, 3GB DDR2 SDRAM AT 800MHZ, ATI Radeon HD 4330 512MB Graphics Card, 320GB Serial ATA Hard Drive (7200RPM), Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium, 64bit

 

[assassin24]

Is audio via HDMI mandatory? If not, have you tried just using a DVI to HDMI cable?

Actually that is a great idea. I am going to order one from monoprice.

 

[Cassian]

I think you should check out some of the stuff Dell has in their outlets, since you can get some really nice deals. Heres the Dell studio hybird click on the link to check certified refurbed availability. You can get one as low as $339. Not bad since its got enough power for media decoding + it has all the ports for what you need. Usually when building a gaming pc or something with more power its cheaper to build yourself but small tiny novelty HTPCs ,your best bet is with OEMs.

http://www.dell.com/us/en/dfh/deskt....aspx?refid=desktop-studio-hybrid&s=dfh&cs=22

http://outlet.us.dell.com/ARBOnline...line/en/InventorySearch?c=us&cs=22&l=en&s=dfh

Studio Hybrid(System Identifier: Z2D5C6ZC)

• Studio Hybrid Desktop: Intel Pentium Dual Core T4200 (2.0GHz/800Mhz FSB/1MB cache)
• Genuine Windows Vista Home Basic

System Price:$339.00
Operating System
Genuine Windows Vista Home Basic
3 GB DDR2 SDRAM 800MHz (2 DIMMs)
160 GB SATA Hard Drive (5400RPM)
Certified Refurbished
DVI-to-VGA Video Adapter Cable
USB Multimedia Keyboard
65W AC Adapter
125V Power Cord
Optical 2-Button Mouse
Windows Live
Microsoft Works 9.0
32BIT Operating System CD
32BIT Operating System CD
Studio Hybrid Desktop: Intel Pentium Dual Core T4200 (2.0GHz/800Mhz FSB/1MB cache)
Slot Load CD / DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-RW Drive)