Little rant about health insurance

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etrigan420

Golden Member
Oct 30, 2007
1,723
1
71
I never said I did not have the money.




Exactly. My wifes health is worth a lot more then $2,000. If the surgery means she can live a pain free life, I will sell everything I have.

But, why should I pay for someone elses free medical care, when I have to fork out thousands of dollars to help my wife live pain free?

My wife can not get the medical care she needs without jumping through hoops, but someone that refuses to work and mooches off the system is taken care of.

We will probably wait until after the first of the year, pay our part, and she will have the surgery. Paying $2,000 - $2,5000 so close to the end of the year is a poor decision.

It pisses me off that I pay my taxes, work a full time job, and still have to pay out the rear end when my wife or I need medical care. But yet, people can live on the system for years, and do not have to pay hardly anything.

The answer is simple: Quit your job and live the good life. You'll soon be rolling in government provided medical care, cell phones and EBT cards.

Better yet, move to Mexico, become a Mexican citizen, renounce your U.S. citizenship, then...and this is important...*sneak* back across the border. Then get your wife pregnant, have the baby over here...BOOM! Golden. Easy Peasy and what not. Hell, you're already in Texas, you can probably see the border from your house.

Whatever you do...don't question *why* health care is so expensive in this country, just question why *you* have to pay it while others don't...that will really get to the heart of the matter. :whiste:
 

bruceb

Diamond Member
Aug 20, 2004
8,874
111
106
I for one, would not want to pay a large co-pay before the services are rendered and everything is fine. What if something tragic happens ? ? You can be sure, you will never get one red cent of a refund. Check with your states attorney general. I would think this is somewhat illegal. And keep your receipts as the amount will be deductible on your Federal Income tax return, for the tax year in which it was incurred.
 

Ausm

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
25,215
14
81
I for one, would not want to pay a large co-pay before the services are rendered and everything is fine. What if something tragic happens ? ? You can be sure, you will never get one red cent of a refund. Check with your states attorney general. I would think this is somewhat illegal. And keep your receipts as the amount will be deductible on your Federal Income tax return, for the tax year in which it was incurred.

HAHAHAHA The only way you would ever get a refund for shitty or incomplete service is to sue and if the GOP has their way that would be IMPOSSIBLE.

OT I like your Avatar. ;)
 
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Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
OK, here goes.

Was diagnosed with cancer about 17 years ago.

Went through all the alternate examinations, all in network (US Healthcare). Ended up having to have 3 surgeries, and many MANY more tests, scans and other things.

Ended up paying close to $10K in bills that was not covered by my plan. The plan only paid the hospitals $75K, and the total "sticker price" was well over $250K. (Nice, huh?).

Found out a few things along the way.

Sloan Kettering was not in network, so when my mother took samples to them and paid $500 for a DIFFERING DIAGNOSIS (which proved true, and would have saved the health insurance company $30K+) all they could say was "duh".

Next, the place I had surgery was in network. Their radiology lab was not. So either they would have had to ship me out post surgery to get scanned OR they wheel me down the hall and force us to jump through hoops with the insurance company.

Finally, after suing for misdiagnosis and getting a small settlement, the health insurance company had the balls to ASK US FOR THEIR MONEY BACK.

US Healthcare = The devil.

Now, as for Medicare? Go to one of these free clinics sometime. You know, like the one where they had a woman DIE IN THE WAITING ROOM after sitting there for ~7 hours.

We are SO anxious to point fingers at the poor getting something like health care for free when all that will do is cut their care and leave us with even less (as well as a population of sickies that will host an unknown wealth of diseases we thought extinct... Polio anyone?).

All we have to do is look at the cost to run the health program for the military and for government employees to realize that the Insurance Company middle men are ripping us all off.

We should not have to bet on our lives. Either these companies need to be cut to the quick (5% net profit?) or we need to eliminate them and find some modest charge program for the american people to discourage abuse ($10 copay, not free...).

Playing the game and risking being BANKRUPTED for a disease that you could never have seen coming (I got hit when I was ~25) is not a fair way to start your career. For someone as healthy as myself, it is easy to see where I would not have elected to pay for insurance if I had to pay full price for it ($400/mo?).

Final rant, until they find ways to control the flow of cash through the system, pharms and insurance companies will be getting our money. Either through our insurance plans or through uncontrolled prescription costs (elderly medz and medicare are a prime example...).

Constantly looking to deny others is no way to get better for yourself... (BTW, universal health care, if DONE RIGHT, would actually cost the average american LESS than what we pay now... Imagine if your company did not have to pay $1200/mo for your insurance? You could afford to pay $10K in additional taxes if your salary went up by $24K...)
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,830
3
0
My wife has a cyst on her ovary, and her doctor said either the cyst or the ovary needs to be removed. Sometimes the pain is so bad, she hurts just walking around the house. We have health insurance, so this should be easy enough - wrong.

The insurance and the hospital want us to pay our full deductible up front "before" she can have the surgery. The price we were given is around $2,500O that needs to be paid upfront. So my wife needs the surgery to be pain free, but we need a couple of grand before her standard of living can be improved.

What "really" pisses me off, is people on Medicaid can get everything they need at almost no cost to them. My tax dollars go to people who in some cases do not want to work, and spend a good part of their lives mooching off the system. While I work, try to provide for my family, and we have to fork out several thousand dollars before my wife can have a surgery?

And we wonder why the US is having so many financial problems?

For low - medium income families, what is the incentive to get married? When people can have the kids they want, mooch off the system, get all the food stamps and medicaid they need.

I know a family that has 2 kids on medicaid, a few weeks ago they took the kids to have their teeth cleaned. My job does not provide dental insurance,,, well they do, but I have to pay 100% of the insurance cost.

When did the lower class become a class of entitlements? There are people out here who try provide for themselves and their family, and are kicked every time they turn around.


Sounds like an excellent case for government health insurance for ALL, not just the poor and old and veterans.
 

ShawnD1

Lifer
May 24, 2003
15,987
2
81
My experience seems to be that people think everyone should have crap coverage though. They find out what my co-pays are (no deductibles) and instead of "I wish I had that" it's, "you don't deserve that." People don't want "as good" they want equally shitty, it seems.
Ya know, this might be the one defining thing that separates conservatives and liberals. The conservatives think other people get too much, and the liberals think people deserve more.

My hardcore conservative dad said something interesting yesterday. I mentioned that Subaru cars seem so much cheaper than comparable Honda and Toyota vehicles because Honda is made in Canada but Subaru is made in Japan and Japanese workers get paid less (this is true, don't argue with me). My dad said that he thought Canadian workers are paid too much. There's no reason to get paid $30/h to screw in some bolts.
Obviously this line of thinking is a bit flawed. Honda is not unionized, so there's no artificial wage floor. If they tried paying $15/h, they simply wouldn't have any workers. $30/h or whatever really is the market value to screw in some bolts.

Liberals are on the other end of the spectrum. They think everyone deserves a "living wage" even when talking about shit jobs typically done by teens, such as manning the grill at McDonalds. That was my job once. Yes the pay sucked, but that's why we move on. It would be nice for all people to at least have first world health benefits, but getting $20/h at McDonalds would just be silly.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
11
76
Whatever you do...don't question *why* health care is so expensive in this country, just question why *you* have to pay it while others don't...that will really get to the heart of the matter. :whiste:

I don't know anyone from college working in medical sales that makes less than $100k a year. And a couple of them (with MBAs) own $150k+ cars. I suspect those people are the problem.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
11
76
Sounds like an excellent case for government health insurance for ALL, not just the poor and old and veterans.

Take it from someone that's experienced high end private health care and government health care, you'd rather have the private health care.
 

Ausm

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
25,215
14
81
OK, here goes.

Was diagnosed with cancer about 17 years ago.

Went through all the alternate examinations, all in network (US Healthcare). Ended up having to have 3 surgeries, and many MANY more tests, scans and other things.

Ended up paying close to $10K in bills that was not covered by my plan. The plan only paid the hospitals $75K, and the total "sticker price" was well over $250K. (Nice, huh?).

Found out a few things along the way.

Sloan Kettering was not in network, so when my mother took samples to them and paid $500 for a DIFFERING DIAGNOSIS (which proved true, and would have saved the health insurance company $30K+) all they could say was "duh".

Next, the place I had surgery was in network. Their radiology lab was not. So either they would have had to ship me out post surgery to get scanned OR they wheel me down the hall and force us to jump through hoops with the insurance company.

Finally, after suing for misdiagnosis and getting a small settlement, the health insurance company had the balls to ASK US FOR THEIR MONEY BACK.

US Healthcare = The devil.

Now, as for Medicare? Go to one of these free clinics sometime. You know, like the one where they had a woman DIE IN THE WAITING ROOM after sitting there for ~7 hours.

We are SO anxious to point fingers at the poor getting something like health care for free when all that will do is cut their care and leave us with even less (as well as a population of sickies that will host an unknown wealth of diseases we thought extinct... Polio anyone?).

All we have to do is look at the cost to run the health program for the military and for government employees to realize that the Insurance Company middle men are ripping us all off.

We should not have to bet on our lives. Either these companies need to be cut to the quick (5% net profit?) or we need to eliminate them and find some modest charge program for the american people to discourage abuse ($10 copay, not free...).

Playing the game and risking being BANKRUPTED for a disease that you could never have seen coming (I got hit when I was ~25) is not a fair way to start your career. For someone as healthy as myself, it is easy to see where I would not have elected to pay for insurance if I had to pay full price for it ($400/mo?).

Final rant, until they find ways to control the flow of cash through the system, pharms and insurance companies will be getting our money. Either through our insurance plans or through uncontrolled prescription costs (elderly medz and medicare are a prime example...).

Constantly looking to deny others is no way to get better for yourself... (BTW, universal health care, if DONE RIGHT, would actually cost the average american LESS than what we pay now... Imagine if your company did not have to pay $1200/mo for your insurance? You could afford to pay $10K in additional taxes if your salary went up by $24K...)

I enjoyed reading your post you laid everything out logically but the problem is our Healthcare for profit model and they are padding the palms in Washington to look the other way. We could have got a public option until big insurance talked President Obama/Congress into throwing it under the bus. That really fucking pissed me off.
 
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rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
85
91
Welcome to the Conservative Paradise, good-bye to the old days when a job came with health, life insurance and a retirement fund (company paid) as perks to compete with union shops. You don't like America, get the hell out!

Or you could go to Cuba where housing, medical bills, and some food costs are taken care of. The liberal paradise.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
Or you could go to Cuba where housing, medical bills, and some food costs are taken care of. The liberal paradise.

Surely there can a balance between affordable health care, and companies making a profit?
 

Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
rudder, no.

What you fail to mention is that Cuba is still suffering from an embargo and has little marketable resources.

So comparing their entire SOL to ours and using Health Care as the delineating factor is unfair.

Why not site Sweden or Denmark. They are REALY hell-holed with their government health care and sponsored child care programs... (paying over $900 a month for mine now...)
 

Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
Surely there can a balance between affordable health care, and companies making a profit?

You would have to cap it.

You do not try and make a profit over someones health. The current rate is about 75 cents in benefits to the dollar paid.

33% profit when all you do is shuffle the money.
 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,606
166
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
65 posts and no one has thought of this yet? In the other cases mentioned in the thread, have people been denied their surgeries if they didn't pay their portion up front? If that was the case, then people wouldn't be worried about having insurance AND being bankrupted by the system - bankruptcy wouldn't be a possibility. Either you could afford your care, else you die.

Perhaps the reason they're requiring you to pay the deductible up front is that you don't have a good credit history. Your refusal to have a credit card and use credit has caused a lack of a history of being able to purchase things on credit and pay them back.

This might simply be a case of the chickens have come home to roost.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
In the other cases mentioned in the thread, have people been denied their surgeries if they didn't pay their portion up front?

I am trying to find the news article, but maybe a year ago there was lady in southeast Texas who died because her appendix ruptured.

Her doctor told her the appendix needed to be removed, but the hospital refused to admit her without paying her co-pay first. She knew she was sick for a couple of weeks before her appendix reputered, tried to get approval, and was denied access to the surgery unless she paid the co-pay up front.

The news article was on KFDM out of Beaumont, and on the evening news, but I can not find the article as of right now.

EDIT

I "think" this is the video, no speakers on my work computer right now so I can not listen tot he audio

http://www.kfdm.com/video/v/26506099001/kfdm-health-kfdm
 
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Ninjahedge

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2005
4,149
1
91
I was always able to pay after I went in.

I was billed.

I am with DrPie, the only ones that would be required to pay up front are probably credit risks... (Sorry TH)
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
I am with DrPie, the only ones that would be required to pay up front are probably credit risks... (Sorry TH)

That brings up another issue, should hospitals and doctors determine medical care based on credit rating?

Dr. john doe - you have a bad credit rating, so you do no get the treatments until we get money up front, even though you have insurance to cover the bulk of the expenses.
 

scotth501

Junior Member
Apr 13, 2006
15
0
66
I think there is a lot of confusion regarding health insurance versus healthcare. They are not interchangeable.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
texas hick, you better hope you never lose your job as your wife will never qualify for healthcare on her own. Enjoy the world you fight to keep.
 

fourty03

Member
Mar 7, 2010
66
0
66
To the OP, I feel your pain, and I prey that your wife gets the quality care you deserve and are paying for.


This may be tldr..

I am going through a similar situation as you. I am my father's caregiver. He's 57, and was diagnosed with Non-Small Cell Lung Cancer,
Stage 3 back in June 2011. He's worked since the age 14 and has never been without a job. Although he averaged about
$40,000 a year since he's worked, he's paid into FICA and Social Security... and *had* private insurance via his past employer.
One day he could not make it up the steps - and his insurance provider was Kaiser Permanente. The COPD and Lung Cancer
prevented him from working, and we do not have other family that helps me. I am his sole provider and caregiver.


I applied for Social Security, and I calculated what he paid into the system. Mind you, this is terminal for him, and the Chemotherapy is extending his life
for another year or so at best. We are hoping it stops the spreading and then it should be operable.. He well over $150,000. He will most likely get 3,000 back..
Well, he took advantage of the FMLA, and by law, his employer must provide the insurance for a max 6 months.. Well, HE does NOT qualify for
medicaid. I filed S.S. for him and got a fast track approval.. There is a mandatory 6 month waiting period for Social Security.
His payments would be okay for basic needs.. When he's qualified to recieve them.

His insurance was canceled right in the middle of Chemo. I paid all the deductables, I paid all the co pays, I even paid cash for the last
chemo treatment ($11,655). I had to make him sign a loan document so it would not be considered as a gift.
I had to stop working in order to take care of him and went through my savings and his 401k (which wasnt much).
Now, I am paying 100% out of pocket for everything, and we are on week 6 of me paying for everything out of pocket.

They canceled his pet scan because Kaiser has their own docs and their own facilities, and even though I had cash money,
they refused to give him the pet scan because he's an "inactive member" Now, I have hospice involved, and they do not cover much..
I had to take him to the ER last night, because I ran out of all the medications that help him breath and help control the pain.
The symptoms are very manageable when I have the proper meds at home. The ER treated us like shit, and I literally went off
after they treated us bad. I asked for financial assistance and it felt like I had to twist their arm.

By all means, I did not make a lot of money, neither did he, BUT we are fucking tax paying citizens who, like you OP, subsidize other's healthcare,
illegals, and the poor. We are considered poor now, but, since we aren't a protected class like the OP, we get screwed. I am on the brink of losing my
house, my personal things that I am selling, etc.. and since his doctors wont see him anymore due to the politics of the health care plan,
how the fuck do I get him meds, affordable meds? I'm running out of shit to sell, and I can only work so much in the capictiy where I can take
care of him..

I've done more politicking than learning about his illness from his doctors. Don't get me wrong, his oncologist team is great, but, when politics get in
the way (plans, policies, etc), you spend more time fighting the bureaucracy than battling the cancer. Sometimes we just are in positions that don't make sense.
I like how some people here say to you "Why are you complaining - you chose the higher deductible, you chose blah blah, you chose to work there.. You chose this .."

Really guys ? I would hate for you or your loved ones to be in a situation that is similar. I've heard the phrase "Well, that's most unfortunate sir" too many times.
Have a little bit of compassion for the OP. He is right on the money - You get married, you follow the rules, you take care of your family the
best way and follow the book to the letter, and yet, you get screwed.. No wonder why Congress has their Cadillac health plans, no wonder why the "poor" work the system. It's just a vicious cycle..
How the hell can We as a Nation go on and on with the international nation building, give billions in aid to other countries, spend monies on studying prostitutes in China..
But not take care of our own? I help strangers, I do my part. I volunteer at homeless shelters, soup kitchens, etc.. As humans, isn't this what we should do?

Bullshit like that, how do we allow it ? Here in Virginia, the Governor requested FEMA aid to flood victims - and was denied. But,
we fund shit like bankrupted energy firms (who provided vapor jobs @ over a million per job) Come on guys, the problem is not with the
OP and his Wife's health issues, it's our politicians fleecing us. By the way, my father and I are still productive members of society.
I suppose our productiveness is measured by the taxes we pay..

Texashiker, I prey and hope your wife gets better. Just take it one day at a time.
 
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