Limited W2K usability of an HD 3850

[imported_Kiwi]

As if there was so very much different between them, but all of the 8.x drivers abort in W2K and leave just the 16 color 640 by 480 screen, but Windows isn't satisfied with the generic VGA driver and pesters me at every W2K bootup.

On the PC in question, with a dual boot, W2K isn't used that much, but it would be nicer if some slightly improved driver would allow at least SVGA settings, 800 by 600 and 256 colors, maybe. I thought perhaps Omega might have something, but didn't find it there.

Anyone else ever want something functional, simple, but better than the default?

 

[PingSpike]

Look for the omega drivers, in the past, I was able to use a more current driver version then ATI offered for W2K. I think all they have done is modified the installer so that it doesn't block the drivers installation on W2K.

 

[unr3al]

Are you sure it's not a problem with the OS? I used XP Cat 8.3 drivers on my PC when I had W2K installed and they worked fine!

 

[imported_Kiwi]

I've tried 8.2, 8.4, and 8.6 Catalyst Driver sets, and they each aborted saying that they don't support the OS (W2K).

Now I'm seeking information on a Convert utility from a game player in Switzerland. He wrote it for the 7.x drivers, and it doesn't seem to work for the 8.x ones.

 

[imported_Kiwi]

Originally posted by: PingSpike
Look for the omega drivers, in the past, I was able to use a more current driver version then ATI offered for W2K. I think all they have done is modified the installer so that it doesn't block the drivers installation on W2K.

I did see that one Omega driver download didn't have the W2K capability blocked; however, it has its own problem. It is unreadable at the only resolution Windows will allow (640 by 480); there's no text showing on the various action buttons, just rows of dots.

Although it is such a new W2K install I couldn't imagine it was broken, I've reinstalled it, and SP4. It didn't change anything.

Are you sure it's not a problem with the OS? I used XP Cat 8.3 drivers on my PC when I had W2K installed and they worked fine!

The HD 3850 was sold "OEM", in a static-free plastic bag, no driver disk, no power adapters or games, just the card. Possibly some ATI partners aren't as willing to be bullied by MS. Your 8.3 version might've been different from what is more commonly available now.

 

[Slugbait]

Originally posted by: Kiwi
Possibly some ATI partners aren't as willing to be bullied by MS.

That's not it. For example, I got a new dev box at work a few months ago that came with an HD2600, and I installed 2K3 SRV on it. While it works fine with generic OS drivers, I am doomed to single-monitor mode only: there are no ATi drivers for consumer cards on Windows server, never have been. Other devs on my team have FireGL cards, so they get working drivers and dual-monitor (tho' there is some fiddling they have to do to get the cards to work properly).

Another example: you can purchase AGP flavors of the HD2600. Whether or not it works is a crapshoot, cuz ATi quit supporting them months ago, they no longer write drivers for them...they only support the PCIe version.

If memory serves correctly, eight years ago the only ATi card I had that worked with my W2K Pro box was a FireGL...otherwise, I had to drop in a Matrox. The Rage card I had could only do 640x480 at 16 colors, using generic OS drivers.

My wife still uses W2K Pro...she has my old Ti4600, I think the drivers are about a year old. Not that it matters: even if she were using a different OS that ATi supported, drivers from ATi crashes the embroidery software she uses (she used to do training/support for Wilcom, and over half the support calls they got were from people using ATi cards).

In other words, I'm not surprised that your ATi card doesn't work properly with W2K.

 

[IlllI]

Originally posted by: Slugbait

If memory serves correctly, eight years ago the only ATi card I had that worked with my W2K Pro box was a FireGL...otherwise, I had to drop in a Matrox. The Rage card I had could only do 640x480 at 16 colors, using generic OS drivers.

i had an ati radeon 9800 pro that worked flawlessly with w2k for many years

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Kiwi

Originally posted by: PingSpike
Look for the omega drivers, in the past, I was able to use a more current driver version then ATI offered for W2K. I think all they have done is modified the installer so that it doesn't block the drivers installation on W2K.

I did see that one Omega driver download didn't have the W2K capability blocked; however, it has its own problem. It is unreadable at the only resolution Windows will allow (640 by 480); there's no text showing on the various action buttons, just rows of dots.

Although it is such a new W2K install I couldn't imagine it was broken, I've reinstalled it, and SP4. It didn't change anything.

Are you sure it's not a problem with the OS? I used XP Cat 8.3 drivers on my PC when I had W2K installed and they worked fine!

The HD 3850 was sold "OEM", in a static-free plastic bag, no driver disk, no power adapters or games, just the card. Possibly some ATI partners aren't as willing to be bullied by MS. Your 8.3 version might've been different from what is more commonly available now.

I don't understand the rows of dots. I've had the "installer wizard not designed for 640x480 resolution" problem before. I usually got through it by tabbing and hitting enter, guessing where the next button was. Is it a different kind of problem?

 

[betasub]

Originally posted by: PingSpike
I don't understand the rows of dots. I've had the "installer wizard not designed for 640x480 resolution" problem before. I usually got through it by tabbing and hitting enter, guessing where the next button was. Is it a different kind of problem?

I wonder, because I struggled through a similar set of keystrokes to install the Omegas for my 2900Pro on W2K while the GUI was limited by the default OS drivers. Not nice when the message boxes are far bigger than the viewable area.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: betasub

Originally posted by: PingSpike
I don't understand the rows of dots. I've had the "installer wizard not designed for 640x480 resolution" problem before. I usually got through it by tabbing and hitting enter, guessing where the next button was. Is it a different kind of problem?

I wonder, because I struggled through a similar set of keystrokes to install the Omegas for my 2900Pro on W2K while the GUI was limited by the default OS drivers. Not nice when the message boxes are far bigger than the viewable area.

I've had the same trouble with nvidia drivers, IIRC. Its rather annoying, since its not like when installing video card drivers expecting it to show up in low color mode is an unreasonable assumption. For about any other device, it wouldn't really be much of a consideration!

I think XP lets you set 800x600 with no video drivers installed though.

 

[imported_Kiwi]

Originally posted by: PingSpike

I think XP lets you set 800x600 with no video drivers installed though.

W2K PRETENDS that it is going to allow the 800 by 600 setting, then doesn't follow through.

When I tried guessing what the buttons might be and tabbing, pressing enter, I kept getting into a series of loops from guessing wrong, and was accidentally aborting the process so often that I became far too frustrated to continue.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Kiwi

Originally posted by: PingSpike

I think XP lets you set 800x600 with no video drivers installed though.

W2K PRETENDS that it is going to allow the 800 by 600 setting, then doesn't follow through.

When I tried guessing what the buttons might be and tabbing, pressing enter, I kept getting into a series of loops from guessing wrong, and was accidentally aborting the process so often that I became far too frustrated to continue.

Pro tip: Try running the installer on another machine, then write down the key sequence required to get through the menus (number of tab pressed, etc).

Heh...it should be possible to make this work. I understand the frustration. I gave up on something last night since I was approaching the point where I started to think lifting the whole computer over my head and throwing through a window was possible solution. That usually means its time to call it quits for the night!

 

[imported_Kiwi]

I'd been putting that off (running the Omega drivers elsewhere) on the grounds that when something isn't broken, it doesn't need to be fixed, and the other PCs here (yes, there are several -- and I did discover that the PC system profiles here had finally been fixed, so I updated the systems list) had mostly been running fine (one minor item I'll take up another time).

So, I made a check of the ages of drivers, and the next-oldest W2K install didn't even have quite as new of an official driver as ATI had ever offered for that card (X850 XTP). I've scribbled down three legal pad pages' worth of action buttons, and the four misleading "Cannot Import" error messages at the end. Now it's time to go in the workshop and tackle the reluctant machine with the HD 3850!

(EDIT: an hour later. No such luck. When it said it couldn't "Import" the four things it named again, it really didn't get everything working yet, unlike the result on the tested system. But I have a possible out, if I can do it via Device manager and the needed drivers are actually in the new folders.)

{{Second Edit: not quite two hours after posting this, that computer is running with an Omerga Driver in place. From Device Driver, I pointed it to the correct folder, and found twin sets of Omega Drivers there. An earlier attempt with a slightly older driver had failed to actually get any driver working, and I'd not checked to see whether it exaggerated aboput what it did or did not "Import". The older one had HD 2*** drivers as its newest, so it had an excuse, it couldn't match to the card then.}}

P. S. -- a reminder to us all: the Safe Mode drivers may be 640 by 480, but they are better than the "base" 640 by 480 VGA drivers. In safe mode, you *CAN* make out the text on the various (Omega Driver install) action buttons, although not easily.

 

[betasub]

Thanks for the updates, Kiwi.

So despite the agony of guessing the install sequence keystrokes, the Omega drivers finally came through for you on W2K.

And nice tip re: SafeMode video vs basic VGA. :beer:

 

[PingSpike]

Ha! Duh...install the driver the old fashioned way from the device manager. Seems rather obvious now that I think about it!