Lightning & Electricity

[UILanMan]

OK, without going crazy deep..

- Had a big thunderstorm early AM today
- Power burped
- Lightning spike (or something) got through my UPS and burned out the power adapter on my ATI 9800 AIW.
- Nothing else is failing (atm), system works with another vid card

So how the hell does that work? The Y adapter that feeds power to the video card, on the white plug that's connected to the card, the 4th pin (cable color feeding that is red, other 3 are black black and yellow) has brown burn marks on the plastic. Upon boot, it was beeping twice every second with a message on the screen that stated to the effect of "make sure the power is fed to the video card."

So assuming I might get lucky and the card might still work with another adapter, how the freak can you better guard against lightning? Is unplugging the cable from the wall the only answer? Is there a device that will 100% blow itself out first and NOT allow electricity to pass past that point regardless of how big the spike is? I'm not an electrician by any means, I just spend a lot of money on hardware and if a spike can get through any one of my 5 UPSs I have in my house, well - that ain't gonna work.

Any tricks / tips from someone who's gone through this too? Or found a better way? Any help is appreciated, thanks

 

[pulsedrive]

Do you have an AVR(automatic voltage regular) UPS?

 

[UILanMan]

Honestly, I'm not sure. I didn't think to grab the model number of it before I came into work, was in a rush. They're beige APC units, I got them all about 4 years ago. I'm checking APC's site now, maybe I'll run across the right model..

 

[NuroMancer]

Monster Power bars. Hella expensive, but they have a componet that will just burn out if It can't handle the surge, and then you just take it in and get a new one. Yay for lifetime warentee.

 

[UILanMan]

Originally posted by: NuroMancer
Monster Power bars. Hella expensive, but they have a componet that will just burn out if It can't handle the surge, and then you just take it in and get a new one. Yay for lifetime warentee.

This what you mean?

Text

.. definitely expensive, but whatever it takes. I have *way* more than this invested in what's plugged into it.

Anyone have any device like this, that actually had a strike and it blew out the device, but didn't go any further (or did)? Thanks for the suggestion NuroMancer.

 

[MWink]

Originally posted by: pulsedrive
Do you have an AVR(automatic voltage regular) UPS?

AVR (Automatic Voltage RegulATION) has nothing to do with surge protection.

As for the original poster, I'd be curious to know what model UPS failed? Also were there any unprotected lines coming into the computer (cable, modem, ethernet)? I personally wouldn't trust that Monster power bar any more than an APC Surge Arrest. If you're willing to spend significant money then I'd consider the Brick Wall. I'm not 100% confident in it either, but it looks better than most I've seen. I'd suggest putting it in front of a UPS (plug the UPS into it).

Also, you could file a claim with APC to replace your damaged video card. Though I wouldn't count on them doing it, it might be worth a shot.

 

[UILanMan]

Originally posted by: MWink

Originally posted by: pulsedrive
Do you have an AVR(automatic voltage regular) UPS?

AVR (Automatic Voltage RegulATION) has nothing to do with surge protection.

As for the original poster, I'd be curious to know what model UPS failed? Also were there any unprotected lines coming into the computer (cable, modem, ethernet)? I personally wouldn't trust that Monster power bar any more than an APC Surge Arrest. If you're willing to spend significant money then I'd consider the Brick Wall. I'm not 100% confident in it either, but it looks better than most I've seen. I'd suggest putting it in front of a UPS (plug the UPS into it).

Also, you could file a claim with APC to replace your damaged video card. Though I wouldn't count on them doing it, it might be worth a shot.

Cable modem and router are both behind the same model UPS (a second one). I wish I had more information now, I might take a trip home at lunch to do some more digging - I'll repost when I know more.

That Brick Wall site is interesting, and although they claim left and right that they don't fail, I don't see any guarantee anywhere of what happens if they do. Not pointing fingers, maybe I'm just missing it. The prices on some of the models there rival some of the other things I was looking at. I doubt I'll find any site that guarantees their product against lightning strikes Thanks again for your help guys.

 

[NuroMancer]

Monster Computer PowerCenter PC 1000 - surge suppressor
Guarentee's up to 300,000 US against equipment damage, becuase they use what equates to a fuse in the power bar that will BURN OUT if it can't handle it.

Pretty sure APC Surge Arrest don't handle it the same if I can't handle the surge.
We can get some pretty wicked power surges up here and behind one of these you'll be set.
Retail on the above mentioned it 249.99 CDN, I can probally get it for 180 + tax

 

[MWink]

Originally posted by: UILanMan

Originally posted by: MWink

Originally posted by: pulsedrive
Do you have an AVR(automatic voltage regular) UPS?

AVR (Automatic Voltage RegulATION) has nothing to do with surge protection.

As for the original poster, I'd be curious to know what model UPS failed? Also were there any unprotected lines coming into the computer (cable, modem, ethernet)? I personally wouldn't trust that Monster power bar any more than an APC Surge Arrest. If you're willing to spend significant money then I'd consider the Brick Wall. I'm not 100% confident in it either, but it looks better than most I've seen. I'd suggest putting it in front of a UPS (plug the UPS into it).

Also, you could file a claim with APC to replace your damaged video card. Though I wouldn't count on them doing it, it might be worth a shot.

Cable modem and router are both behind the same model UPS (a second one). I wish I had more information now, I might take a trip home at lunch to do some more digging - I'll repost when I know more.

That Brick Wall site is interesting, and although they claim left and right that they don't fail, I don't see any guarantee anywhere of what happens if they do. Not pointing fingers, maybe I'm just missing it. The prices on some of the models there rival some of the other things I was looking at. I doubt I'll find any site that guarantees their product against lightning strikes Thanks again for your help guys.

Is the coax cable on the cable modem plugged into a surge protector/UPS? I've seen surges go through them and fry a computer. The main point with the Brick Wall is that it uses a completely different technology which I kind of think (not sure) may be better than other surge protectors. I don't care much that they don't have some ridiculous equipment protection policy, I've seen very few companies actually pay up on them. However APC's DOES guarantee against lightning damage, I've read it (though they have a million other ways out).

Monster Computer PowerCenter PC 1000 - surge suppressor
Guarentee's up to 300,000 US against equipment damage, becuase they use what equates to a fuse in the power bar that will BURN OUT if it can't handle it.

Pretty sure APC Surge Arrest don't handle it the same if I can't handle the surge.
We can get some pretty wicked power surges up here and behind one of these you'll be set.
Retail on the above mentioned it 249.99 CDN, I can probally get it for 180 + tax

Actually most APC Surge Arrests have at least 2 fuses in them designed to blow if the MOV's fail. I doubt monster has anything special besides the high price tag. I'd love to SEE what is actually in one of those Monster power centers but I'm not spending that kind of money just to take one apart for a look. I have looked inside many APC units and their Professional and Performance/Network surge protectors are pretty beefy compared to anything else I've seen.

 

[MWink]

Still waiting for an update.

 

[tiap]

I was hit by lightning a couple of month's ago. Hit a palm tree in the front yard, burned a trace in the grass to the concrete driveway, went into the car, blew out the speedometer, alternator, door chime, blew 2 tires, blew a chunk of concrete out of the driveway 12x12x4inches, blew out garage door opener, blew out 8 transformers in kitchen for halogen lites, blew dsl modem. Every monitor and tv had a psychedelic picture, but when unplugged for a few minutes seemed fine to date.
There seems to be a lot of misinformation concerning lightning. University of Florida has a test center and they have found some interesting facts thru tests. Here are a couple.
Lightning can travel hundreds of yards underground along pipes and cables
It can jump across open electrical circuit breakers
On buildings with lightning rod protection, only 20% of lightning is prevented from entering the building when hit
The temperature exceeds 50,000 degrees and rubber tires don't stop it

So, I really doubt that short of unplugging there is not much other prevention. Just consider luck an important factor.

 

[valkator]

Originally posted by: tiap
I was hit by lightning a couple of month's ago. Hit a palm tree in the front yard, burned a trace in the grass to the concrete driveway, went into the car, blew out the speedometer, alternator, door chime, blew 2 tires, blew a chunk of concrete out of the driveway 12x12x4inches, blew out garage door opener, blew out 8 transformers in kitchen for halogen lites, blew dsl modem. Every monitor and tv had a psychedelic picture, but when unplugged for a few minutes seemed fine to date.
There seems to be a lot of misinformation concerning lightning. University of Florida has a test center and they have found some interesting facts thru tests. Here are a couple.
Lightning can travel hundreds of yards underground along pipes and cables
It can jump across open electrical circuit breakers
On buildings with lightning rod protection, only 20% of lightning is prevented from entering the building when hit
The temperature exceeds 50,000 degrees and rubber tires don't stop it

So, I really doubt that short of unplugging there is not much other prevention. Just consider luck an important factor.

You know IT departments in many companies always are trying to find a way to prevent lightning from owning their servers and they use 1000s and 1000s of dollars to try to prevent that. So do you think going to best buy and getting a surge protector for 100 bucks really going to stop lightning. I THINK NOT.

So tiap is pretty much right and just hope for being lucky

 

[xgsound]

To the OP, Mwink sounds like he has a good grasp of the lightning protection possibilities. There is no "absolute" protection that I'm aware of.

Power conditioning and lightning protection are indeed two seperate issues with intersecting definitions. The cheaper solutions usually provide some level of protection for only one of the issues. If you find a solution that provides both protections at some level to the power lines and all other incoming (cable, ethernet, telephone) lines , that is all that is practical for most people.

The prices for the most effective equipment rises dramatically and often involves dedicated wiring to earth ground.


Jim