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Libertarians - question about your ideology

oreagan

Senior member
Jul 8, 2002
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Okay, I was reading up on libertarian positions. I like an awful lot of their positions, BUT education is probably the most important issue for me and the Libertarian Party page had this to say about it:

To transfer control of education from bureaucrats to parents and teachers and encourage alternatives to the public school monopoly, the Libertarian Party would:

* Support a true market in education -- one in which parents and students would not be stuck with a bad local school, because they could choose another.

* Implement measures such as tax credits so that parents will have the financial ability to choose among schools.

* Provide financial incentives for businesses to help fund schools and for individuals to support students other than their own children.

* Eliminate the U.S. Department of Education, which spends billions on education and educates no one. The growth of this agency and its numerous regulations is a major reason for runaway costs in American schools.
Am I reading this wrong, or is this basically saying the libertarian solution is school vouchers for everyone? Also, hasn't the first of those been accomplished by the No Child Left Behind Act?
 

zephyrprime

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,506
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It doesn't sound to me like they're for vouchers. They're basically for no involvement of the gov in education. Their solution is private school for everyone.
 
May 16, 2000
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The Libertarians I've worked with (campaigned with them for a few years now) have been either extremists (complete elimination of government in schools including removing the public school system and replacing it with privatized schools) or moderates (removing federal dept of education, creation of alternative privatized school systems with compensation for those not eating from the public table).

One of the most unfortunate things about the Libertarian party is that by their charter they are a fairly extremist group, but are currently made up of about 50-75% moderates who just share many of the same general goals. The opposition plays up the extremist aspect to discredit us, and we're torn apart by differing views internally. I really see a party split coming up soon, which is kinda too bad.
 

JellyBaby

Diamond Member
Apr 21, 2000
9,159
1
81
Originally posted by: zephyrprime
It doesn't sound to me like they're for vouchers. They're basically for no involvement of the gov in education. Their solution is private school for everyone.
This is incorrect and is typical of the views of libbys from those who haven't bothered to do even a remedial study of them (sorry). Just the federal government gets out. Like the original poster said they simply extort money from the states, waste some of it, pocket a bit then give it back to them with strings attached in the form of regulation. They don't teach kids.

Libertarians would not attempt to remove state governments from education, though they might toss out the idea. States rights allow them to fund education in accordance to the rule of our first laws put forth in the Consty.

They're not in favor of vouchers, I think, because they feel private schools getting them would be over-regulated and controlled by government.
 

Rogue9

Member
Mar 20, 2003
65
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Originally posted by: JellyBaby
Originally posted by: zephyrprime
It doesn't sound to me like they're for vouchers. They're basically for no involvement of the gov in education. Their solution is private school for everyone.
This is incorrect and is typical of the views of libbys from those who haven't bothered to do even a remedial study of them (sorry). Just the federal government gets out. Like the original poster said they simply extort money from the states, waste some of it, pocket a bit then give it back to them with strings attached in the form of regulation. They don't teach kids.

Libertarians would not attempt to remove state governments from education, though they might toss out the idea. States rights allow them to fund education in accordance to the rule of our first laws put forth in the Consty.

They're not in favor of vouchers, I think, because they feel private schools getting them would be over-regulated and controlled by government.
JellyBaby's post seems right to me.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
66,641
3,448
126
How are people going to solve the education problem when they don't know what it means to know anything. Might as well have the blind paint pictures.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
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On the way into the Post Office today I noticed a sign about two feet off the ground... it said "No dogs allowed except seeing eye dogs" Now I wondered about this... do seeing eye dogs know it is ok or do other dogs read and seeing eye ones just know to follow the lead?
And then I saw braile writing on the bank's drive up ATM... I get really confused at all this..
 

B00ne

Platinum Member
May 21, 2001
2,168
1
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Originally posted by: oreagan
Okay, I was reading up on libertarian positions. I like an awful lot of their positions, BUT education is probably the most important issue for me and the Libertarian Party page had this to say about it:

To transfer control of education from bureaucrats to parents and teachers and encourage alternatives to the public school monopoly, the Libertarian Party would:

* Support a true market in education -- one in which parents and students would not be stuck with a bad local school, because they could choose another.

* Implement measures such as tax credits so that parents will have the financial ability to choose among schools.

* Provide financial incentives for businesses to help fund schools and for individuals to support students other than their own children.

* Eliminate the U.S. Department of Education, which spends billions on education and educates no one. The growth of this agency and its numerous regulations is a major reason for runaway costs in American schools.
Am I reading this wrong, or is this basically saying the libertarian solution is school vouchers for everyone? Also, hasn't the first of those been accomplished by the No Child Left Behind Act?
Hmmm dunno if that like vouchers for everyone, to my socialist european mind ;) it sounds more like: Make sure only families with good financial situation get apropriate education, Make sure kids from poor families stay where they are, so in the end there is enough socially weak ppl ignorant enough to serve the better off for little compensation.

Privatizing (all) school means highly unequal education distribution - that is bound to create conditions as in Midevil times - designed to keep the status quo: Rich rule, poor serve
 

Dudd

Platinum Member
Aug 3, 2001
2,865
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Originally posted by: B00ne
Privatizing (all) school means highly unequal education distribution - that is bound to create conditions as in Midevil times - designed to keep the status quo: Rich rule, poor serve
Couldn't be any worse than we have now. Rich, suburban public school have high graduation rates, high test scores, high college placement. Poor urban schools have 3/4 of their students drop out before ever graduating. I don't see how anything could make that worse.

 

HombrePequeno

Diamond Member
Mar 7, 2001
4,657
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Originally posted by: Ferocious
I really really dislike extremist parties.
There are freaks in every party. The Libertarian party is no more extreme than the Democratic or Republican parties.
 

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